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Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: April 29th, 2020, 4:48 pm
by shugs
Image


Howdy, cowboys! :cowbow: Buckle up, it's the Western Challenge! :guns:

Goal
Watch as many westerns as you can.

Rules
- Each feature film (over 40 minutes) counts as one entry.
- 60 minutes of short films count as one entry.
- A total of 60 minutes of TV Episodes count as a point
- The miniseries rule applies (episodes over 40 mins count as one entry, otherwise add episodes up to 60 minutes to count as one entry). It also applies to movie serials, like The Oregon Trail, for example.
- Rewatches are allowed.
- Post the years of your watches.
- Do not edit posts to add new watches, just create a new one.

Official Lists
BBFI's 100 Westerns
The Spaghetti Western Database's Essential Top 50 Films
IMDb's Western Top 50

Non-Official Lists
Westerns on ICM official lists
How The West Was Shot
100 Western Masterpieces
Sky Movies' Top 100 Westerns
Sol's Alternative Westerns (under 250 checks)
iCM Forum's Favourite Western Movies

Cowboys
RankingCowboyScore
1blueboybob50
2AssonFire42
3psychotronicbeatnik36
4sol33
5jdidaco30
6flavo500024
7Obgeoff20
7RogerTheMovieManiac8820
9PUNQ19
10AB53717
11jeroeno15
12Lonewolf20039
12blocho9
12cinephage9
12shugs9
16ororama7
17VincentPrice5
17maxwelldeux5
17vortexsurfer5
20burneyfan4
21Melvelet3
21allisoncm3
21connordenney3
21hurluberlu3
21mathiasa3
26frbrown2
26klaus782
26mightysparks2
29lineuphere1
29sebby1

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: April 29th, 2020, 7:51 pm
by VincentPrice
oh yeah

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: April 29th, 2020, 9:41 pm
by Lonewolf2003
Howdy partner, I'm ready for this, already checked a room in the saloon and saddled my horses. :cowbow:

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: April 30th, 2020, 2:33 pm
by OldAle1
Almost certainly will be my main challenge for the month. Giddee-up little dogie!

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: April 30th, 2020, 7:51 pm
by allisoncm
Will be in for a few.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 1st, 2020, 5:54 pm
by mathiasa
1. Broken Arrow (1950). The worst fate a female native or a sub-race female can have in a hollywood movie is to engage with a white American, especially if he‘s the main actor. Usually, they will be killed 10 minutes after making love to their spouse. What‘s most bewildering to me, these race segregation iron movie laws were still in place after Nazi-Germany got defeated and everything they stood for was evil and unnecessary for everybody to see. brutal & ugly. 5.8/10

Planning to watch some curry westerns and aussie westerns ss well.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 1st, 2020, 9:33 pm
by maxwelldeux
1. Al este del oeste (1984, Spain)

Comments in Comedy challenge, but recommended! A triple.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 1st, 2020, 11:04 pm
by blueboybob
1. Two Rode Together (1961)
2. Colorado Territory (1949)
3. The Long Riders (1980)
4. The Tracker (2002)
5. Apache (1954)
6. Dodge City (1939)

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 1st, 2020, 11:45 pm
by VincentPrice
1. Gunmen from Laredo-1959: 6/10

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 2nd, 2020, 4:28 am
by sol
1. One-Eyed Jacks (1961)

Image

While the seaside locations give this a different feel to the average western, Brando's directing work is not especially remarkable here and clocking in at close to two and a half hours, this feels a bit long and drawn out. It is a full half-hour in before Brando learns about his old companion's whereabouts and while Karl Malden is solid throughout with oodles of tension between him and Brando in their every scene, far too much time is spent on romance.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 2nd, 2020, 9:59 am
by sol
How the West Was WonShow
1. One-Eyed Jacks (1961)

2. West and Soda (1965)

Image

While the animation style is pretty basic here with the characters often moving against still backgrounds, there are some striking images/memorable sequences that simply would not play out the same in live action (his liquor glasses repeatedly being shot at whenever he tries to drink). The film is, however, only populated by characters that vary between annoying and flat. Two drunks are especially irksome with one of them constantly giggling.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 2nd, 2020, 10:29 am
by AssonFire
I'll throw my Stetson into the ring, haven't had a good Western binge for a while.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 2nd, 2020, 3:54 pm
by sol
How the West Was WonShow
1. One-Eyed Jacks (1961)
2. West and Soda (1965)

3. Rancho Notorious (1952)

Image

Disparaged by Lang himself in Godard's Contempt, this is not one of his better efforts, but there is still much of interest. Arthur Kennedy is effective in the lead role and his befriending of Mel Ferrer's master criminal with ulterior motives is well-handled, as is his initiation to the safe haven. Kennedy seems to forget his objective though for significant stretches in the second half with an undercooked romance and Marlene Dietrich strutting her stuff.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 2nd, 2020, 11:27 pm
by PUNQ
Haven't been doing any challenges this year as they haven't fit my agenda for classic films (just finished 1945). The 1940s challenge was even removed this year so even those that benefited my viewing habits are gone. I have saved up a little bit for my annual western binge in May. I'm unsure how competitive I'll be, but at least it's an excuse to do the old westerns that has piled-up lately, probable some 1946 ones and maybe do the few modern westerns that's popped up the last year.


1. Desert Valley (1926, Scott R. Dunlap) - 4/10
--- Cool to see Buck Jones do a little cowboy slapstick!


2. Wild Beauty (1927, Henry MacRae) - 4/10
--- Ah, Rex the Wonder Horse! One of the big western stars of the 20s and 30s. A horse. Stunning horse, who got to shine in the wild. However can't pretend it isn't difficult to get into a animal hero in a production like this. But I guess they handled it alright for a lower-end western. I definitely prefer No Man's Law (1927).


3. King of the Rodeo (1929, Henry MacRae) - 4/10
--- Fun-time rodeo western Hoot Gibson. Kinda a messy production, but doesn't stop it from being entertaining combining comedy and action the way it does. This came out in 1929, but only as a silent, which should make it among the last batch of westerns to be produced strictly as a silent picture.


4. The Utah Kid (1930, Richard Thorpe) - 3/10
--- To think we could've had Boris Karloff the western henchman, spoken in the same breath as poverty row mainstays Slim Whitaker, Earl Dwire and Charles King, instead of as The Master of Horror. Luckily for Karloff he got the Frankenstein gig a year later and his legacy grew from there. This was a low budget western starring Rex Lease. Alright for the standard of the time and the small studio making this, but ultimately nothing to brag about. Karloff is barely in it, and he certainly didn't get to showcase his acting skills. One best forgotten for his part.


5. My Pal, the King (1932, Kurt Neumann) - 4/10
--- A different kind of western from Tom Mix. He's touring with his traveling circus in a unnamed European kingdom where a child kid is heavily fascinated by his wild west show. The kid? A very young Mickey Rooney! The film was one of Mix's big successes and I could see this being popular with the younger audience especially. A good time, but wouldn't exactly call it a great movie. More a special attraction of sorts.


6. The Texas Bad Man (1932, Edward Laemmle) - 4/10
--- More a routine western from Tom Mix where he goes undercover to deal with the bad men. He handles himself well, and makes sure the this is a serviceable cowboy flick. Other than that, it doesn't excel beyond what's expected from one of the top screen cowboys at the time.


7. Thunder Mountain (1935, David Howard) - 3/10
--- Like with so many of George O'Brien B-westerns, the pacing becomes an issue. They always elevate his charm, but at the expense of everything else, so his films ends up dragging a lot. And that's the case with Thunder Mountain (1935) as well. And it doesn't help the plot is as routine as it gets.


8. The Hawk (1935, Edward Dmytryk) - 2/10
--- We all got to start somewhere and this is where Edward Dmytryk got his directorial debut. A super cheap western done by independent producers who were below even the established poverty row, and starring some guy called Bruce Lane, who only got a handful credited parts during his brief career. So needless to say this was bad. Thankfully Dmytryk went on to do much better things.


9. Orphan of the Pecos (1937, Sam Katzman) - 2/10
--- One of those boring Tom Tyler westerns...


10. Son of Roaring Dan (1940, Ford Beebe) - 4/10
--- Solid Johnny Mack Brown western. Mixes the comedy well into the plot. Could have needed a little more action to make things a more exciting, but it was fine enough for a Universal B-effort.


11. The Masked Rider (1941, Ford Beebe) - 4/10
--- Johnny Mack Brown & Fuzzy Knight at it again. This time south of the border for some fun and action. Typical B-western stuff. Nothing original, but they put on a decent effort making it entertaining.


-

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 3rd, 2020, 2:46 am
by blocho
Glad to have you back in the challenges, Punq! I feel like I learn more about the history of American film from your write-ups than anything else on this forum.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 3rd, 2020, 9:18 am
by sol
How the West Was WonShow
1. One-Eyed Jacks (1961)
2. West and Soda (1965)
3. Rancho Notorious (1952)

4. The Ruthless Four (1968)

Image

Van Heflin is well here and his initial chase and shootout inside a dark mine shaft is very intense. This tension lessens as Heflin recruits replacement partners, but tension mounts again once the foursome reach the mine, with all concerned uncertain if the others will kill them out of greed - or a grudge as we gradually learn more about them. If no The Treasure of the Sierra Madre, this is still encapsulating with Klaus Kinski solid as always.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 3rd, 2020, 11:32 am
by ororama
1. Red River (1948) 127 min.
2. Wagon Tracks (1919) * 69 min.

I didn't get Red River when I saw it over 30 years ago, I think in part because I was generally more interested in plot than character and the plot is pretty basic, and in part because I had already seen enough westerns that the elements of the cattle drive seemed commonplace, and I didn't realize that this movie was a significant source for the westerns that followed it.

I always enjoy William S. Hart's westerns, and although his character in Wagon Tracks is, unusually, a bit sappy, he gets the job done.

*First time viewing.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 3rd, 2020, 12:15 pm
by flavo5000
1. E poi lo chiamarono il magnifico a.k.a. Man of the East (1972)
2. Uninvited (1993)

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 3rd, 2020, 12:30 pm
by cinephage
01. Lonesome Cowboys, by Andy Warhol (1967) 0/10

I don't understand what people see in this lazy film. My vacation home movies are way superior to this... No acting, no writing, poor sound, cinematography and editing... There is no intelligence whatsoever in this. Only the intention to enjoy one's celebrity with a few junkie friends and have fun. If people agree to watch this afterwards, even better !!

02. Bad Company, by Robert Benton (1972) 8/10

I really enjoyed this film, and found Jeff Bridges' character quite refreshing. Also, it's a good idea to show conscription as it was during the civil war in 1973, to modern audiences...

03. The Wonderful Country, by Robert Parrish (1959) 9/10

Great, great script. This one will get into my 500<400 list for this year's poll.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 3rd, 2020, 3:48 pm
by allisoncm
1. Montana Belle (1952, Allan Dwan) 5.5/10 This was definitely one of my leftovers from last month. I like Jane Russell and she sings a few numbers.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 3rd, 2020, 6:34 pm
by hurluberlu
1. Viva Maria! (Louis Malle, 1965) 7-

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 3rd, 2020, 8:51 pm
by allisoncm
SpoilerShow
1. Montana Belle (1952, Allan Dwan) 5.5/10 This was definitely one of my leftovers from last month. I like Jane Russell and she sings a few numbers.
2. Passion (1954, Allan Dwan) 5.5/10

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 12:28 am
by blocho
1. Brimstone (2016)
A revenge Western with some supernatural touches. It's got plenty of style, and halfway through I was convinced I was watching a great movie. That feeling dissipated by the end. For one thing, it's very repetitive. For another, I feel like the filmmaker failed to provide a story that was strong enough to carry the themes he wants to explore--the dangers of religious authority and the misogyny so common to human societies. Those are intriguing and worthy themes. But the story I saw was mainly an elaboration of how many times a character could be abused. At some point, brutality alone, especially when repeated many times, loses its meaning.

2. Legends of the Fall (1994)
This movie feels emotions very very hard and wants you to feel them too, even harder. But it lacks even the smallest trace of authenticity, and the result is a horrid concoction of ersatz sentimental signals. Legends of the Fall starts poorly, quickly becomes bad, and only gets worse. It is dreadful and completely unaware of its faults. It packs enough into the first 45 minutes to fill most other movies, and then goes on for another 90, so what seems like only a bad movie in its first half becomes increasingly painful to watch. Even the best actors struggle with terrible scripts, so there's not much that Anthony Hopkins can do to salvage this movie, but I should note that Brad Pitt, whose acting I normally enjoy, founders badly. There's a scene half an hour in that pretty much explains what's going wrong here ...
SpoilerShow
Pitt's character is weeping (or rather, not weeping, because crying is something Pitt can't seem to do in this movie) over the body of his dead brother. He then takes out a knife, cuts his brother's heart out of his corpse, paints his face with blood from that heart, and then wanders off to scalp a few dozen German soldiers.
As with Brimstone, the filmmakers want to use brutality to produce feeling, but they fail to recognize that any extreme human experience has to feel genuine if it is to affect the viewer. When brutality feels manufactured instead of natural, the result is not tragedy but comedy. This movie, packed full of big emotions intensely felt, becomes farcical.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 2:15 am
by VincentPrice
2. The Silver Whip-1953: 7/10
SpoilerShow
1. Gunmen from Laredo-1959: 6/10

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 2:32 am
by blueboybob
7. Gunfight at the O.K. Corral (1957)
8. Lonesome Cowboys (1968)
9. Major Dundee (1965)

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 2:36 am
by AB537
1. Silverado (Lawrence Kasdan, 1985) 6/10

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 2:44 am
by lineuphere
1. From Hell to Texas (1958) 9/10

Image

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 10:20 am
by mathiasa
2. The Paleface (1948)

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 12:21 pm
by mightysparks
1. The Tall T (1957) 6/10
Films WatchedShow
1. The Tall T (1957) 6/10

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 2:55 pm
by sol
How the West Was WonShow
1. One-Eyed Jacks (1961)
2. West and Soda (1965)
3. Rancho Notorious (1952)
4. The Ruthless Four (1968)

5. Man from Del Rio (1956)

Image

Shot in stark black and white by the formidable Stanley Cortez, this looks gorgeous and Anthony Quinn does well playing an increasingly conflicted protagonist. Not quite enough of the film though is dedicated to his identity dilemma and the possible ulterior motives of the townsfolk who want him as their sheriff. Instead, we get an abundance of scenes of Quinn clashing with Katy Jurado as a rather dull love interest. Quinn is very solid though.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 3:02 pm
by shugs
1. Seven Brides for Seven Brothers (Stanley Donen, 1954) - 7/10

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 4th, 2020, 5:35 pm
by hurluberlu
2. Sholay (Ramesh Sippy, 1975) 6

Those with loaded guns and those who dig.Show
1. Viva Maria! (Louis Malle, 1965) 7-

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 5th, 2020, 8:02 am
by mathiasa
3. Fort Apache (1948). The more I watch Ford's movies, the more I realize he's the only "great" director who does not have a single masterpiece. His movies, so far I've seen them, are all slightly above average (at best). I wondered how such a guy could have so big a career in Hollywood.

A short research confirmed by doubts, he was a statist, always willing to appease to the powers in charge. In the 30s he supported the crazy, proto-fascist New Deal regulation and started his own Hollywood unionization.
Then later, he had a questionable praxis concerning black lists, red baiting etc.
And further, he went on to mindlessly support Nixon and the unethical, brutal war in Vietnam, insulting all the heroes who refused to go there. He even helped making a pro Vietnam propaganda film, despite already knowing, that the war in Vietnam was for nothing. In this way, he may have helped innocent young men to needlessly die in a yellow land. The death of these boys, his fellow countrymen, was less to him, than his own career, which by that time, was almost already dead anyway. (I recommend watching The Post by Spielberg, where US president put their own career over the lifes of uncountable you men). Wow, what a man...

Now, this is explains why this abomination of real hero got support from "ruling class" - but why was he so beloved with some parts of the audience? In my mind, this has a) to do with the "George W. Bush-Effect". His movies were so average (like Bush's face), that every wanna be director or every wanna be somebody could fantasize about having success himself in movie industry. and b) with the kind of propaganda and lack of education a typical American was exposed to. It's sad, and it's time to bury John Ford and his "old virtues" (killing, torturing, burning innocent foreigners, sucking the military's cock and what not) should be put a rest. But not necessarily his movies, because as I've said, they have some some kind of small value by being sometimes better than the average, as in this movie: 5.4/10

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 5th, 2020, 12:22 pm
by sol
How the West Was WonShow
1. One-Eyed Jacks (1961)
2. West and Soda (1965)
3. Rancho Notorious (1952)
4. The Ruthless Four (1968)
5. Man from Del Rio (1956)

6. Silver Lode (1954)

Image

The basic story is highly dynamic here, with the townsfolk here gradually going from doubting the marshals to doubting their friend. At the same time, there is a constant overhanging uncertainty over how just how guilty he is. The ending is a bit too pat, resolving the intriguing ambiguity regarding his guilt and burdened by some moralising speeches. For the most part though, this is an intense and involving look at swaying sympathies and distrust.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 5th, 2020, 12:33 pm
by flavo5000
3. Cahill U.S. Marshal (1973)
4. Bucking Broadway (1917)
Headin' on down that dusty trailShow
1. E poi lo chiamarono il magnifico a.k.a. Man of the East (1972)
2. Uninvited (1993)
3. Cahill U.S. Marshal (1973)
4. Bucking Broadway (1917)

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 5th, 2020, 3:18 pm
by ororama
mathiasa wrote:
May 5th, 2020, 8:02 am
3. Fort Apache (1948). The more I watch Ford's movies, the more I realize he's the only "great" director who does not have a single masterpiece. His movies, so far I've seen them, are all slightly above average (at best). I wondered how such a guy could have so big a career in Hollywood.

A short research confirmed by doubts, he was a statist, always willing to appease to the powers in charge. In the 30s he supported the crazy, proto-fascist New Deal regulation and started his own Hollywood unionization.
Then later, he had a questionable praxis concerning black lists, red baiting etc.
And further, he went on to mindlessly support Nixon and the unethical, brutal war in Vietnam, insulting all the heroes who refused to go there. He even helped making a pro Vietnam propaganda film, despite already knowing, that the war in Vietnam was for nothing. In this way, he may have helped innocent young men to needlessly die in a yellow land. The death of these boys, his fellow countrymen, was less to him, than his own career, which by that time, was almost already dead anyway. (I recommend watching The Post by Spielberg, where US president put their own career over the lifes of uncountable you men). Wow, what a man...

Now, this is explains why this abomination of real hero got support from "ruling class" - but why was he so beloved with some parts of the audience? In my mind, this has a) to do with the "George W. Bush-Effect". His movies were so average (like Bush's face), that every wanna be director or every wanna be somebody could fantasize about having success himself in movie industry. and b) with the kind of propaganda and lack of education a typical American was exposed to. It's sad, and it's time to bury John Ford and his "old virtues" (killing, torturingdgburning innocent foreigners, sucking the military's cock and what not) should be put a rest. But not necessarily his movies, because as I've said, they have some some kind of small value by being sometimes better than the average, as in this movie: 5.4/10
I could hardly disagree more.

Ford had a number of masterpieces, but it's easy to miss that because his direction is no frills. An interesting take on his films is that they can be viewed as a cumulative story, Ford's view of American history from the early days of the American revolution in Drums Along the Mohawk to the present. He made westerns, so his primary focus was on Manifest Destiny, which ends with his lament for (and celebration of) the closing of the west in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance. He mourns the end of the classic cowboy, the violent Doniphon, but acknowledges that Stoddard, who is bringing law to the frontier, is the future. Jimmy Stewart gets the girl, not John Wayne.

Your view that the New Deal was proto-fascist would not find a great deal of agreement in the US. Most Americans, when they think of it, regard it (inaccurately) as socialist, although I think that most Republicans, past and present, regard it as quasi-communist or just communist. I assume that Ford was a conservative, although he did make two of the most leftist Hollywood movies of the 1940s (The Grapes of Wrath and How Green Was My Valley). I have chosen to avoid too much inquiry into the politics of Hollywood, but I doubt that Ford knew that the Vietnam War was for nothing. I don't think that McNamara or Kissinger briefed him that they knew that they couldn't win but were trying to create the conditions for the best withdrawal agreement that they could get by killing as many Vietnamese as possible.

One of my favorite movie stories (I think told by Bogdanovich) is about the Director's Guild meeting in which Cecil B. DeMille proposed that all members be required to swear an oath of loyalty to the United States. Ford got up and said, "My name is John Ford. I make westerns," and then explained why DeMille's proposal was un-American, and then the proposal was voted down.

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 5th, 2020, 3:28 pm
by blueboybob
10. Ramrod (1947)
11. The Unforgiven (1960)
12. Yellow Sky (1948)
13. The Big Gundown (1966)
14. The Mercenary (1968)

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 5th, 2020, 3:59 pm
by mathiasa
ororama wrote:
May 5th, 2020, 3:18 pm
mathiasa wrote:
May 5th, 2020, 8:02 am
3. Fort Apache (1948). The more I watch Ford's movies, the more I realize he's the only "great" director who does not have a single masterpiece. His movies, so far I've seen them, are all slightly above average (at best). I wondered how such a guy could have so big a career in Hollywood.

A short research confirmed by doubts, he was a statist, always willing to appease to the powers in charge. In the 30s he supported the crazy, proto-fascist New Deal regulation and started his own Hollywood unionization.
Then later, he had a questionable praxis concerning black lists, red baiting etc.
And further, he went on to mindlessly support Nixon and the unethical, brutal war in Vietnam, insulting all the heroes who refused to go there. He even helped making a pro Vietnam propaganda film, despite already knowing, that the war in Vietnam was for nothing. In this way, he may have helped innocent young men to needlessly die in a yellow land. The death of these boys, his fellow countrymen, was less to him, than his own career, which by that time, was almost already dead anyway. (I recommend watching The Post by Spielberg, where US president put their own career over the lifes of uncountable you men). Wow, what a man...

Now, this is explains why this abomination of real hero got support from "ruling class" - but why was he so beloved with some parts of the audience? In my mind, this has a) to do with the "George W. Bush-Effect". His movies were so average (like Bush's face), that every wanna be director or every wanna be somebody could fantasize about having success himself in movie industry. and b) with the kind of propaganda and lack of education a typical American was exposed to. It's sad, and it's time to bury John Ford and his "old virtues" (killing, torturingdgburning innocent foreigners, sucking the military's cock and what not) should be put a rest. But not necessarily his movies, because as I've said, they have some some kind of small value by being sometimes better than the average, as in this movie: 5.4/10
I could hardly disagree more.

Ford had a number of masterpieces, but it's easy to miss that because his direction is no frills. An interesting take on his films is that they can be viewed as a cumulative story, Ford's view of American history from the early days of the American revolution in Drums Along the Mohawk to the present. He made westerns, so his primary focus was on Manifest Destiny, which ends with his lament for (and celebration of) the closing of the west in The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance. He mourns the end of the classic cowboy, the violent Doniphon, but acknowledges that Stoddard, who is bringing law to the frontier, is the future. Jimmy Stewart gets the girl, not John Wayne.

Your view that the New Deal was proto-fascist would not find a great deal of agreement in the US. Most Americans, when they think of it, regard it (inaccurately) as socialist, although I think that most Republicans, past and present, regard it as quasi-communist or just communist. I assume that Ford was a conservative, although he did make two of the most leftist Hollywood movies of the 1940s (The Grapes of Wrath and How Green Was My Valley). I have chosen to avoid too much inquiry into the politics of Hollywood, but I doubt that Ford knew that the Vietnam War was for nothing. I don't think that McNamara or Kissinger briefed him that they knew that they couldn't win but were trying to create the conditions for the best withdrawal agreement that they could get by killing as many Vietnamese as possible.

One of my favorite movie stories (I think told by Bogdanovich) is about the Director's Guild meeting in which Cecil B. DeMille proposed that all members be required to swear an oath of loyalty to the United States. Ford got up and said, "My name is John Ford. I make westerns," and then explained why DeMille's proposal was un-American, and then the proposal was voted down.
Oh, there's no need for McNamara or Kissinger to have let him in on the papers that later became famous as the pentagon papers. Ford was in Vietnam himself, and could drew his own conclusion. (From the article sourced below: After two trips to Vietnam in the fall of 1968 and the spring of 1969, Ford wrote an old friend in Maine, “What’s the war all about? Damned if I know. I haven’t the slightest idea what we’re doing there.”) By this time, every intelligent person and their mother knew already the war was nonsense (libertarians and pacifists knew this even a decade earlier!)

I'm not not looking for "a great deal of agreement in the US". I'm looking for the the facts. The terms Proto-fascist, socialist, communist all mean about the same (in this specific situation), the intervenionalist new deal system and its prize fixing scheme on an unprecedented scale in US history. To suggest making a semantic distinction here is simply a play of words.

About the quality of the movies we have to agree to disagree, there's simply no reason to argue wether any of his movies come close to something like l'atalante or les enfants du paradis.
Tomorrow I watch The Informer (The 1935 movie, fitting the 1935 poll - not the Videoclip to Snow‘s US #1 hit). Who knows, maybe this will change my attitude? I always keep an open mind, as I think this important.

Here‘s an interesting article about Ford: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.latime ... amp%3Dtrue

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 5th, 2020, 5:26 pm
by blocho
These are some epic rants. The line below got me giggling ...
mathiasa wrote:
May 5th, 2020, 8:02 am
the crazy, proto-fascist New Deal regulation and started his own Hollywood unionization.
... but it was this part that made me laugh out loud.
mathiasa wrote:
May 5th, 2020, 8:02 am
killing, torturing, burning innocent foreigners, sucking the military's cock and what not

Re: Western Challenge (Official, May 2020)

Posted: May 5th, 2020, 6:31 pm
by AssonFire
1. In Old Oklahoma (Albert S. Rogell / 1943) 6/10
A solid but unspectacular tale of John Wayne as a rugged underdog prospecting for oil while navigating a love triangle and business interests with Albert Dekker's uncompromising tycoon. I wonder if the theme of of the unsympathetic capitalist oil magnate pitted against the collectivist poor farmers and Indians would have got made 10 years later, still less with Wayne as the head of the collective. The fact that it was written by women shows in the romantic subplot, which doesn't always blend convincingly with the main story.
2. The Great K & A Train Robbery (Lewis Seiler / 1926) 6/10
Entertaining silent with Tom Mix as a Lone Ranger-like hero foiling robberies on trains passing through the spectacular gorges of the Colorado Rockies. Plenty of impressive in-camera stunts, for which I'd say Mix's horse deserves at least equal credit.
3. Dakota (Joseph Kane / 1945) 5/10