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World Cup, Season 3, Match SF-A: Greece vs USA (Mar 10th)

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joachimt
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#41

Post by joachimt »

Four votes in a row for Greece. Too late for a return? Probably.

Image Oi voskoi: 7
Image The Pawnbroker: 17
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Angel Glez
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#42

Post by Angel Glez »

1. Oi voskoi
2. The Pawnbroker

Because I vastly prefer the other Lumet of 1964.
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#43

Post by blocho »

1. The Pawnbroker
2. Oi Voskoi
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PeacefulAnarchy
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#44

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

1. The Pawnbroker
2. Oi Voskoi

But it was quite close, Oi Voskoi was a really good choice for Greece.
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#45

Post by tarr »

1. The Pawnbroker
2. Oi Voskoi
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Fergenaprido
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#46

Post by Fergenaprido »

1. The Pawnbroker - 7.8
2. Oi voskoi [Thanos and Despina] [Shepherds of Calamity] - 6.4

I watched the Greek film four years ago after someone one the forum promoted it (I forget who and why), but I didn't really care for it. After watching The Pawnbroker, I'm confident that a rewatch wouldn't change anything either. Greece has been very hit-or-miss for me in the World Cup (maybe I'll post stats about that at the end).

I like what Lonewolf wrote on Criticker: "Very strong character study about a Holocaust survivor. I haven't seen many ones in which the survivor is such a bitter but also tragic man. Therefor making him a very human character. The way his character is given depth and history by using small and longer cuts to flashbacks deserves all the praise its getting. It really shows how memory works, giving little quick flashes by associations. Rod Steiger is phenomenal." That pretty much sums it up for me. Other characters/actors are weaker, but Steiger is solid in this, and the cinematography/editing is probably my favourite aspect of the film.

I'm surprised that people, 15 years after the the war ended, didn't know what the concentration camp tattoos were. I guess Holocaust information is so widespread nowadays, but it still seems shocking to me. I also thought the employee would have known a bit more about his boss's history (especially given his "you people" comment - which, by the way, had the best response I've ever heard; great moment). And I was surprised to hear that this was the first (major) film to show a Holocaust victim from their perspective. Given how ubiquitous WWII and Shoah films are in the last 30-40 years, it's odd think they were much more reticent at showing this onscreen earlier (though perhaps I shouldn't be surprised).
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#47

Post by Lonewolf2003 »

:) Nice to see people read and liked my review on Criticker.
I didn't know this was the first (major) film to show a Holocaust victim from their perspective either. Things indeed have changed since then.
The Greek was a FotW long ago
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#48

Post by Mate_cosido »

1. The Pawnbroker
2. Oi Voskoi

if i'd known this was already decided i probably wouldn't have participated, but the US film was good
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#49

Post by joachimt »

Yeah, the difference is pretty clear. 30 votes. Even if the rest of the voters will vote Greece, the gap is still very big.

Image Oi voskoi: 8
Image The Pawnbroker: 22
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Fergenaprido
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#50

Post by Fergenaprido »

Lonewolf2003 wrote: March 10th, 2019, 3:37 pm :) Nice to see people read and liked my review on Criticker.
I didn't know this was the first (major) film to show a Holocaust victim from their perspective either. Things indeed have changed since then.
The Greek was a FotW long ago
I have you as one of my Kumpels (along with a number of other forum peeps) so I see them whenever view a film. :)

I ready that somewhere about being the first film, but now I can't remember where it was (even though it was only a week ago).
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#51

Post by pitchorneirda »

Fergenaprido wrote: March 10th, 2019, 3:07 pm 1. The Pawnbroker - 7.8
2. Oi voskoi [Thanos and Despina] [Shepherds of Calamity] - 6.4

I watched the Greek film four years ago after someone one the forum promoted it (I forget who and why), but I didn't really care for it. After watching The Pawnbroker, I'm confident that a rewatch wouldn't change anything either. Greece has been very hit-or-miss for me in the World Cup (maybe I'll post stats about that at the end).

I like what Lonewolf wrote on Criticker: "Very strong character study about a Holocaust survivor. I haven't seen many ones in which the survivor is such a bitter but also tragic man. Therefor making him a very human character. The way his character is given depth and history by using small and longer cuts to flashbacks deserves all the praise its getting. It really shows how memory works, giving little quick flashes by associations. Rod Steiger is phenomenal." That pretty much sums it up for me. Other characters/actors are weaker, but Steiger is solid in this, and the cinematography/editing is probably my favourite aspect of the film.

I'm surprised that people, 15 years after the the war ended, didn't know what the concentration camp tattoos were. I guess Holocaust information is so widespread nowadays, but it still seems shocking to me. I also thought the employee would have known a bit more about his boss's history (especially given his "you people" comment - which, by the way, had the best response I've ever heard; great moment). And I was surprised to hear that this was the first (major) film to show a Holocaust victim from their perspective. Given how ubiquitous WWII and Shoah films are in the last 30-40 years, it's odd think they were much more reticent at showing this onscreen earlier (though perhaps I shouldn't be surprised).
To have the explanation why information about the Holocaust was not widespread at all before the mid sixties, I advise you to read Peter Novick's book "The Holocaust in American Life", you'll have all the history of the publicity of the atrocities from 1945 to 2000
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
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#52

Post by metaller »

1. The Pawnbroker
2. Oi Voskoi

The Pawnbroker was just the kind of bleak filmmaking I "like" from the 60s.
As is Oi Voskoi. I had seen this when it was promoted or part of a challenge here (I think it was FotW), gave it a rewwatch, but somehow liked it a bit better back then.
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#53

Post by Lonewolf2003 »

Fergenaprido wrote: March 10th, 2019, 4:13 pm
Lonewolf2003 wrote: March 10th, 2019, 3:37 pm :) Nice to see people read and liked my review on Criticker.
I didn't know this was the first (major) film to show a Holocaust victim from their perspective either. Things indeed have changed since then.
The Greek was a FotW long ago
I have you as one of my Kumpels (along with a number of other forum peeps) so I see them whenever view a film. :)

I ready that somewhere about being the first film, but now I can't remember where it was (even though it was only a week ago).
I have you too. I also read reviews by my Kumpels too when rating a movie. I like Peacefull's reviews a lot always.
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#54

Post by edward5 »

1. The Pawnbroker. 6.5/10
2. Oi Voskoi. 6/10
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#55

Post by Fergenaprido »

Lonewolf2003 wrote: March 11th, 2019, 12:19 am
Fergenaprido wrote: March 10th, 2019, 4:13 pm
Lonewolf2003 wrote: March 10th, 2019, 3:37 pm :) Nice to see people read and liked my review on Criticker.
I didn't know this was the first (major) film to show a Holocaust victim from their perspective either. Things indeed have changed since then.
The Greek was a FotW long ago
I have you as one of my Kumpels (along with a number of other forum peeps) so I see them whenever view a film. :)

I ready that somewhere about being the first film, but now I can't remember where it was (even though it was only a week ago).
I have you too. I also read reviews by my Kumpels too when rating a movie. I like Peacefull's reviews a lot always.
I think you, Peaceful, and PUNQ are the ones who write the most reviews of my Kumpels. I would, but I find that my words falter when I try to explain a rating for a film, so I just don't bother, (though I do occasionally write a review on letterboxd, but it's usually more about the circumstances of seeing the film, or the incidental memories it evokes, than about the actual film itself).
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#56

Post by Renegade »

1. The Pawnbroker
2. Oi Voskoi
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funkybusiness
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#57

Post by funkybusiness »

1. The Pawnbroker
2. Oi Voskoi

despite a 30-odd vote lead, it's pretty close between the two films for me

thanks, nominators
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#58

Post by joachimt »

funkybusiness wrote: March 11th, 2019, 7:50 am despite a 30-odd vote lead, it's pretty close between the two films for me
It seems you're not the only one who feels that way, but somehow most close votes end up in an advantage for The Pawnbroker. The score makes it seem that it was an extremely easy victory, but to me it doesn't feel like that.

Image Oi voskoi: 8
Image The Pawnbroker: 26

39 minutes left.
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#59

Post by funkybusiness »

yeah, exactly
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#60

Post by mjf314 »

1. The Pawnbroker
2. Oi Voskoi
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#61

Post by joachimt »

Deadline over. Final result:

Image Oi voskoi: 8
Image The Pawnbroker: 27

Congratulations to filmbantha. Also thanks to tommy_leazaq and to the 35 people who voted this match.
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#62

Post by Nathan Treadway »

Poor Greece. Looking at that score, you'd think everyone thought the film sucked...
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