Welcome to the ICM Forum. If you have an account but have trouble logging in, or have other questions, see THIS THREAD.
NOTE: Board emails should be working again. Information on forum upgrade and style issues.
Podcast: Talking Images (Episode 22 released November 17th * EXCLUSIVE * We Are Mentioned in a Book!!! Interview with Mary Guillermin on Rapture, JG & More)
Polls: Coming of Age (Results), DtC - Ratings (Results), 1933 (May 12th), 1970s (May 29th)
Challenges: Japan, Mystery/Thriller, Western
Film of the Week: La donna del lago, June nominations (May 28th)

ICM Forum's Favourite Directors 2020 [RESULTS]

500<400, Favourite 1001 movies, Doubling the Canon, Film World Cup and many other votes
Post Reply
User avatar
joachimt
Donator
Posts: 33902
Joined: February 16th, 2012, 7:00 am
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

#441

Post by joachimt »

I'd be interested in country-breakdown and year-of-birth-breakdown. No idea if it's easy to get such stats. Probably not.
ICM-profile
Fergenaprido: "I find your OCD to be adorable, J"
User avatar
Teproc
Posts: 1095
Joined: September 23rd, 2015, 6:00 am
Contact:

#442

Post by Teproc »

I can do nationalities, as I already keep track of that, kind of. Going by Wikipedia for those, by the way, which means some surprising things (Tarkovsky apparently had Italian and French nationalities as well as Soviet, and Capra counts as both Italian and American), but mostly seems pretty good:

United States - 75
France - 29
Japan - 21
United Kingdom - 15
Italy - 12
Germany - 9
Soviet Union - 4
Austria - 4
Canada - 4
Taiwan - 4
South Korea - 4
Sweden - 3
Mexico - 3
Poland - 3
Hungary - 3
Denmark - 3
Iran - 3
Czechoslovakia - 3
Greece - 3
Spain - 2
Hong Kong - 2
Belgium - 2
Russia - 2
Chile - 2
India - 1
China - 1
Thailand - 1
Turkey - 1
Australia - 1
Netherlands - 1
Armenia - 1
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#443

Post by pitchorneirda »

Wow thanks for this Teproc. More stats and lists tonight guys I was stuck at work without my data
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
Torgo
Posts: 2939
Joined: June 30th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

#444

Post by Torgo »

Teproc wrote: March 9th, 2021, 5:59 pm some surprising things (Tarkovsky apparently had Italian and French nationalities as well as Soviet)
Interesting! So I do have one Frenchman in my Top 10 .. :P

The Republic of China Taiwan having more directors (4) than China (1!) and Hong Kong (2) combined: :blink:

Lonewolf2003 wrote: March 9th, 2021, 3:08 pm The only director from my ranked top 50 that didn't make the cut is Steve McQueen.
I kept having a quick glance at the voters and you indeed were everywhere! :lol:
User avatar
OldAle1
Donator
Posts: 6025
Joined: February 9th, 2017, 7:00 am
Location: Dairyland, USA
Contact:

#445

Post by OldAle1 »

Torgo wrote: March 9th, 2021, 6:19 pm
The Republic of China Taiwan having more directors (4) than China (1!) and Hong Kong (2) combined: :blink:
That fact all by itself is strong confirmation of the arthouse bias of this forum.
User avatar
Torgo
Posts: 2939
Joined: June 30th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

#446

Post by Torgo »

I'm not sure if you're being a bit ironic with this, but you could reason so, right?
Hong Kong could easily be voted into such a poll by their more commercial output from 1975-1999, but yeah, we will prefer other types of cinema. And the one HK guy I of course voted for, too, is Wong Kar-Wai, not exactly a Shaw-type or action Woo. :shrug: It will be very exciting to see if more Chinese directors make their breakthrough in the 2020s.
User avatar
OldAle1
Donator
Posts: 6025
Joined: February 9th, 2017, 7:00 am
Location: Dairyland, USA
Contact:

#447

Post by OldAle1 »

Torgo wrote: March 9th, 2021, 6:46 pm I'm not sure if you're being a bit ironic with this, but you could reason so, right?
Hong Kong could easily be voted into such a poll by their more commercial output from 1975-1999, but yeah, we will prefer other types of cinema. And the one HK guy I of course voted for, too, is Wong Kar-Wai, not exactly a Shaw-type or action Woo. :shrug: It will be very exciting to see if more Chinese directors make their breakthrough in the 2020s.
No, not being ironic at all. Pretty clear the forum prefers arthouse over more commercial directors, particularly when it comes to non-English-language, more recent (say, post-1990) stuff. Obviously Ford and Capra and Hitchcock and Leone were all "commercial" directors, whatever arthouse pretensions they had at times. And we have several English-language current-day directors who make genre films - Nolan, the Coens, QT - even if they all have their arthouse followings as well. But when it comes to modern-day cinema from Latin America or Italy or France or Japan or Hong Kong, etc, it's mostly the big arthouse gods, right? Not that I'm making any statement pro- or anti-arthouse here, just seems to be obviously a prejudice that the forum collectively has.

(thinking about it, anime directors are a big exception)
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#448

Post by pitchorneirda »

Onderhond wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:54 am If you scrap the entire top 100 and move 101-200 forward, the quality of this list would be so much better.
Also bummed that Tsukamoto still didn't make the cut (or did I miss him?), not quite sure why he's so overlooked.

But thanks pitchorneirda for the results!
Shin'ya Tsukamoto is #225 (#221 last year), with your #3 vote, Carmel1379's vote at #22, Torgo's at #30 and PdA's at #163
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#449

Post by pitchorneirda »

[Deleted]
Last edited by pitchorneirda on March 9th, 2021, 7:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
Torgo
Posts: 2939
Joined: June 30th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

#450

Post by Torgo »

pitchorneirda wrote: March 9th, 2021, 7:19 pm
Onderhond wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:54 am Also bummed that Tsukamoto still didn't make the cut (or did I miss him?), not quite sure why he's so overlooked.
Shin'ya Tsukamoto is #225 (#221 last year), with your #3 vote, Carmel1379's vote at #22, Torgo's at #30 and PdA's at #163
Damn, just wanted to write it wouldn't hurt to have him at a lower Top 200 rank. Did he never make it in our previous polls? I had the impression we had enough Tetsuo lovers in the forum - and then you usually pick another 3 or 4 by the directors and should enjoy them. Mh.
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#451

Post by pitchorneirda »

Torgo wrote: March 9th, 2021, 7:23 pm
pitchorneirda wrote: March 9th, 2021, 7:19 pm
Onderhond wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:54 am Also bummed that Tsukamoto still didn't make the cut (or did I miss him?), not quite sure why he's so overlooked.
Shin'ya Tsukamoto is #225 (#221 last year), with your #3 vote, Carmel1379's vote at #22, Torgo's at #30 and PdA's at #163
Damn, just wanted to write it wouldn't hurt to have him at a lower Top 200 rank. Did he never make it in our previous polls? I had the impression we had enough Tetsuo lovers in the forum - and then you usually pick another 3 or 4 by the directors and should enjoy them. Mh.
No, 221 is his best rank
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
joachimt
Donator
Posts: 33902
Joined: February 16th, 2012, 7:00 am
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

#452

Post by joachimt »

pitchorneirda wrote: March 9th, 2021, 7:22 pm Also, Coen Brothers should be #7 and Tarkovsky #8 because I forgot to take into account Joel Coen's tally (Ethan had 344.39 points but Joel had 28.48 too)

Wait: maxwelldeux had both Ethan and Joel Coen on his list, that shouldn't be allowed
Unless someone voted for both Ethan and Joel. Than the lowest of the two on such a list shouldn't count.
ICM-profile
Fergenaprido: "I find your OCD to be adorable, J"
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#453

Post by pitchorneirda »

joachimt wrote: March 9th, 2021, 7:26 pm
pitchorneirda wrote: March 9th, 2021, 7:22 pm Also, Coen Brothers should be #7 and Tarkovsky #8 because I forgot to take into account Joel Coen's tally (Ethan had 344.39 points but Joel had 28.48 too)

Wait: maxwelldeux had both Ethan and Joel Coen on his list, that shouldn't be allowed
Unless someone voted for both Ethan and Joel. Than the lowest of the two on such a list shouldn't count.
OK so
344.39 (Ethan's original tally)
+ 28.48 (Joel Coen's original tally)
- 9.76 (maxwelldeux's vote for Ethan at #19 because he voted Joel as #5)
= 363.11

more than Tarkovsky.
I'm a bit too jaded to change the countdown but I'll switch ranks in my IMDb list and in the spreadsheet
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#454

Post by pitchorneirda »

Top 500

1. Stanley Kubrick - Change: 0
2. Ingmar Bergman - Change: +1
3. Akira Kurosawa - Change: +1
4. Alfred Hitchcock - Change: -2
5. Billy Wilder - Change: +2
6. Martin Scorsese - Change: -1
7. Ethan Coen - Change: +3
8. Andrei Tarkovsky - Change: -2
9. Orson Welles - Change: +5
10. Fritz Lang - Change: -2
11. David Lynch - Change: -2
12. Quentin Tarantino - Change: +1
13. Luis Buñuel - Change: -2
14. Masaki Kobayashi - Change: +9
15. Roman Polanski - Change: +3
16. Satyajit Ray - Change: +21
17. Rainer Werner Fassbinder - Change: +10
18. Werner Herzog - Change: -1
19. Yasujirô Ozu - Change: +1
20. Krzysztof Kieslowski - Change: -5
21. Robert Bresson - Change: +15
22. Charles Chaplin - Change: 0
23. Sergio Leone - Change: -11
24. Buster Keaton - Change: +14
25. Michelangelo Antonioni - Change: +18
26. Woody Allen - Change: -5
27. Jean-Pierre Melville - Change: -2
28. Steven Spielberg - Change: -9
29. Hayao Miyazaki - Change: -3
30. Sidney Lumet - Change: +9
31. F.W. Murnau - Change: -7
32. Kenji Mizoguchi - Change: +13
33. Éric Rohmer - Change: -17
34. Wes Anderson - Change: -3
35. Michael Haneke - Change: +6
36. Michael Powell - Change: +8
37. Paul Thomas Anderson - Change: -8
38. Jean-Luc Godard - Change: +4
39. Carl Theodor Dreyer - Change: -11
40. Christopher Nolan - Change: +8
41. Ernst Lubitsch - Change: -9
42. David Fincher - Change: -7
43. David Lean - Change: -9
44. Abbas Kiarostami - Change: +5
45. Francis Ford Coppola - Change: +9
46. David Cronenberg - Change: -16
47. Kar-Wai Wong - Change: -7
48. Jean Renoir - Change: -1
49. Howard Hawks - Change: -16
50. William Wyler - Change: +1
51. Robert Altman - Change: +32
52. Frank Capra - Change: -6
53. Alain Resnais - Change: 0
54. Federico Fellini - Change: +3
55. John Ford - Change: -5
56. Lars von Trier - Change: +3
57. Agnès Varda - Change: -1
58. François Truffaut - Change: -6
59. Yimou Zhang - Change: +10
60. Terrence Malick - Change: -5
61. Mikio Naruse - Change: +30
62. John Cassavetes - Change: 0
63. Mike Leigh - Change: +3
64. Vittorio De Sica - Change: +26
65. Brian De Palma - Change: -5
66. Henri-Georges Clouzot - Change: +8
67. John Huston - Change: +4
68. Pedro Almodóvar - Change: -10
69. Luchino Visconti - Change: +15
70. Béla Tarr - Change: 0
71. John Carpenter - Change: -7
72. Hsiao-Hsien Hou - Change: +33
73. Marcel Carné - Change: 0
74. Aki Kaurismäki - Change: +2
75. Elia Kazan - Change: -14
76. Roberto Rossellini - Change: +25
77. James Cameron - Change: -14
78. Preston Sturges - Change: -3
79. Louis Malle - Change: -14
80. Max Ophüls - Change: +9
81. Denis Villeneuve - Change: +37
82. Jim Jarmusch - Change: -2
83. Ridley Scott - Change: +13
84. Hiroshi Teshigahara - Change: +18
85. Wim Wenders - Change: -17
86. Richard Linklater - Change: -19
87. Terry Gilliam - Change: +1
88. Nicholas Ray - Change: +21
89. Milos Forman - Change: -17
90. Jacques Rivette - Change: -5
91. Chan-wook Park - Change: -9
92. Darren Aronofsky - Change: -15
93. Samuel Fuller - Change: +10
94. Pier Paolo Pasolini - Change: 0
95. Guy Maddin - Change: -16
96. Alfonso Cuarón - Change: -9
97. Michael Curtiz - Change: +1
98. Carol Reed - Change: +10
99. Douglas Sirk - Change: -7
100. Jean Cocteau - Change: +75
101. Sam Peckinpah - Change: +11
102. Clint Eastwood - Change: +4
103. Joseph L. Mankiewicz - Change: +44
104. Jean-Pierre Dardenne - Change: -26
105. Edgar Wright - Change: -12
106. Gaspar Noé - Change: -2
107. Sergei M. Eisenstein - Change: +18
108. Mikhail Kalatozov - Change: -11
109. Robert Zemeckis - Change: -9
110. Mamoru Oshii - Change: +9
111. Hirokazu Koreeda - Change: -16
112. Jacques Tati - Change: +3
113. Spike Jonze - Change: +43
114. Don Hertzfeldt - Change: +80
115. Tim Burton - Change: +30
116. Rob Reiner - Change: +8
117. Peter Jackson - Change: -36
118. Anthony Mann - Change: +33
119. Andrzej Wajda - Change: +4
120. Claude Chabrol - Change: -6
121. Josef von Sternberg - Change: +12
122. Jacques Tourneur - Change: +24
123. Ming-liang Tsai - Change: +34
124. Jules Dassin - Change: -8
125. Takeshi Kitano - Change: +6
126. Spike Lee - Change: -16
127. Nicolas Roeg - Change: +22
128. Asghar Farhadi - Change: -42
129. Nuri Bilge Ceylan - Change: +26
130. Jan Svankmajer - Change: -17
131. Bong Joon Ho - Change: +29
132. Roy Andersson - Change: +61
133. Nicolas Winding Refn - Change: +33
134. Peter Weir - Change: -5
135. Jacques Demy - Change: +8
136. Aleksandr Sokurov - Change: +67
137. Theodoros Angelopoulos - Change: +163
138. Mike Nichols - Change: +14
139. Mario Bava - Change: +3
140. Chris Marker - Change: +8
141. George Cukor - Change: -24
142. Alejandro G. Iñárritu - Change: -31
143. Apichatpong Weerasethakul - Change: -16
144. Sion Sono - Change: -45
145. John Frankenheimer - Change: +35
146. Bernardo Bertolucci - Change: -12
147. Raoul Walsh - Change: +14
148. Stanley Kramer - Change: +70
149. Ang Lee - Change: +1
150. Sam Mendes - Change: +85
151. Shôhei Imamura - Change: +25
152. Edward Yang - Change: -45
153. Isao Takahata - Change: +53
154. Steven Soderbergh - Change: +9
155. Maurice Pialat - Change: -29
156. Terence Davies - Change: +31
157. Chantal Akerman - Change: -13
158. Danny Boyle - Change: -22
159. Chuck Jones - Change: +11
160. Dario Argento - Change: -25
161. Jafar Panahi - Change: +70
162. Johnnie To - Change: -9
163. Sang-soo Hong - Change: -42
164. Raoul Ruiz - Change: -42
165. Jean-Pierre Jeunet - Change: +3
166. Michael Mann - Change: -7
167. Don Siegel - Change: -27
168. Yorgos Lanthimos - Change: +32
169. Oliver Stone - Change: +17
170. Nagisa Ôshima - Change: +22
171. Victor Sjöström - Change: -17
172. Takashi Miike - Change: +9
173. Satoshi Kon - Change: -6
174. Michael Snow - Change: -1
175. Fred Zinnemann - Change: -37
176. Robert Wise - Change: +22
177. Peter Greenaway - Change: -47
178. Masaaki Yuasa - Change: +32
179. William A. Wellman - Change: -8
180. Erich von Stroheim - Change: +47
181. Frantisek Vlácil - Change: +32
182. Andrey Zvyagintsev - Change: +37
183. George A. Romero - Change: -6
184. Costa-Gavras - Change: -1
185. Paul Verhoeven - Change: -46
186. Leo McCarey - Change: -66
187. Ken Loach - Change: -46
188. Makoto Shinkai - Change: +174
189. Claire Denis - Change: -52
190. Kon Ichikawa - Change: -8
191. Todd Solondz - Change: +187
192. Tetsuya Nakashima - Change: +5
193. Errol Morris - Change: +14
194. Leos Carax - Change: +82
195. Tex Avery - Change: +27
196. Akio Jissôji - Change: +19
197. Wes Craven - Change: -65
198. Alejandro Jodorowsky - Change: +6
199. Artavazd Peleshian - Change: +240
200. Kim Ki-duk - Change: -72
201. Hélène Cattet - Change: -5
202. Sam Raimi - Change: -38
203. Gakuryû Ishii - Change: +41
204. Brad Bird - Change: -19
205. Pete Docter - Change: +117
206. Jean Epstein - Change: -37
207. Jacques Becker - Change: +2
208. Andrzej Zulawski - Change: +102
209. Taika Waititi - Change: +135
210. Yasuzô Masumura - Change: +46
211. Damien Chazelle - Change: +55
212. Alexander Payne - Change: -24
213. Budd Boetticher - Change: -14
214. D.W. Griffith - Change: +33
215. Gus Van Sant - Change: -53
216. Mervyn LeRoy - Change: -44
217. Vincenzo Natali - Change: -5
218. Jonathan Demme - Change: +77
219. Peter Mettler - Change: +34
220. Sofia Coppola - Change: +21
221. Xavier Dolan - Change: -19
222. John McTiernan - Change: +3
223. Yoshishige Yoshida - Change: +34
224. Víctor Erice - Change: -33
225. Shin'ya Tsukamoto - Change: -4
226. Ousmane Sembene - Change: -37
227. Robert Siodmak - Change: +44
228. Stephen Frears - Change: +54
229. Christian Petzold - Change: +101
230. William Friedkin - Change: -6
231. Chang-dong Lee - Change: +96
232. Carlos Saura - Change: +33
233. Alexander Mackendrick - Change: -13
234. Bryan Singer - Change: -26
235. Todd Haynes - Change: -30
236. Kenneth Anger - Change: +66
237. Louis Feuillade - Change: +99
238. Bob Fosse - Change: +77
239. Jean Vigo - Change: -9
240. Hal Hartley - Change: -75
241. Emir Kusturica - Change: -57
242. Miklós Jancsó - Change: +107
243. John Sturges - Change: +19
244. Andrew Stanton - Change: -65
245. Maya Deren - Change: +51
246. King Vidor - Change: -7
247. Mohsen Makhmalbaf - Change: +3
248. John Woo - Change: -15
249. Mamoru Hosoda - Change: +77
250. Terry Jones - Change: +48
251. Ron Howard - Change: -35
252. Dziga Vertov - Change: +132
253. René Clair - Change: -7
254. Georges Méliès - Change: -12
255. Shunji Iwai - Change: -12
256. Guy Ritchie - Change: -22
257. George Miller - Change: +1130
258. Krzysztof Zanussi - Change: +149
259. James Whale - Change: +50
260. Frank Darabont - Change: -9
261. Hal Ashby - Change: +23
262. Lana Wachowski - Change: +39
263. Thomas Vinterberg - Change: -89
264. John Waters - Change: -19
265. Alain Robbe-Grillet - Change: +26
266. Robert Aldrich - Change: +19
267. Steve McQueen - Change: -89
268. John Hughes - Change: +225
269. Otto Preminger - Change: -52
270. Hark Tsui - Change: -34
271. Umberto Lenzi - Change: +137
272. Dave Fleischer - Change: +74
273. Kelly Reichardt - Change: +138
274. Andrew Adamson - Change: -26
275. Wolfgang Reitherman - Change: +170
276. Jason Reitman - Change: +64
277. Michael Moore - Change: +4
278. Kathryn Bigelow - Change: -83
279. Bruce Baillie - Change: +174
280. George Lucas - Change: +244
281. Mel Brooks - Change: +122
282. Frederick Wiseman - Change: -124
283. Robert E. Fulton - Change: -19
284. Henry Hathaway - Change: +132
285. Edgar Reitz - Change: +23
286. Hiroshi Shimizu - Change: -25
287. Masahiro Shinoda - Change: +103
288. James Benning - Change: +26
289. M. Night Shyamalan - Change: -22
290. Sergio Martino - Change: -290
291. Frank Borzage - Change: -101
292. Michel Gondry - Change: +96
293. Peter Watkins - Change: -53
294. Jonas Mekas - Change: +3
295. Roger Corman - Change: -7
296. Jordan Belson - Change: +359
297. Marcel L'Herbier - Change: +51
298. Philippe Grandrieux - Change: -4
299. Guillermo del Toro - Change: -27
300. Shane Carruth - Change: -8
301. Pedro Costa - Change: +59
302. Danièle Huillet - Change: +116
303. Harmony Korine - Change: +72
304. Katsuhiro Ôtomo - Change: +265
305. Paul W.S. Anderson - Change: -19
306. John Boorman - Change: +90
307. Tony Scott - Change: -38
308. Kaneto Shindô - Change: +8
309. Abel Gance - Change: +131
310. Kihachi Okamoto - Change: -30
311. Patrick Bokanowski - Change: +147
312. Basil Dearden - Change: +296
313. David Yates - Change: -23
314. Julio Medem - Change: +138
315. Bruce Conner - Change: +26
316. Ermanno Olmi - Change: +89
317. Ishirô Honda - Change: +306
318. Vincente Minnelli - Change: -5
319. Trey Parker - Change: -82
320. Paul Clipson - Change: -13
321. Wojciech Has - Change: -110
322. Lee Unkrich - Change: +163
323. Ben Hecht - Change: -11
324. Anatole Litvak - Change: -21
325. Nobuhiko Ôbayashi - Change: +163
326. Susanne Bier - Change: -72
327. James Mangold - Change: +292
328. Stuart Gordon - Change: -35
329. Bruno Dumont - Change: +223
330. Noah Baumbach - Change: -24
331. Germaine Dulac - Change: -48
332. Nick Park - Change: +70
333. Johanna Vaude - Change: -10
334. Stan Brakhage - Change: +113
335. Sydney Pollack - Change: +4
336. Barbet Schroeder - Change: -66
337. Keisuke Kinoshita - Change: +506
338. Céline Sciamma - Change: +223
339. Aleksandr Petrov - Change: -15
340. Arthur Penn - Change: +29
341. Blake Edwards - Change: -73
342. Lucio Fulci - Change: -69
343. René Clément - Change: +163
344. Paolo Sorrentino - Change: -67
345. Cecil B. DeMille - Change: +336
346. George Stevens - Change: -118
347. Joshua Oppenheimer - Change: +11
348. Christopher Guest - Change: -348
349. Robert Clampett - Change: +432
350. Ari Aster - Change: +210
351. Mark Robson - Change: -73
352. Olivier Assayas - Change: -123
353. Martin Arnold - Change: -20
354. William Dieterle - Change: +121
355. James Wan - Change: +38
356. Sohrab Shahid Saless - Change: +578
357. Claude Sautet - Change: +16
358. Larry Jordan - Change: +108
359. Tobe Hooper - Change: +203
360. Peter Bogdanovich - Change: -39
361. David Zucker - Change: -18
362. Jean-Marc Vallée - Change: -8
363. Robert Eggers - Change: +355
364. Harun Farocki - Change: -7
365. Georg Wilhelm Pabst - Change: -164
366. Luc Besson - Change: +26
367. Charlie Kaufman - Change: +238
368. Lav Diaz - Change: -79
369. François Ozon - Change: -27
370. John Sayles - Change: -96
371. Alan Parker - Change: +1
372. Monte Hellman - Change: -158
373. Karel Kachyna - Change: -20
374. Seijun Suzuki - Change: +103
375. J.J. Abrams - Change: +202
376. Mani Kaul - Change: -127
377. Shane Meadows - Change: +10
378. Georges Franju - Change: +285
379. Aleksandr Dovzhenko - Change: +6
380. Jaco Van Dormael - Change: -120
381. Richard Fleischer - Change: +149
382. Norman Jewison - Change: -44
383. Takashi Makino - Change: -17
384. Bert Haanstra - Change: +81
385. Victor Fleming - Change: +359
386. Birgit Hein - Change: -23
387. Takashi Ito - Change: +11
388. Alex Garland - Change: +247
389. Ken Russell - Change: -157
390. Sergei Parajanov - Change: +23
391. Ron Clements - Change: -15
392. Elem Klimov - Change: +152
393. Mitchell Leisen - Change: +11
394. Lucrecia Martel - Change: -14
395. Guy Gilles - Change: -136
396. Roland Emmerich - Change: -19
397. Carmelo Bene - Change: -26
398. Alex Gibney - Change: -17
399. Michael Apted - Change: -47
400. Toshiaki Toyoda - Change: -53
401. David O'Reilly - Change: +305
402. Kôji Morimoto - Change: -3
403. Jean-Jacques Beineix - Change: -69
404. Stanley Donen - Change: -146
405. Zack Snyder - Change: -38
406. Chris Columbus - Change: -89
407. Karel Zeman - Change: +3
408. Penelope Spheeris - Change: -408
409. Juraj Jakubisko - Change: +39
410. Jeff Lieberman - Change: -46
411. Peter B. Hutton - Change: -5
412. Denys Arcand - Change: -26
413. SABU - Change: +22
414. Albert Brooks - Change: -25
415. Tod Browning - Change: -84
416. John Schlesinger - Change: +134
417. King Hu - Change: -67
418. Jack Hill - Change: +2
419. Leighton Pierce - Change: -25
420. Alex van Warmerdam - Change: -23
421. Rian Johnson - Change: +387
422. Mike Flanagan - Change: +112
423. Barry Levinson - Change: -78
424. Majid Majidi - Change: -113
425. Wen Jiang - Change: +38
426. Lynne Ramsay - Change: +457
427. Jared Hess - Change: -427
428. Jay Duplass - Change: -13
429. Leslie Zemeckis - Change: +680
430. Yuri Ilyenko - Change: +21
431. Sylvain Chomet - Change: +575
432. Joseph Losey - Change: -114
433. George Roy Hill - Change: +54
434. Atom Egoyan - Change: -179
435. Ulrich Seidl - Change: -23
436. Robert Rodriguez - Change: -68
437. John Landis - Change: +427
438. Paul Schrader - Change: +8
439. Kôji Masunari - Change: +3
440. Antoine d'Agata - Change: -17
441. Larry Cohen - Change: -136
442. Nicole Rittenmeyer - Change: -15
443. Walter Lang - Change: -78
444. Paul Greengrass - Change: -30
445. Adrian Lyne - Change: -44
446. Tom Tykwer - Change: -118
447. Peter Tscherkassky - Change: +246
448. Bill Douglas - Change: +290
449. Zhangke Jia - Change: -197
450. Aleksey German - Change: +232
451. Martin McDonagh - Change: +17
452. Russell Mulcahy - Change: -26
453. Jennifer Devoldère - Change: -17
454. Hiroshi Ishikawa - Change: -45
455. Kiyoshi Kurosawa - Change: +120
456. Manoel de Oliveira - Change: -136
457. Joris Ivens - Change: -27
458. Sean Baker - Change: +95
459. Martin Ritt - Change: +206
460. Ryûtarô Nakamura - Change: -17
461. Hitoshi Matsumoto - Change: -40
462. Robert Hamer - Change: +425
463. Larisa Shepitko - Change: -131
464. Gillo Pontecorvo - Change: +183
465. Saul Bass - Change: -32
466. J. Lee Thompson - Change: +77
467. David O. Russell - Change: -97
468. Mika Ninagawa - Change: NEW
469. Luigi Bazzoni - Change: +516
470. Franklin J. Schaffner - Change: +67
471. Claude Lanzmann - Change: +7
472. Franco Piavoli - Change: -72
473. Marguerite Duras - Change: -19
474. Hollis Frampton - Change: +9
475. Wilfred Jackson - Change: +234
476. Michael Arias - Change: -59
477. Yuri Norstein - Change: +25
478. David Firth - Change: -19
479. Andrew Niccol - Change: +122
480. Arnaud Desplechin - Change: -11
481. Jay Oliva - Change: -59
482. R. Bruce Elder - Change: -21
483. Jerry Lewis - Change: +13
484. Alejandro Amenábar - Change: -221
485. Jim Henson - Change: +761
486. Yoshiaki Kawajiri - Change: +683
487. Bill Morrison - Change: +596
488. Jean-Claude Rousseau - Change: +244
489. Clyde Geronimi - Change: -70
490. Baz Luhrmann - Change: -40
491. Norman McLaren - Change: -67
492. Katsuhito Ishii - Change: +104
493. Juraj Herz - Change: +376
494. Renny Harlin - Change: +3
495. Tarsem Singh - Change: +76
496. Helmut Käutner - Change: -258
497. Doug Liman - Change: +127
498. Keiichi Hara - Change: -24
499. Dominique Deruddere - Change: -43
500. Henry King - Change: +372
Last edited by pitchorneirda on March 9th, 2021, 8:07 pm, edited 3 times in total.
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#455

Post by pitchorneirda »

Drop-offs

201. Hélène Cattet - Change: -5
202. Sam Raimi - Change: -38
204. Brad Bird - Change: -19
206. Jean Epstein - Change: -37
212. Alexander Payne - Change: -24
213. Budd Boetticher - Change: -14
215. Gus Van Sant - Change: -53
216. Mervyn LeRoy - Change: -44
224. Víctor Erice - Change: -33
226. Ousmane Sembene - Change: -37
240. Hal Hartley - Change: -75
241. Emir Kusturica - Change: -57
244. Andrew Stanton - Change: -65
263. Thomas Vinterberg - Change: -89
267. Steve McQueen - Change: -89
278. Kathryn Bigelow - Change: -83
282. Frederick Wiseman - Change: -124
291. Frank Borzage - Change: -101
Last edited by pitchorneirda on March 9th, 2021, 8:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#456

Post by pitchorneirda »

They're at their WORST ranking ever (Top 200)

#4 Alfred Hitchcock
#10 Fritz Lang
#11 David Lynch
#13 Luis Buñuel
#29 Hayao Miyazaki
#41 Ernst Lubitsch
#49 Howard Hawks
#52 Frank Capra
#55 John Ford
#58 François Truffaut
#62 John Cassavetes
#82 Jim Jarmusch
#171 Victor Sjöström
#186 Leo McCarey
#189 Claire Denis

They're at their BEST ranking ever (Top 50-200)

#1 Stanley Kubrick
#3 Akira Kurosawa
#9 Orson Welles
#14 Masaki Kobayashi
#15 Roman Polanski
#16 Satyajit Ray
#17 Rainer Werner Fassbinder
#35 Michael Haneke
#36 Michael Powell/Emeric Pressburger
#59 Yimou Zhang
#61 Mikio Naruse
#64 Vittorio De Sica
#81 Denis Villeneuve
#84 Hiroshi Teshigahara
#100 Jean Cocteau
#127 Nicolas Roeg
#131 Joon-ho Bong
#139 Mario Bava
#145 John Frankenheimer
#148 Stanley Kramer
#153 Isao Takahata
#156 Terence Davies
#169 Oliver Stone
#188 Makoto Shinkai
#196 Akio Jissôji
Last edited by pitchorneirda on March 9th, 2021, 8:07 pm, edited 3 times in total.
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#457

Post by pitchorneirda »

Now if someone knows a way of doing a IMDb list without entering each name one by one...I'm all ears (I have the IMDb links)
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
Torgo
Posts: 2939
Joined: June 30th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

#458

Post by Torgo »

mightysparks wrote: March 9th, 2021, 5:01 am These lists always make me realise just how little directors matter to me. Still, glad to see Kubrick continuing to reign supreme.
Funny how differently people may perceive this. This list really makes me want to fill gaps for my favorite directors and freshly explore the ones I'm unacustomed to. :)
Average people - you know, those from the street who decide over box office success and watch TV and VOD and all that - mostly concentrate on popular actors & actresses; besides stories, of course. Seems so unadvanced to me.
St. Gloede wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:27 am Tarkovsky is a bigger jump, needing 3 high votes. Given the number of people willing to place Tarkovsky on #1 out there though - that would have been a fairly easy project with selective recruitment.
As many others here, I absolutely adore Tarkovski - it's just so sad you run out of films for him quick :( If fate let him direct only 3 more films even on a slighty lower level than his "worse" ones. Sigh.
Lonewolf2003 wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:29 am
Coryn wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:20 am Top 4 are kinda untouchable it seems. The only one I don’t rank as highly is Kurosawa. That made me wonder, what does Kurosawa do that Mizoguchi and Kobayashi don’t to put him so far ahead ?
Make more accessible movies in more popular/mainstream genres, so gathering more votes.
This is the short answer and you could say that, yes.
Coryn wrote: March 9th, 2021, 11:54 am Ive seen only 6 (rashomon, ikiru, seven samurai, yojimbo, derszu usala and Ran)

Cant say I was impressed as much with any of them as much as I was with Seppuku. Yojimbo was the only one I likes to be fair so it's a lost cause for now :)
Kobayashi has a ridiculously high quality in his top films, it's awe-inspiring really. But Kurosawa has SO MANY classics. There's a chance that Akira's films don't click with you, for whatever reasons, but among his fans, many will point out how the "lesser" ones such as Throne of Blood (<3), The Hidden Fortress, Red Beard, Kagemusha, Sanjuro, High As Low and Dreams range all from very good works to masterpieces on their own; and then you're still left with his early and/or noirish works. It's a once-in-a-century consistent career, if you ask me. I would have killed him if he really achieved suicide by 1971, there was still so much to come, man!
St. Gloede wrote: March 9th, 2021, 12:47 pm
Coryn wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:20 am Top 4 are kinda untouchable it seems. The only one I don’t rank as highly is Kurosawa. That made me wonder, what does Kurosawa do that Mizoguchi and Kobayashi don’t to put him so far ahead ?
Spoiler
Kobayashi is rather an odd one out for being this high to begin with - though I'm even more shocked he's been consistently high from the beginning. It shows just how quickly we got involved - impressive.

Until Criterion released the Human Conditions trilogy in 2009 (a few years before our poll started) only Seppuku, Samurai Rebellion and Kaidan were widely available. Since then more or less his entire filmography has slowly been dusted out and presented back into the canon.

That's incredible - and it is clear that he impressed.

However, it is still a little confounding to see him here as besides these key 6 films, and a few additions like The Inheritance and perhaps Inn of Evil or Black River none of his other films have caught on to a notable degree.

He started out making fairy standard melodramas and studio efforts for the first act of his career - all of which is now available thanks to Criterion - and they are, adequate. That's 8 weaker films - and some throw in Black River there - only seemingly impressed by what he did later - and then you have the tail-end of his career - with the 3 films he did after Kaseki still not being widely available - so it really would seem to be that people are voting him in based on 6-8 films. Which is fine, of course, Tarkovsky and a few others made that number - and those with Human Conditions, Seppuku, Kaidan and possibly others in their top 10-100 certainly has good incentive to do so, but;

That is very different from Kurosawa's generally accepted consistently strong filmography of 30(+) films.

As for Mizoguchi - I think it is partially a question of not having the same number of top hitters as Kurosawa, and Kurosawa being slightly more versatile, i.e. he did Sumurai films, Noirs, Stark Dramas and Arthouse - Mizoguchi mainly stayed on the side of stark dramas giving him a slightly smaller group of ardent fans (ask a Kurosawa fan what their favourite Kurosawa film is and you'll likely get far more answers).

Mizoguchi also had a weaker early period - which luckily to him most of which is lost. He was only really able to do what he wanted to do from the late 30s and onwrds - even though he did make great films before then as well.
:poshclap: This is a very good summary.
St. Gloede wrote: March 9th, 2021, 3:27 pm I'm assuming Yoshida, Robbe-Grillet, Okamoto did not make the cut
You're right that each of these 3 should and could have it into the final list, given how much support they usually have in the <400 poll (for example). Not super weird, but a bit surprising, yeah.
OldAle1 wrote: March 9th, 2021, 1:40 pm I think the only two directors from my top two tiers that didn't make it are Lav Diaz and Bahram Beizai; I would hope the former would have a shot of creeping onto this list one of these years, but more people have to make time for his films (and love them, of course) and I guess that hasn't happened yet.
Diaz obviously has a few die-hard fans already. It really could help his cause if his films weren't 20 hours long on average. Makes your common Tarkovski and Bela Tarr look like the MCU in comparison - it's challenging, and they're not widely available, I reckon. Wrong way to measure popularity, I KNOW, but even foreign arthouse directors collect more than 400 IMDb ratings on their films, as Liaz hardly manages. Time will tell if he gets more exposure, I guess. With Kobayashi, it also took a while ...
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#459

Post by pitchorneirda »

joachimt wrote: March 9th, 2021, 4:50 pm I'd be interested in country-breakdown and year-of-birth-breakdown. No idea if it's easy to get such stats. Probably not.
Top 200, by decade of birth

1870 1
1880 7
1890 16
1900 24
1910 15
1920 22
1930 24
1940 33
1950 24
1960 25
1970 9

Victor Sjöström is the oldest (1879) and Don Hertzfeldt the youngest (1976)
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
joachimt
Donator
Posts: 33902
Joined: February 16th, 2012, 7:00 am
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

#460

Post by joachimt »

pitchorneirda wrote: March 9th, 2021, 7:51 pm Now if someone knows a way of doing a IMDb list without entering each name one by one...I'm all ears (I have the IMDb links)
Never tried the IMDb list helper on people, but I guess it should work.
https://greasyfork.org/en/scripts/11617 ... ist-helper
ICM-profile
Fergenaprido: "I find your OCD to be adorable, J"
User avatar
Onderhond
Posts: 6854
Joined: December 23rd, 2012, 7:00 am
Contact:

#461

Post by Onderhond »

pitchorneirda wrote: March 9th, 2021, 8:35 pm and Don Hertzfeldt the youngest (1976)
(u)
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#462

Post by pitchorneirda »

So here's the IMDb list (thanks joachim, it only half worked but it saved me a couple of hours anyway):

https://www.imdb.com/list/ls089948325/
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
Torgo
Posts: 2939
Joined: June 30th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

#463

Post by Torgo »

pitchorneirda wrote: March 9th, 2021, 7:47 pm 202. Sam Raimi - Change: -38
208. Andrzej Zulawski - Change: +102
210. Yasuzô Masumura - Change: +46
214. D.W. Griffith - Change: +33
215. Gus Van Sant - Change: -53
216. Mervyn LeRoy - Change: -44
223. Yoshishige Yoshida - Change: +34
226. Ousmane Sembene - Change: -37
230. William Friedkin - Change: -6
235. Todd Haynes - Change: -30
236. Kenneth Anger - Change: +66
241. Emir Kusturica - Change: -57
242. Miklós Jancsó - Change: +107
243. John Sturges - Change: +19
264. John Waters - Change: -19
266. Robert Aldrich - Change: +19
268. John Hughes - Change: +225
269. Otto Preminger - Change: -52
281. Mel Brooks - Change: +122
288. James Benning - Change: +26
289. M. Night Shyamalan - Change: -22
299. Guillermo del Toro - Change: -27
301. Pedro Costa - Change: +59
Only a few which I expected to pop up, especially Sam Raimi - the horror mafia must be hit hard this time. Also, lol @257. George Miller - Change: +1130

Wait, huge WHAT on the following:
305. Paul W.S. Anderson - Change: -19
He's one of the worst fucking people active in film industry, seriously? Like, 3 1/2 films were more watchable than you'd expect, but really?
User avatar
Onderhond
Posts: 6854
Joined: December 23rd, 2012, 7:00 am
Contact:

#464

Post by Onderhond »

Torgo wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:05 pm He's one of the worst fucking people active in film industry
Is he? One of the few in Hollywood who dares to commit to fun and entertainment without making too much concessions. He's not a great director, but his films are pretty fun to watch. A guy like Spielberg could learn a thing or two from him.
User avatar
Torgo
Posts: 2939
Joined: June 30th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

#465

Post by Torgo »

Onderhond wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:08 pm
Torgo wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:05 pm He's one of the worst fucking people active in film industry
Is he?
I'm afraid so, yes.
:/
User avatar
Coryn
Posts: 1608
Joined: December 5th, 2018, 2:53 pm
Contact:

#466

Post by Coryn »

Are you able to share your raw data ?
I for example want to know who else voted for Klimov or any other director and where they placed them.
I saved Latin, what did you ever do ?
User avatar
brokenface
Donator
Posts: 13852
Joined: December 29th, 2011, 7:00 am
Contact:

#467

Post by brokenface »

Lonewolf2003 wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:29 am
Coryn wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:20 am Top 4 are kinda untouchable it seems. The only one I don’t rank as highly is Kurosawa. That made me wonder, what does Kurosawa do that Mizoguchi and Kobayashi don’t to put him so far ahead ?
Make more accessible movies in more popular/mainstream genres, so gathering more votes.
Also Kurosawa also had advantage of longevity. Mizoguchi died relatively young (58) and at his peak really, on a run of extraordinary films in the 50s. If he'd lived as long as Kurosawa he could've still have been making movies into the 1980s. Would've been interesting to see where he would've gone in the 60s

On flipside had Kurosawa died at 58 like Mizoguchi we'd not have had anything from Dodeskaden on. Okay, he was less prolific then but there would've been no colour films, no Ran, Kagemusha, Dersu Uzala.
User avatar
tobias
Posts: 505
Joined: February 4th, 2017, 7:00 am
Contact:

#468

Post by tobias »

St. Gloede wrote: March 9th, 2021, 12:47 pm
Coryn wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:20 am Top 4 are kinda untouchable it seems. The only one I don’t rank as highly is Kurosawa. That made me wonder, what does Kurosawa do that Mizoguchi and Kobayashi don’t to put him so far ahead ?
Kobayashi is rather an odd one out for being this high to begin with - though I'm even more shocked he's been consistently high from the beginning. It shows just how quickly we got involved - impressive.

Until Criterion released the Human Conditions trilogy in 2009 (a few years before our poll started) only Seppuku, Samurai Rebellion and Kaidan were widely available. Since then more or less his entire filmography has slowly been dusted out and presented back into the canon.

That's incredible - and it is clear that he impressed.

However, it is still a little confounding to see him here as besides these key 6 films, and a few additions like The Inheritance and perhaps Inn of Evil or Black River none of his other films have caught on to a notable degree.

He started out making fairy standard melodramas and studio efforts for the first act of his career - all of which is now available thanks to Criterion - and they are, adequate. That's 8 weaker films - and some throw in Black River there - only seemingly impressed by what he did later - and then you have the tail-end of his career - with the 3 films he did after Kaseki still not being widely available - so it really would seem to be that people are voting him in based on 6-8 films. Which is fine, of course, Tarkovsky and a few others made that number - and those with Human Conditions, Seppuku, Kaidan and possibly others in their top 10-100 certainly has good incentive to do so, but;

That is very different from Kurosawa's generally accepted consistently strong filmography of 30(+) films.

As for Mizoguchi - I think it is partially a question of not having the same number of top hitters as Kurosawa, and Kurosawa being slightly more versatile, i.e. he did Sumurai films, Noirs, Stark Dramas and Arthouse - Mizoguchi mainly stayed on the side of stark dramas giving him a slightly smaller group of ardent fans (ask a Kurosawa fan what their favourite Kurosawa film is and you'll likely get far more answers).

Mizoguchi also had a weaker early period - which luckily to him most of which is lost. He was only really able to do what he wanted to do from the late 30s and onwrds - even though he did make great films before then as well.
The moment I came here it was always obvious that the board loves Kobayashi, so the high placement doesn't really surprise me. I assume a lot of it rests on the Human Condition which is basically the length of 5-7 "normal" feature films. If you take that into account his filmography doesn't seem more restricted than Kubrick's necessarily. I also rank Feuillade rather highly despite having seen only 2 of his films. I assume it's the same effect here (also this board really loves long and grounded narratives, especially if war is involved).

That being said I haven't seen The Human Condition. I've always thought it looks great but I've never gotten around to it. Not being very impressed by Kwaidan or Seppuku didn't really help to make it a priority (I liked both but neither left a lasting impression).

I think most of your observations are spot on though.
User avatar
tobias
Posts: 505
Joined: February 4th, 2017, 7:00 am
Contact:

#469

Post by tobias »

OldAle1 wrote: March 9th, 2021, 1:40 pm I think the only two directors from my top two tiers that didn't make it are Lav Diaz and Bahram Beizai; I would hope the former would have a shot of creeping onto this list one of these years, but more people have to make time for his films (and love them, of course) and I guess that hasn't happened yet. Beizai is a harder call because so many of his films are inaccessible in anything but horrendous condition, so you have to be an obsessive in the first place to go there. Still, one of them is on Criterion now so who knows. Anyway those are the two I'm most interested in seeing the numbers for.
Never heard of the later. Any recommendations?
User avatar
pitchorneirda
Posts: 849
Joined: February 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm
Location: France
Contact:

#470

Post by pitchorneirda »

Coryn wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:30 pm Are you able to share your raw data ?
I for example want to know who else voted for Klimov or any other director and where they placed them.
https://we.tl/t-wyeeXQRbYX

Basic spreadsheet with usernames, directors' names, points awarded and ranks (with "NA" as rank if that's a part that is unranked)
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
User avatar
tobias
Posts: 505
Joined: February 4th, 2017, 7:00 am
Contact:

#471

Post by tobias »

OldAle1 wrote: March 9th, 2021, 6:26 pm
Torgo wrote: March 9th, 2021, 6:19 pm
The Republic of China Taiwan having more directors (4) than China (1!) and Hong Kong (2) combined: :blink:
That fact all by itself is strong confirmation of the arthouse bias of this forum.
Is it? Hong Kong is maybe a different story but mainland China has very few directors that are popular in the west and most of them tend to be more along the lines of what people call arthouse as well.

Also I forgot to vote but here are my top 50 directors which missed the cut (though it's been a while I've updated the list):
-Manoel de Oliveira - 21
-Straub-Huillet - 36
-Olivier Assayas - 47 (just watched Carlos, might bump him up a couple of spots, one of my favourite currently working directors, though unfortunately the last decade after Carlos was a bit weak)
-Georg Wilhelm Pabst - 50

In the next 10 there's 3 more:
-Peter Watkins - 54
-Helmut Käutner - 58
-Christian Petzold - 59

Perhaps unsurprisingly all Western Europeans but I'd like to add that Jia Zhangke, Ousmane Sembene and Andrzej Zulawski have a good shot at cracking the top 50 at some point. I just haven't seen that much yet.
User avatar
OldAle1
Donator
Posts: 6025
Joined: February 9th, 2017, 7:00 am
Location: Dairyland, USA
Contact:

#472

Post by OldAle1 »

Bashu, the Little Stranger is his most widely available and I think probably his best, though I've seen each only once. Downpour just appeared recently on Criterion, so that would be a good option also. But I really like or love all 7 features and 2 shorts I've seen; he's very different from the other Iranian filmmakers of his generation like Kiarostami and Mehrjui in that his films are more overtly theatrical and also I think more indebted to western traditions (besides the usual Italian neorealism) - he's heavily influenced by Brecht, which can be seen most clearly in Death of Yazdgerd, and his rather amazing Maybe Some Other Time might remind you of our #4 director, and one of his best-known films in particular. He started out as a playwright and has in recent years taught Iranian culture at Stanford. I've found some of his lectures online but so far all that I've come across have been in unsubbed Farsi :(
User avatar
Fergenaprido
Donator
Posts: 5483
Joined: June 3rd, 2014, 6:00 am
Location: Canada
Contact:

#473

Post by Fergenaprido »

Torgo wrote: March 9th, 2021, 10:05 pm Only a few which I expected to pop up, especially Sam Raimi - the horror mafia must be hit hard this time. Also, lol @257. George Miller - Change: +1130
It could be people mixing up or combining the two different George Millers.

George Miller - The Man from Snowy River, The Neverending Story 2, & Andre
George Miller - Mad Max, Babe 2, & Happy Feet

icm unfortunately can't distinguish between two people with the same name (thus their filmographies are combined into one).
User avatar
St. Gloede
Moderator
Posts: 12373
Joined: May 6th, 2011, 6:00 am
Contact:

#474

Post by St. Gloede »

tobias wrote: March 9th, 2021, 11:39 pm
OldAle1 wrote: March 9th, 2021, 6:26 pm
Torgo wrote: March 9th, 2021, 6:19 pm
The Republic of China Taiwan having more directors (4) than China (1!) and Hong Kong (2) combined: :blink:
That fact all by itself is strong confirmation of the arthouse bias of this forum.
Is it? Hong Kong is maybe a different story but mainland China has very few directors that are popular in the west and most of them tend to be more along the lines of what people call arthouse as well.
The top 5th generation filmmakers like Kaige Chen and especially Yimou Zhang has had a lot of support by Western critics.
User avatar
Torgo
Posts: 2939
Joined: June 30th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

#475

Post by Torgo »

Hm, I still wouldn't know why suddenly so many people wanted to boost the other Miller, but not the year before.

It's funny how the popular George Miller already seems like two different directors merged into one with his vita of Mad Max + cute piglet and dancing penguins. :lol:
User avatar
mightysparks
Site Admin
Posts: 31429
Joined: May 5th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Perth, WA, Australia
Contact:

#476

Post by mightysparks »

Torgo wrote: March 9th, 2021, 8:05 pm
mightysparks wrote: March 9th, 2021, 5:01 am These lists always make me realise just how little directors matter to me. Still, glad to see Kubrick continuing to reign supreme.
Funny how differently people may perceive this. This list really makes me want to fill gaps for my favorite directors and freshly explore the ones I'm unacustomed to. :)
Average people - you know, those from the street who decide over box office success and watch TV and VOD and all that - mostly concentrate on popular actors & actresses; besides stories, of course. Seems so unadvanced to me.
Don’t find much difference between directors or actors tbh. Both equally important/irrelevant. I usually only like one film by a director and don’t find many very consistent. Every time a director came up I would just be like meh, even if I voted for them. Not a slight on the list, I just don’t have that connection with directors. I’m the same with bands and artists too though so idk.
"I do not always know what I want, but I do know what I don't want." - Stanley Kubrick

iCM | IMDb | LastFM | TSZDT

Image
User avatar
cinewest
Posts: 2268
Joined: February 15th, 2017, 7:00 am
Contact:

#477

Post by cinewest »

Ridiculously low placements for Armand Desplechin (480)- I guess outdoorcats didn’t participate.

Same for Lucrecia Martel ( and women filmmakers in general) Martel has 4 films in the TSP top 250 for the 21st century... somebody might want to point out that Martel hasn’t been around long enough, but I would say at least as long as Yorgos Lathinos.

And I didn’t even see perhaps my favorite filmmaker from the 2010’s (Sergei Loznitsa) on the list....
Last edited by cinewest on March 10th, 2021, 4:35 am, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Torgo
Posts: 2939
Joined: June 30th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

#478

Post by Torgo »

cinewest wrote: March 10th, 2021, 1:53 am Where did Elia Kazan show up? Somehow I miss his name every time I scan the list
->
pitchorneirda wrote: March 6th, 2021, 7:35 pm #75 (⇩14, #61) Elia Kazan
Points:
108.09
(26 Votes)

Top 1–5–10: 0–0–0

History: 7561857662496157←47
Spoiler
Image
Key Film: On the Waterfront (1954) – 29 Official Lists, also on IMdb

List of Voters (26):
Image
User avatar
cinewest
Posts: 2268
Joined: February 15th, 2017, 7:00 am
Contact:

#479

Post by cinewest »

Torgo wrote: March 10th, 2021, 2:05 am
cinewest wrote: March 10th, 2021, 1:53 am Where did Elia Kazan show up? Somehow I miss his name every time I scan the list
->
pitchorneirda wrote: March 6th, 2021, 7:35 pm #75 (⇩14, #61) Elia Kazan
Points:
108.09
(26 Votes)

Top 1–5–10: 0–0–0

History: 7561857662496157←47
Spoiler
Image
Key Film: On the Waterfront (1954) – 29 Official Lists, also on IMdb

List of Voters (26):
Image
Thanks, I finally found him and edited my post to be about something else.
As for Kazan, I like his body of work better than Wilder’s, and despite the fact that he betrayed his friends and colleagues during the McCarthy hearings (Arthur Miller, his best friend, later forgave him), I consider I’m to be one of the most important American filmmakers of the 50’s
User avatar
Torgo
Posts: 2939
Joined: June 30th, 2011, 6:00 am
Location: Germany
Contact:

#480

Post by Torgo »

tobias wrote: March 9th, 2021, 11:09 pm
St. Gloede wrote: March 9th, 2021, 12:47 pm Until Criterion released the Human Conditions trilogy in 2009 (a few years before our poll started) only Seppuku, Samurai Rebellion and Kaidan were widely available. Since then more or less his entire filmography has slowly been dusted out and presented back into the canon.
The moment I came here it was always obvious that the board loves Kobayashi, so the high placement doesn't really surprise me. I assume a lot of it rests on the Human Condition which is basically the length of 5-7 "normal" feature films. If you take that into account his filmography doesn't seem more restricted than Kubrick's necessarily. I also rank Feuillade rather highly despite having seen only 2 of his films. I assume it's the same effect here (also this board really loves long and grounded narratives, especially if war is involved).

That being said I haven't seen The Human Condition. I've always thought it looks great but I've never gotten around to it. Not being very impressed by Kwaidan or Seppuku didn't really help to make it a priority (I liked both but neither left a lasting impression).
May I add for further reference that
- On RateYourMusic, which has also a solid film database (rather artsy), the 300 best films of all time include Seppuku (#6) and The Human Condition 3 at #29 (1 & 2 at #75 and #209), while the two other big films also make it to ranks of 200-300
- On IMDb, his key films have insane ratings of 8.4-8.8 - something that you don't even see in the filmography for Bergman or so - and with Seppuku finally entering the Top 250 after years in the dark, no less than at #29
- On Letterboxd, in the 250 Greatest there's Harakiri at #4 and Human Condition 3 at #8 (further Conditions apply to #18 & #43)

.. so, it's not just a forum mafia thing :)
Post Reply