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ICM Forum's 500 <400 2021 [RESULTS] Sponsored by Torgo

500<400, Favourite 1001 movies, Doubling the Canon, Film World Cup and many other votes
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St. Gloede
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#761

Post by St. Gloede »

Note and tie-in with the Letterboxd vs. IMDb vs. ICM conversation.

Stats:

The Eve of Ivan Kupalo
ICM: 150
IMDb: 334
Letterboxd: 490

A Spring for the Thirsty
ICM: 103
IMDb: 302
Letterboxd: 432

A Story of the Forest: Mavka
ICM: 67
IMDb: 183
Letterboxd: 304

Swan Lake: The Zone
ICM: 32
IMDb: 165
Letterboxd: 122

The White Bird Marked with Black
ICM: 31
IMDb: 383
Letterboxd: 186

I wonder what on earth happened to The White Bird Marked with Black.
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Dimitris Psachos
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#762

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

St. Gloede wrote: October 12th, 2021, 10:38 am
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 10:07 am
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 9th, 2021, 11:29 pm #91(⇧39, #130) Vechir na Ivana Kupala (1968)
[The Eve of Ivan Kupalo]

Directed by: Yuri Ilyenko
(541.22 Pts, 14 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–0–5
History: 9113090701131122114051891←NA
ICheckMovies: 150 Checks , 26 Favourites , 2 Official lists
List of Voters:
joachimt (12) [85.86 Pts]
Leopardi (14) [83.51 Pts]
jeroeno (22) [74.74 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (42) [56.64 Pts]
filmbantha (48) [52.12 Pts]
clemmetarey (53) [48.63 Pts]
beavis (72) [37.37 Pts]
jlfitz (81) [32.99 Pts]
klaus78 (97) [26.43 Pts]
hurluberlu (103) [24.32 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (161) [10.88 Pts]
Melvelet (196) [6.7 Pts]
Ivan0716 (NA) [1.03 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (5133) [0 Pts]
I can see this being future "mafia", though it's way more visually chaotic than your casual Tarkovsky or Ruiz / it remains one of my last 5 year major discoveries and, evidently, I must've helped it a lot by conducting a list this year :circle:
The Eve of Ivan Kupalo is a film I liked a lot, but indeed ended up slightly too all-over-the-place to love on my first go (will likely rewatch it at some point), but Ilyenko is a great director and his most recognized films, i.e. this and A Spring for the Thirsty get frequently referenced. Can we take a moment to mourn the fact that the most seen film by one of the best Soviet era directors only has 150 checks ... It really boggles my mind. A Spring For the Thirsty is barely over 100, and my favorite Ilyenko, Swan Lake: The Zone, is at 32 checks. Now that one I knew was underappreciated, but great films from his prime, like The White Bird Marked with Black is at 31 checks and his epic The Legend of Princess Olga is at 17 ... Wow.

Edit: My 2nd favourite, Defying Everybody is also just at 17 checks ... 105 views on LB at least, but still surprisingly low.
I think it comes down to both availability (as others users have mentioned in previous posts) and a interest/priority balance. At Soviet directors, even lesser seen like Khutsiev and Muratova, have acquired an audience with lists and polls like these (disregarding the presence of popular "mafia" comedies, especially back in ICM's early days of yore :D :whistling: ), compared to regions south from the eastern bloc like Turkey or Balkan countries (shocked that Kakogiannis' -who's supposedly as famous as Kalatozov- sole 400+ film is still Zorba :facepalm: )
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St. Gloede
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#763

Post by St. Gloede »

Yes, great point, though at least Khutsiev and Muratova all have a few films over 150 checks, which is Ilyenko's best. Muratova only has one film over 400 checks though, Aesthetic Syndrome at 480, while Khutsiev has none. I suppose most people stop at Tarkovsky and Eisenstein ...
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#764

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

St. Gloede wrote: October 12th, 2021, 11:14 am Yes, great point, though at least Khutsiev and Muratova all have a few films over 150 checks, which is Ilyenko's best. Muratova only has one film over 400 checks though, Aesthetic Syndrome at 480, while Khutsiev has none. I suppose most people stop at Tarkovsky and Eisenstein ...
You've got to give credits to that Russian Guild list, which is a primary reason for Khutsiev's extra checks (and in rarer instances, the secondary top 1000 from TSPDT, reminding Doubling the Canon's "shedding light" mindset) and for films of equally great individuals too, such are Chukhray and German. I've always felt it's one of the site's most underrated terms (along with several other country-type lists), but that may have to do with the "evil empire" ( :lol: ) spark it generated through dislikes for...selective films :cowbow:

(Muratova's Syndrome, by the way, passed the 400th mark thanks to its noticeable 1001 Films Before you Die etc -permanent?- inclusion, a reason, additionally, I believe, for its unfairly high number of dislikes...)
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#765

Post by cinewest »

Speaking of Russians, Does the name Sergei Loznitsa ring a bell? He's one of the best filmmakers of the 21st century (he's made 23 films since 1999), and yet none of his films have more than 250 checks.

Ok, he's actually from Belarus and now considers himself Ukrainian, but in general I find that few Russian filmmakers post Tarkovsky get discussed here (Sokurov, a bit, I guess), and yet I have seen a bunch of good ones by different directors (many of them under 400 checks) in the past 20 years. In fact, 6 of my top 100 (only one of which has shown up so far) are Russian films made in the last 20 years.
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#766

Post by Onderhond »

cinewest wrote: October 12th, 2021, 12:54 pm Russian filmmakers post Tarkovsky get discussed here (Sokurov, a bit, I guess)
He's definitely a distant third. I'm a big fan of Pavel Khvaleev, but no way this forum knows who that is :D
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#767

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

cinewest wrote: October 12th, 2021, 12:54 pm I find that few Russian filmmakers post Tarkovsky get discussed here (Sokurov, a bit, I guess), and yet I have seen a bunch of good ones by different directors (many of them under 400 checks) in the past 20 years.
The Russians are admittedly lucky to have a couple well-loved-by-the-public filmmakers i.e. apart from Eisenstein/Tarkovsky (okay, not so much Eisenstein, younger generations usually reject anything b&w and/or silent), Mikhalkov and, recently, Zvyagintsev, do have their share of fans (Parajanov too, when counting Soviet era), so I suspect most ARE aware of Russian, filmmaking delights, but not explicitly their directors, as was the case with Shepitko, perhaps even with Klimov's Come and See's example where the film's popularity surpasses the director's name. :unsure:

I actually feel sorry for countries of eastern and southern regions, like Hungary's and Greece's, whose, ahem..."representatives" (for better or for worse), two from each country aka Jancso/Tarr and Angelopoulos/Lanthimos respectively, haven't received much love even from hardcore, Criterion-based cinephiles :think:
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#768

Post by Onderhond »

Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:13 pm Lanthimos ... haven't received much love even from hardcore, Criterion-based cinephiles
Lanthimos is pretty popular, no? I mean, even I have seen 4 (5 if you count his entry in Venice 70) of his films.
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#769

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#23(⇧16, #39) O fovos (1966)
[The Fear]

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Directed by: Kostas Manoussakis
(873.72 Pts, 23 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 1–1–7
History: 2339364439989896832643NA←NA
ICheckMovies: 93 Checks , 16 Favourites , 2 Official lists
List of Voters:
Mifune (1)[100 Pts]
Ivan0716 (20) [76.84 Pts]
Lilarcor (21) [75.79 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (22) [74.74 Pts]
zuma (26) [70.71 Pts]
filmbantha (27) [69.74 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (42) [56.64 Pts]
Gorro (54) [47.96 Pts]
klaus78 (65) [41.18 Pts]
DudeLanez (NA) [39.02 Pts]
zhangalan (76) [35.36 Pts]
flavo5000 (NA) [34.75 Pts]
toro913 (NA) [33.78 Pts]
joachimt (86) [30.78 Pts]
sushantv10 (98) [26.06 Pts]
Nathan Treadway (128) [17.19 Pts]
lineuphere (162) [10.73 Pts]
72aicm (171) [9.47 Pts]
Fergenaprido (172) [9.34 Pts]
burneyfan (221) [4.74 Pts]
Smoover (NA) [4.66 Pts]
OldAle1 (NA) [4.22 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (3573) [0 Pts]
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#770

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

Onderhond wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:19 pm
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:13 pm Lanthimos ... haven't received much love even from hardcore, Criterion-based cinephiles
Lanthimos is pretty popular, no? I mean, even I have seen 4 (5 if you count his entry in Venice 70) of his films.
Unfortunately, he is <_<
I guess I was going for how controversial all those still are (even, yes, Lanthimos and his mainstream entries) when facing against the Russian...giants, heh. (I'm only discussing the cinephile-lover context here, otherwise...there are a-plenty cinema viewers who praise Lanthimos, Haneke and Kubrick as their sole deities :folded:
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#771

Post by Onderhond »

Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:23 pm I guess I was going for how controversial all those still are (even, yes, Lanthimos and his mainstream entries) when facing against the Russian...giants, heh.
Might be just the circles you frequent. I don't see many cinephiles casually discussing the Russian giants (besides Tarkovksy maybe) that often. Looking at the conversation above, Lanthimos was pretty much the only name I recognized on sight :D
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#772

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

Onderhond wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:29 pm
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:23 pm I guess I was going for how controversial all those still are (even, yes, Lanthimos and his mainstream entries) when facing against the Russian...giants, heh.
Might be just the circles you frequent. I don't see many cinephiles casually discussing the Russian giants (besides Tarkovksy maybe) that often. Looking at the conversation above, Lanthimos was pretty much the only name I recognized on sight :D
In that case, Zvyagintsev is more popular than Eisenstein and almost all silent directors (Russians, Soviets or not / except Chaplin, duh), but, again, that wasn't my point B)

If "modern" (aka hipster) cinephiles of today recognize mostly Lanthimos-type of directors, then it's a good thing all those hidden gems (especially the ones sticking around for a number of years now) are still......hidden :thumbsup:
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#773

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#22(⇧31, #53) La muerte de un burócrata (1966)
[Death of a Bureaucrat]

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Directed by: Tomás Gutiérrez Alea
(877.92 Pts, 20 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–1–8
History: 22531341051887402854441080←1289
ICheckMovies: 282 Checks , 36 Favourites , 5 Official lists
List of Voters:
clemmetarey (8)[90.75 Pts]
Ebbywebby (11) [87.06 Pts]
BaalMan (22) [74.74 Pts]
Fergenaprido (29) [67.83 Pts]
filmbantha (36) [61.56 Pts]
Nopros (44) [55.1 Pts]
brokenface (45) [54.34 Pts]
Wonderful Rainbow (45) [54.34 Pts]
Hunziker (NA) [44.74 Pts]
blocho (NA) [41.4 Pts]
Odradek (73) [36.86 Pts]
marienbad (77) [34.87 Pts]
flavo5000 (NA) [34.75 Pts]
amechsner (NA) [34.05 Pts]
joachimt (93) [27.93 Pts]
burneyfan (99) [25.7 Pts]
cayado-coro (120) [19.21 Pts]
dinah (NA) [16.66 Pts]
jeroeno (133) [16.04 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (874) [0 Pts]
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#774

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 9th, 2021, 7:57 pm #107(⇧225, #332) Kyônetsu no kisetsu (1960)
[The Warped Ones]

Directed by: Koreyoshi Kurahara
(510.02 Pts, 14 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 1–1–5
History: 1073324018169218434566232874←959
ICheckMovies: 307 Checks , 26 Favourites , 3 Official lists
List of Voters:
Traveller (1)[100 Pts]
Melvelet (22) [74.74 Pts]
Odradek (33) [64.17 Pts]
RolandKirkSunglasses (NA) [49.63 Pts]
Nopros (53) [48.63 Pts]
Mifune (77) [34.87 Pts]
flavo5000 (NA) [34.75 Pts]
pitchorneirda (NA) [33.21 Pts]
peeptoad (NA) [27.59 Pts]
prodigalgodson (100) [25.35 Pts]
Armoreska (204) [6 Pts]
lineuphere (212) [5.37 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (224) [4.54 Pts]
72aicm (NA) [1.16 Pts]
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 9th, 2021, 9:53 pm #96(⇧73, #169) Gunki hatameku motoni (1972)
[Under the Flag of the Rising Sun]

Directed by: Kinji Fukasaku
(532.29 Pts, 18 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–0–2
History: 96169222377351391396559596←1893
ICheckMovies: 176 Checks , 25 Favourites , 3 Official lists
List of Voters:
Lonewolf2003 (25) [71.7 Pts]
burneyfan (40) [58.24 Pts]
PeacefulAnarchy (52) [49.31 Pts]
Melvelet (54) [47.96 Pts]
joachimt (55) [47.3 Pts]
Gorro (57) [46.01 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (62) [42.93 Pts]
blocho (NA) [41.4 Pts]
brokenface (67) [40.05 Pts]
DudeLanez (NA) [39.02 Pts]
Traveller (97) [26.43 Pts]
jeroeno (178) [8.6 Pts]
Mysterious Dude (221) [4.74 Pts]
jeff_v (231) [4.12 Pts]
Armoreska (271) [2.37 Pts]
72aicm (NA) [1.16 Pts]
St. Gloede (347) [0.83 Pts]
Leopardi (480) [0.13 Pts]
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 9th, 2021, 10:39 pm #93(⇧212, #305) Akai satsui (1964)
[Intentions of Murder]

Directed by: Shôhei Imamura
(537.87 Pts, 13 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–2–5
History: 9330539938168658961023764850←1862
ICheckMovies: 392 Checks , 27 Favourites , 4 Official lists
List of Voters:
BaalMan (3)[97.27 Pts]
Mifune (8)[90.75 Pts]
russa03 (17) [80.11 Pts]
Timec (47) [52.85 Pts]
RolandKirkSunglasses (NA) [49.63 Pts]
DudeLanez (NA) [39.02 Pts]
Knaldskalle (69) [38.96 Pts]
Gorro (105) [23.65 Pts]
Melvelet (112) [21.46 Pts]
joachimt (114) [20.88 Pts]
1SO (125) [17.92 Pts]
Mysterious Dude (216) [5.08 Pts]
perceval (425) [0.28 Pts]
Three Japanese forces of nature! I have a weaker spot for Imamura's deranged characters and illicit or, alternatively, obsessive motives (I forgot adding it, since it's probably its final year, but I'm sure another Imamura will come up), but Warped Ones has that provocative and nasty...intention beneath its juicy cinematography, so it may become equally popular throughout the year.

While I haven't watched much Fukasaku, Under the Flag provides an explosive performance by Sachiko Hidari, next to tightly-written supporting appearance, contrasting wonderful anti-war arguments to the banality of evil. I'll definitely push it more next time around!
Last edited by Dimitris Psachos on October 12th, 2021, 1:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#775

Post by 72aicm »

Will the list be done today or are you saving top ten for tomorrow PA?
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#776

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

72aicm wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:43 pm Will the list be done today or are you saving top ten for tomorrow PA?
Right now the plan is today, to finish before midnight in Europe.
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#777

Post by RolandKirkSunglasses »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:47 pm Right now the plan is today, to finish before midnight in Europe.
Reykjavik or Magnetogorsk?
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#778

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

RolandKirkSunglasses wrote: October 12th, 2021, 2:21 pm
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:47 pm Right now the plan is today, to finish before midnight in Europe.
Reykjavik or Magnetogorsk?
CET, 7.5 hours from now
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#779

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#21(⇧50, #71) Krysar (1986)
[The Pied Piper]

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Directed by: Jirí Barta
(883.32 Pts, 23 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–3–9
History: 2171771014557472272091NA←NA
ICheckMovies: 285 Checks , 44 Favourites , 2 Official lists
List of Voters:
jlfitz (7)[92.02 Pts]
ChrisReynolds (8)[90.75 Pts]
sortile9io (9)[89.5 Pts]
Torgo (17) [80.11 Pts]
RolandKirkSunglasses (18) [79 Pts]
cayh (27) [69.74 Pts]
Mysterious Dude (32) [65.07 Pts]
matthewscott8 (44) [55.1 Pts]
Odradek (48) [52.12 Pts]
Marazmatique (64) [41.75 Pts]
flavo5000 (NA) [34.75 Pts]
AdamH (85) [31.21 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (88) [29.94 Pts]
mightysparks (103) [24.32 Pts]
russa03 (115) [20.59 Pts]
hurluberlu (152) [12.33 Pts]
ckfilm88 (183) [8.02 Pts]
sebby (223) [4.61 Pts]
TraverseTown (323) [1.15 Pts]
sol (356) [0.73 Pts]
burneyfan (382) [0.51 Pts]
zomgmouse (730) [0 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (1094) [0 Pts]
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#780

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#20(⇧36, #56) Tiexi qu (2002)
[Tie Xi Qu: West of the Tracks]

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Directed by: Bing Wang
(886.5 Pts, 18 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 1–5–8
History: 205666719167241237902←508
ICheckMovies: 357 Checks , 42 Favourites , 9 Official lists
List of Voters:
murnaunosferatu (1)[100 Pts]
prodigalgodson (2)[98.62 Pts]
Gershwin (7)[92.02 Pts]
Traveller (9)[89.5 Pts]
Knaldskalle (10)[88.27 Pts]
perceval (13) [84.67 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (28) [68.78 Pts]
Smoover (29) [67.83 Pts]
jeroeno (72) [37.37 Pts]
mjf314 (76) [35.36 Pts]
klaus78 (82) [32.53 Pts]
insomnius (NA) [28.15 Pts]
hurluberlu (95) [27.17 Pts]
AHALE80 (NA) [14.72 Pts]
joachimt (183) [8.02 Pts]
cinephage (191) [7.18 Pts]
cayh (215) [5.15 Pts]
72aicm (NA) [1.16 Pts]
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#781

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#19(⇩1, #18) Midareru (1964)
[Yearning]

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Directed by: Mikio Naruse
(887.21 Pts, 22 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–1–11
History: 191876205143131589572←308
ICheckMovies: 374 Checks , 55 Favourites , 4 Official lists
List of Voters:
murnaunosferatu (8)[90.75 Pts]
Cinepolis (22) [74.74 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (25) [71.7 Pts]
Gorro (26) [70.71 Pts]
Melvelet (36) [61.56 Pts]
Traveller (37) [60.71 Pts]
zhangalan (39) [59.05 Pts]
klaus78 (48) [52.12 Pts]
Smoover (50) [50.7 Pts]
AdamH (50) [50.7 Pts]
DudeLanez (NA) [39.02 Pts]
sushantv10 (74) [36.35 Pts]
perceval (79) [33.92 Pts]
pitchorneirda (NA) [33.21 Pts]
zuma (108) [22.69 Pts]
Ivan0716 (NA) [20.62 Pts]
cayado-coro (122) [18.69 Pts]
Lilarcor (154) [11.99 Pts]
Gordon_Gekko (161) [10.88 Pts]
jeff_v (165) [10.29 Pts]
Fergenaprido (225) [4.48 Pts]
rnilsson19 (272) [2.34 Pts]
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#782

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#18(⇧3, #21) Szerelem (1971)
[Love]

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Directed by: Károly Makk
(898.29 Pts, 24 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 1–4–8
History: 1821301514298689241←475
ICheckMovies: 399 Checks , 53 Favourites , 6 Official lists
List of Voters:
russa03 (1)[100 Pts]
Timec (4)[95.93 Pts]
Gershwin (5)[94.61 Pts]
Gorro (7)[92.02 Pts]
Ivan0716 (24) [72.7 Pts]
Marazmatique (24) [72.7 Pts]
zhangalan (26) [70.71 Pts]
rokp (34) [63.29 Pts]
toro913 (NA) [33.78 Pts]
Mifune (81) [32.99 Pts]
jeroeno (88) [29.94 Pts]
burneyfan (100) [25.35 Pts]
RogerTheMovieManiac169 (NA) [23.76 Pts]
joachimt (110) [22.07 Pts]
Traveller (128) [17.19 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (157) [11.5 Pts]
sushantv10 (163) [10.58 Pts]
PeacefulAnarchy (177) [8.72 Pts]
Lonewolf2003 (NA) [7.65 Pts]
klaus78 (205) [5.91 Pts]
Leopardi (237) [3.79 Pts]
hurluberlu (319) [1.22 Pts]
Lilarcor (320) [1.2 Pts]
jlfitz (360) [0.69 Pts]
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#783

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#17(⇧5, #22) Doa al karawan (1959)
[The Curlew's Cry]

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Directed by: Henry Barakat
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jvv (NA) [65.2 Pts]
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Opio (113) [21.17 Pts]
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#784

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#16(⇧8, #24) Året gjennom Børfjord (1991)
[A Year Along the Abandoned Road]

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Directed by: Morten Skallerud
(927.15 Pts, 24 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 2–3–8
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Fergenaprido (7)[92.02 Pts]
72aicm (13) [84.67 Pts]
Nopros (13) [84.67 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (26) [70.71 Pts]
ChrisReynolds (41) [57.43 Pts]
jeroeno (45) [54.34 Pts]
AdamH (53) [48.63 Pts]
Hunziker (NA) [44.74 Pts]
Marazmatique (63) [42.34 Pts]
Cippenham (87) [30.35 Pts]
Odradek (88) [29.94 Pts]
Nathan Treadway (108) [22.69 Pts]
cayh (116) [20.31 Pts]
Lonewolf2003 (118) [19.75 Pts]
Traveller (164) [10.44 Pts]
Torgo (206) [5.83 Pts]
Lilarcor (229) [4.24 Pts]
Jimi Antiloop (260) [2.76 Pts]
mathiasa (366) [0.63 Pts]
joachimt (407) [0.36 Pts]
Leopardi (422) [0.29 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (5137) [0 Pts]
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#785

Post by Ebbywebby »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 12th, 2021, 3:58 pm #16(⇧8, #24) Året gjennom Børfjord (1991)
[A Year Along the Abandoned Road]


Directed by: Morten Skallerud
(927.15 Pts, 24 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 2–3–8
History: 16241577680725846←NA
ICheckMovies: 276 Checks , 39 Favourites , 1 Official list
List of Voters:
Armoreska (1)[100 Pts]
jonas2k (1)[100 Pts]
Fergenaprido (7)[92.02 Pts]
72aicm (13) [84.67 Pts]
Nopros (13) [84.67 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (26) [70.71 Pts]
ChrisReynolds (41) [57.43 Pts]
jeroeno (45) [54.34 Pts]
AdamH (53) [48.63 Pts]
Hunziker (NA) [44.74 Pts]
Marazmatique (63) [42.34 Pts]
Cippenham (87) [30.35 Pts]
Odradek (88) [29.94 Pts]
Nathan Treadway (108) [22.69 Pts]
cayh (116) [20.31 Pts]
Lonewolf2003 (118) [19.75 Pts]
Traveller (164) [10.44 Pts]
Torgo (206) [5.83 Pts]
Lilarcor (229) [4.24 Pts]
Jimi Antiloop (260) [2.76 Pts]
mathiasa (366) [0.63 Pts]
joachimt (407) [0.36 Pts]
Leopardi (422) [0.29 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (5137) [0 Pts]
Awesome, another jump upward!
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#786

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

Yeah, I'll sound like a broken record, but that Skallerud short (out of soooo many, brilliant shorts in need of promotion) still going at it, whilst i.e. James Benning's experimental land-scapes are struggling in lower positions, is, sorry, laughable :facepalm:

(I know, I know, end of rant, because one mate here mentioned about a Monty-whatever deity, so I can safely assume this year-long mania with Roads, Muddy Rivers and Carriages to Vienna is his doing too, hmmm)

I am curious -for real now- to check the annual results of each Hidden Gems poll, I don't recall whether any resourceful soul has gathered all previous versions (and I'm not saying it just to rant against a Sundays and Cybele vs Muddy River repetition, I'll probably "rant" on my picks too :P )
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#787

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#15(⇧8, #23) The Incident (1967)
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AB537 (46) [53.59 Pts]
72aicm (51) [50 Pts]
AdamH (55) [47.3 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (61) [43.53 Pts]
blocho (NA) [41.4 Pts]
sushantv10 (69) [38.96 Pts]
Mifune (76) [35.36 Pts]
flavo5000 (NA) [34.75 Pts]
toro913 (NA) [33.78 Pts]
Smoover (84) [31.64 Pts]
RogerTheMovieManiac170 (NA) [23.76 Pts]
Mysterious Dude (111) [21.76 Pts]
joachimt (117) [20.03 Pts]
Opio (124) [18.17 Pts]
Gorro (127) [17.43 Pts]
St. Gloede (127) [17.43 Pts]
Melvelet (138) [14.97 Pts]
Traveller (165) [10.29 Pts]
Lilarcor (170) [9.61 Pts]
Armoreska (193) [6.98 Pts]
jeroeno (234) [3.96 Pts]
sebby (257) [2.88 Pts]
Ivan0716 (NA) [1.03 Pts]
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#788

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#14(⇧22, #36) Die Parallelstrasse (1962)
[The Parallel Street]

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Jimi Antiloop (8)[90.75 Pts]
rokp (13) [84.67 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (18) [79 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (24) [72.7 Pts]
Dolwphin (29) [67.83 Pts]
matthewscott8 (34) [63.29 Pts]
Traveller (36) [61.56 Pts]
mjf314 (44) [55.1 Pts]
Wonderful Rainbow (57) [46.01 Pts]
dinah (NA) [16.66 Pts]
hurluberlu (155) [11.83 Pts]
klaus78 (226) [4.42 Pts]
OldAle1 (NA) [4.22 Pts]
perceval (443) [0.22 Pts]
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#789

Post by Torgo »

Honestly chuckled @Ebby's edit tho
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 12th, 2021, 4:27 pm #15(⇧8, #23) The Incident (1967)
Directed by: Larry Peerce
(928.72 Pts, 29 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–3–5
History: 15232467500357181517947535←NA
ICheckMovies: 265 Checks , 32 Favourites , 2 Official lists
What a jump this made from 500 on .. :blink:
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#790

Post by cinewest »

Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:13 pm
cinewest wrote: October 12th, 2021, 12:54 pm I find that few Russian filmmakers post Tarkovsky get discussed here (Sokurov, a bit, I guess), and yet I have seen a bunch of good ones by different directors (many of them under 400 checks) in the past 20 years.
The Russians are admittedly lucky to have a couple well-loved-by-the-public filmmakers i.e. apart from Eisenstein/Tarkovsky (okay, not so much Eisenstein, younger generations usually reject anything b&w and/or silent), Mikhalkov and, recently, Zvyagintsev, do have their share of fans (Parajanov too, when counting Soviet era), so I suspect most ARE aware of Russian, filmmaking delights, but not explicitly their directors, as was the case with Shepitko, perhaps even with Klimov's Come and See's example where the film's popularity surpasses the director's name. :unsure:

I actually feel sorry for countries of eastern and southern regions, like Hungary's and Greece's, whose, ahem..."representatives" (for better or for worse), two from each country aka Jancso/Tarr and Angelopoulos/Lanthimos respectively, haven't received much love even from hardcore, Criterion-based cinephiles :think:
I really like Zvyagintsev (The Return seems to be the only film of his people are familiar with), but there are quite a few other great Russian filmmakers than those you have mentioned, and If we are going to talk about countries or regions of the world that are almost completely overlooked by most cinephiles, consider all of Latin America.

While this part of the world may not have produced the same amount of indelible cinema, or noteworthy film movements historically that other more celebrated film countries have, it has been particularly strong this century, yet very few filmmakers from Latin America are given much attention, here. (I have 27 Latin American films on my submission list of 190, and 11 from Russia / Soviet Union).

As for Greek cinema, it seems like there is a small but active mafia, at least for this poll. And as I am not familiar with most of them, I hope to track a few down before next year.
Last edited by cinewest on October 12th, 2021, 5:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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#791

Post by Torgo »

Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:13 pm
cinewest wrote: October 12th, 2021, 12:54 pm I find that few Russian filmmakers post Tarkovsky get discussed here (Sokurov, a bit, I guess), and yet I have seen a bunch of good ones by different directors (many of them under 400 checks) in the past 20 years.
The Russians are admittedly lucky to have a couple well-loved-by-the-public filmmakers i.e. apart from Eisenstein/Tarkovsky (okay, not so much Eisenstein, younger generations usually reject anything b&w and/or silent), Mikhalkov and, recently, Zvyagintsev, do have their share of fans (Parajanov too, when counting Soviet era), so I suspect most ARE aware of Russian, filmmaking delights, but not explicitly their directors(...)
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:34 pm If "modern" (aka hipster) cinephiles of today recognize mostly Lanthimos-type of directors, then it's a good thing all those hidden gems (especially the ones sticking around for a number of years now) are still......hidden :thumbsup:
Well what now. Do you want some more visibility or not? ;) Or save those gems for the most hidden of <400 cinephile circles?
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#792

Post by flavo5000 »

Torgo wrote: October 12th, 2021, 4:56 pm
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:13 pm
cinewest wrote: October 12th, 2021, 12:54 pm I find that few Russian filmmakers post Tarkovsky get discussed here (Sokurov, a bit, I guess), and yet I have seen a bunch of good ones by different directors (many of them under 400 checks) in the past 20 years.
The Russians are admittedly lucky to have a couple well-loved-by-the-public filmmakers i.e. apart from Eisenstein/Tarkovsky (okay, not so much Eisenstein, younger generations usually reject anything b&w and/or silent), Mikhalkov and, recently, Zvyagintsev, do have their share of fans (Parajanov too, when counting Soviet era), so I suspect most ARE aware of Russian, filmmaking delights, but not explicitly their directors(...)
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:34 pm If "modern" (aka hipster) cinephiles of today recognize mostly Lanthimos-type of directors, then it's a good thing all those hidden gems (especially the ones sticking around for a number of years now) are still......hidden :thumbsup:
Well what now. Do you want some more visibility or not? ;) Or save those gems for the most hidden of <400 cinephile circles?
Ah, the hipster's paradox. You want to uncover hidden gems for people to discover but you don't want people to consume it and have it be popular. It can apply to movies, music, paintings or any other media format that hipsters flock to.
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#793

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

#13(⇧13, #26) Az én XX. századom (1989)
[My 20th Century]

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(1058.61 Pts, 26 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–4–9
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cinewest (10)[88.27 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (20) [76.84 Pts]
russa03 (20) [76.84 Pts]
Opio (22) [74.74 Pts]
jvv (NA) [65.2 Pts]
mjf314 (38) [59.87 Pts]
rokp (48) [52.12 Pts]
toromash (58) [45.38 Pts]
Gershwin (62) [42.93 Pts]
jeroeno (65) [41.18 Pts]
amechsner (NA) [34.05 Pts]
DulceDoes (119) [19.48 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (130) [16.72 Pts]
dinah (NA) [16.66 Pts]
St. Gloede (133) [16.04 Pts]
joachimt (144) [13.77 Pts]
Odradek (147) [13.21 Pts]
Ebbywebby (150) [12.67 Pts]
cayh (168) [9.88 Pts]
filmbantha (239) [3.69 Pts]
klaus78 (253) [3.04 Pts]
ckfilm88 (268) [2.47 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (6099) [0 Pts]
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#794

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

cinewest wrote: October 12th, 2021, 4:53 pm
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:13 pm
cinewest wrote: October 12th, 2021, 12:54 pm I find that few Russian filmmakers post Tarkovsky get discussed here (Sokurov, a bit, I guess), and yet I have seen a bunch of good ones by different directors (many of them under 400 checks) in the past 20 years.
The Russians are admittedly lucky to have a couple well-loved-by-the-public filmmakers i.e. apart from Eisenstein/Tarkovsky (okay, not so much Eisenstein, younger generations usually reject anything b&w and/or silent), Mikhalkov and, recently, Zvyagintsev, do have their share of fans (Parajanov too, when counting Soviet era), so I suspect most ARE aware of Russian, filmmaking delights, but not explicitly their directors, as was the case with Shepitko, perhaps even with Klimov's Come and See's example where the film's popularity surpasses the director's name. :unsure:

I actually feel sorry for countries of eastern and southern regions, like Hungary's and Greece's, whose, ahem..."representatives" (for better or for worse), two from each country aka Jancso/Tarr and Angelopoulos/Lanthimos respectively, haven't received much love even from hardcore, Criterion-based cinephiles :think:
There are many other great Russian filmmakers than those you have mentioned, but If we are going to talk about countries or regions of the world that are almost completely overlooked by most cinephiles, consider all of Latin America.

While this part of the world may not have produced the same amount of indelible cinema, or noteworthy film movements historically that other more celebrated film countries have, it has been particularly strong this century, yet very few filmmakers from Latin America are given much attention, here.

As for Greek cinema, it seems like there is a small but active mafia, at least for this poll. And as I am not familiar with most of them, I hope to track a few down before next year.
Definitely there are, I only highlighted a number of relatively popular, arthouse names or the ones who have garnered some acclaim from wider audiences and are still (somewhat?) respected.

Latin America has been terribly neglected, but the same can be said about North Africa and several arab-phone lands, not to mention southeast Asian territories (Philippines is quite the splendor), but, at the same time, particular directors/films/countries from Latin America, much like Asian regions, from Iran to China, have also been lucky to have received a boost through festival showings+awards, as well as critics' lists (exposition in theaters is another matter, I'll agree to anything you say about this), so it seems that it all depends on certain names' popularity, rather countries or regions, unless we're discussing the usual suspects for most of the 20th century :cowbow:
Last edited by Dimitris Psachos on October 12th, 2021, 5:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#795

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

flavo5000 wrote: October 12th, 2021, 4:59 pm
Torgo wrote: October 12th, 2021, 4:56 pm
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:13 pm

The Russians are admittedly lucky to have a couple well-loved-by-the-public filmmakers i.e. apart from Eisenstein/Tarkovsky (okay, not so much Eisenstein, younger generations usually reject anything b&w and/or silent), Mikhalkov and, recently, Zvyagintsev, do have their share of fans (Parajanov too, when counting Soviet era), so I suspect most ARE aware of Russian, filmmaking delights, but not explicitly their directors(...)
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:34 pm If "modern" (aka hipster) cinephiles of today recognize mostly Lanthimos-type of directors, then it's a good thing all those hidden gems (especially the ones sticking around for a number of years now) are still......hidden :thumbsup:
Well what now. Do you want some more visibility or not? ;) Or save those gems for the most hidden of <400 cinephile circles?
Ah, the hipster's paradox. You want to uncover hidden gems for people to discover but you don't want people to consume it and have it be popular. It can apply to movies, music, paintings or any other media format that hipsters flock to.
Nah, not really, it's just that whenever directors aren't part of "official" canons, they're hardly accepted by mass cine-audiences. So I may be joking around about the neverending presence of Muddy River's top 5 sequence, but I'll still champion it against the cliched tropes in cinephile circles.

Ironically, even when SOME of them do gain a canon spot (Rocha, Ruiz, Sembene, Akerman etc), they're still subject for debate and are merely referred within the(ir) "movements" or "experimental sub-genre" limitations (and that's why Sembene won't ever be widely accepted like a Godard or Hitchcock or Tarkovsky etc etc)
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#796

Post by OldAle1 »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 12th, 2021, 4:59 pm #13(⇧13, #26) Az én XX. századom (1989)
[My 20th Century]

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Directed by: Ildikó Enyedi
(1058.61 Pts, 26 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–4–9
History: 132628276410381291644←584
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kongs_speech (9)[89.5 Pts]
cinewest (10)[88.27 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (20) [76.84 Pts]
russa03 (20) [76.84 Pts]
Opio (22) [74.74 Pts]
jvv (NA) [65.2 Pts]
mjf314 (38) [59.87 Pts]
rokp (48) [52.12 Pts]
toromash (58) [45.38 Pts]
Gershwin (62) [42.93 Pts]
jeroeno (65) [41.18 Pts]
amechsner (NA) [34.05 Pts]
DulceDoes (119) [19.48 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (130) [16.72 Pts]
dinah (NA) [16.66 Pts]
St. Gloede (133) [16.04 Pts]
joachimt (144) [13.77 Pts]
Odradek (147) [13.21 Pts]
Ebbywebby (150) [12.67 Pts]
cayh (168) [9.88 Pts]
filmbantha (239) [3.69 Pts]
klaus78 (253) [3.04 Pts]
ckfilm88 (268) [2.47 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (6099) [0 Pts]
I always feel like this is a film I should love more. I saw it when it was new in the cinema, and remember thinking it was really, really gorgeously shot - and Dorota Segda is really, really gorgeous also - but that was about it. Watched it again 10-15 years ago and my opinion was unchanged, but it seems to have gained a bit of a reputation over the years and I wonder if there was something I was missing both times I saw it. But then I wasn't too crazy about the other two films from Enyedi I've seen either, though to be fair those were both in poor-quality rips. I think around the time this came out, there were a lot of films from Eastern Europe, particularly Hungary, showing up and playing in cinemas in Chicago, and for whatever reason this didn't measure up. I wish that A Hungarian Fairy Tale from about the same period were better known (though I should give it another viewing also). At least Béla Tarr has managed to find a foothold in the film culture.
Last edited by OldAle1 on October 12th, 2021, 5:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#797

Post by Dimitris Psachos »

OldAle1 wrote: October 12th, 2021, 5:18 pm
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: October 12th, 2021, 4:59 pm #13(⇧13, #26) Az én XX. századom (1989)
[My 20th Century]

Image
Directed by: Ildikó Enyedi
(1058.61 Pts, 26 Votes) , Top 1–10–50: 0–4–9
History: 132628276410381291644←584
ICheckMovies: 340 Checks , 42 Favourites , 4 Official lists
List of Voters:
Ivan0716 (7)[92.02 Pts]
Panunzio (7)[92.02 Pts]
kongs_speech (9)[89.5 Pts]
cinewest (10)[88.27 Pts]
Dimitris Psachos (20) [76.84 Pts]
russa03 (20) [76.84 Pts]
Opio (22) [74.74 Pts]
jvv (NA) [65.2 Pts]
mjf314 (38) [59.87 Pts]
rokp (48) [52.12 Pts]
toromash (58) [45.38 Pts]
Gershwin (62) [42.93 Pts]
jeroeno (65) [41.18 Pts]
amechsner (NA) [34.05 Pts]
DulceDoes (119) [19.48 Pts]
tommy_leazaq (130) [16.72 Pts]
dinah (NA) [16.66 Pts]
St. Gloede (133) [16.04 Pts]
joachimt (144) [13.77 Pts]
Odradek (147) [13.21 Pts]
Ebbywebby (150) [12.67 Pts]
cayh (168) [9.88 Pts]
filmbantha (239) [3.69 Pts]
klaus78 (253) [3.04 Pts]
ckfilm88 (268) [2.47 Pts]
Perception de Ambiguity (6099) [0 Pts]
I always feel like this is a film I should love more. I saw it when it was new in the cinema, and remember thinking it was really, really gorgeously shot - and Dorota Segda is really, really gorgeous also - but that was about it. Watched it again 10-15 years ago and my opinion was unchanged, but it seems to have gained a bit of a reputation over the years and I wonder if there was something I was missing both times I saw it. But then I wasn't too crazy about the other two films from Enyedi I've seen either, though to be fair those were both in poor-quality rips. I think around the time this came out, there were a lot of films from Eastern Europe, particularly Hungary, showing up and playing in cinemas in Chicago, and for whatever reason this didn't measure up. I wish that [urhttps://www.icheckmovies.com/movies/hol+volt+hol+nem+volt/]A Hungarian Fairy Tale[/url] from about the same period were better known (though I should give it another viewing also). At least Béla Tarr has managed to find a foothold in the film culture.
First experience at a retrospective of 90s films and I was, on the contrary, astonished, both visually and thematically!
But, yeah, considering that I admire, though eternally attached to On Body and Soul, it's possible she was a one-hit-wonder (but what a wonder with that Century, at least in my eyes, heh :woot: ) / I'll eventually watch 1-2 more from her (plus, I think Hungary -maybe not in terms of filmmakers' popularity, beyond Tarr's- has been more or less present in the cinematic, non-mainstream field - remember Taxidermia's appeal? at least where I live, it had a cult run both in cinemas and dvds tehe )
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#798

Post by cinewest »

Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 5:06 pm
cinewest wrote: October 12th, 2021, 4:53 pm
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:13 pm

The Russians are admittedly lucky to have a couple well-loved-by-the-public filmmakers i.e. apart from Eisenstein/Tarkovsky (okay, not so much Eisenstein, younger generations usually reject anything b&w and/or silent), Mikhalkov and, recently, Zvyagintsev, do have their share of fans (Parajanov too, when counting Soviet era), so I suspect most ARE aware of Russian, filmmaking delights, but not explicitly their directors, as was the case with Shepitko, perhaps even with Klimov's Come and See's example where the film's popularity surpasses the director's name. :unsure:

I actually feel sorry for countries of eastern and southern regions, like Hungary's and Greece's, whose, ahem..."representatives" (for better or for worse), two from each country aka Jancso/Tarr and Angelopoulos/Lanthimos respectively, haven't received much love even from hardcore, Criterion-based cinephiles :think:
There are many other great Russian filmmakers than those you have mentioned, but If we are going to talk about countries or regions of the world that are almost completely overlooked by most cinephiles, consider all of Latin America.

While this part of the world may not have produced the same amount of indelible cinema, or noteworthy film movements historically that other more celebrated film countries have, it has been particularly strong this century, yet very few filmmakers from Latin America are given much attention, here.

As for Greek cinema, it seems like there is a small but active mafia, at least for this poll. And as I am not familiar with most of them, I hope to track a few down before next year.
Definitely there are, I only highlighted a number of relatively popular, arthouse names or the ones who have garnered some acclaim from wider audiences and are still (somewhat?) respected.

Latin America has been terribly neglected, but the same can be said about North Africa and several arab-phone lands, not to mention southeast Asian territories (Philippines is quite the splendor), but, at the same time, particular directors/films/countries from Latin America, much like Asian regions, from Iran to China, have also been lucky to have received a boost through festival showings+awards, as well as critics' lists (exposition in theaters is another matter, I'll agree to anything you say about this), so it seems that it all depends on certain names' popularity, rather countries or regions, unless we're discussing the usual suspects for most of the 20th century :cowbow:
There are a small group of filmmakers from Latin America who have been championed by critics, but almost everything else has been ignored, and those that have been championed do not get much attention on this board.
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Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 5:06 pm
cinewest wrote: October 12th, 2021, 4:53 pm
Dimitris Psachos wrote: October 12th, 2021, 1:13 pm

The Russians are admittedly lucky to have a couple well-loved-by-the-public filmmakers i.e. apart from Eisenstein/Tarkovsky (okay, not so much Eisenstein, younger generations usually reject anything b&w and/or silent), Mikhalkov and, recently, Zvyagintsev, do have their share of fans (Parajanov too, when counting Soviet era), so I suspect most ARE aware of Russian, filmmaking delights, but not explicitly their directors, as was the case with Shepitko, perhaps even with Klimov's Come and See's example where the film's popularity surpasses the director's name. :unsure:

I actually feel sorry for countries of eastern and southern regions, like Hungary's and Greece's, whose, ahem..."representatives" (for better or for worse), two from each country aka Jancso/Tarr and Angelopoulos/Lanthimos respectively, haven't received much love even from hardcore, Criterion-based cinephiles :think:
There are many other great Russian filmmakers than those you have mentioned, but If we are going to talk about countries or regions of the world that are almost completely overlooked by most cinephiles, consider all of Latin America.

While this part of the world may not have produced the same amount of indelible cinema, or noteworthy film movements historically that other more celebrated film countries have, it has been particularly strong this century, yet very few filmmakers from Latin America are given much attention, here.

As for Greek cinema, it seems like there is a small but active mafia, at least for this poll. And as I am not familiar with most of them, I hope to track a few down before next year.
Definitely there are, I only highlighted a number of relatively popular, arthouse names or the ones who have garnered some acclaim from wider audiences and are still (somewhat?) respected.

Latin America has been terribly neglected, but the same can be said about North Africa and several arab-phone lands, not to mention southeast Asian territories (Philippines is quite the splendor), but, at the same time, particular directors/films/countries from Latin America, much like Asian regions, from Iran to China, have also been lucky to have received a boost through festival showings+awards, as well as critics' lists (exposition in theaters is another matter, I'll agree to anything you say about this), so it seems that it all depends on certain names' popularity, rather countries or regions, unless we're discussing the usual suspects for most of the 20th century :cowbow:
I think part of the issue is that cineastes - at least cineastes like those of us, who will actively look for things - have such a vast number of choices out there, and how to narrow it all down? It's natural that a lot of folks focus on France or Japan or the USA - film industries that go back to the beginning, with absolutely vast numbers of great director and films in just about every major genre, important arthouse figures, experimental work, animation, etc. You'll never run out of stuff to see and an awful lot of it is readily available in comparison with what's out there from the Philippines or Argentina or Egypt. And because these bigger countries are largely parts of the collective world culture, they are more familiar to more people as well; I think it's a bigger step for Joe Sixpack to watch a Senegalese film from the 60s or 70s than to watch something from Truffaut or Akira Kurosawa. A lot of this is unsurprising, and the smaller the country and the smaller it's overall influence, the less it's likely to show up on peoples' radars, and even when you do have a breakthrough director - a Lav Diaz or Yorgos Lanthimos - does it lead to more people really getting into the cinematic histories of their countries, the works of their contemporaries? I doubt it. I mean, three of the most successful directors of the last two decades - all Oscar winners - are Mexican, but have they helped to really increase interest in Mexican cinema? Doesn't seem like it - and Spanish is one of the most-spoken languages on the planet, and Mexican cinema has as long and diverse a history as most 2nd-tier and some 1st-tier cinemas.
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#800

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#12(⇧21, #33) Erosu purasu gyakusatsu (1969)
[Eros + Massacre]

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