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World Cup, Season 4, Match 2D: Estonia vs Spain (Jul 5th)

500<400, Favourite 1001 movies, Doubling the Canon, Film World Cup and many other votes
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World Cup, Season 4, Match 2D: Estonia vs Spain (Jul 5th)

#1

Post by joachimt »

This is match 2D of the fourth season of iCM Forum's Film World Cup.

CountryOriginal TitleEnglish TitleYearManagerIMDBICM
EstoniaNovember2017jvvlinklink
SpainLa cazaThe Hunt1966PeacefulAnarchylinklink

Screenshots
November
Image

La caza
Image
Voting Rules:
- You must watch both films before you vote.
- To vote, post which of the two movies is your favorite. (note: you're ranking the individual films, not the countries)

Voting deadline = Jul 5th
Countdown till deadline

The country that ends at 1st place proceeds to the next round. The ranking of the match will be decided using these rules:
- Movie with most votes wins.
- In case of a tie the match will have a 3 day extension.
- In case there's still a tie then, the next voter decides by sudden death.
Here's a quick summary of how the tournament works
We start with 32 films from 32 countries. Each country has a manager who determines which movie will be watched. In the first round the countries are divided into 8 groups of 4. From each group the countries that end up at #1 and #2 proceed to the next round. In the 2nd round the 16 remaining countries will be divided into 8 matches of 2. The managers pick a new movie. The winner of each match proceeds to the next round. This continues till the final.
iCM-list of all movies in this World Cup

List of all topics related to the World Cup including previous seasons
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#2

Post by Mario Gaborović »

1. La caza
2. November
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#3

Post by zuma »

01 - November

02 - La caza
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#4

Post by hurluberlu »

1. November 7
2. La Caza 7-
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#5

Post by Armoreska »

we're into already-seen territory
November 5
La caza 4+

and another animal cruelty film, ofc. anyhow the other barely squeaked by it
he or A. or Armo or any

Image
currently working towards a vegan/free world + thru such film lists: GODARD, r/antinatalism recommends,..
the rest
ANARCHISTS, ANIMAL RIGHTS, Assisted suicide, Existential films, SOCIALIST CINEMA (an amalgamation of lists), Feminist lists, various GSSRM lists (aka LGBTQ+), 2010s bests, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, mah huge sci-fi list, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
/forum.icmforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo
imaginary awards | youtube channels | complaint lounge | explain how big a fan of slavery you are here, ..viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1535 and here: ..viewtopic.php?f=12&t=4484
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#6

Post by beavis »

1. November - 8.5
2. La Caza - 7.5

Loved November!
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#7

Post by 72aicm »

1. La caza 8/10
2. November 7.5/10

Loved the opening scene in November. Still not good enough to beat the old favourite La caza though.
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#8

Post by klaus78 »

1. La caza (Spain) 7/10
2. November (Estonia) 7/10
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#9

Post by bjornam »

1. November
2. La caza

Feels weird to vote against Saura, but personally I prefer quite a few of the films of his that followed this one. November was a beatiful and quite original one, one of my favourites from the last few years.
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#10

Post by Angel Glez »

1.La caza
2.November

The only really great Saura, the only time that his movie works and its associated allegory* works.

*Not sure foreigners realize this, do you?
Spoiler
(Spanish Civil War)
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#11

Post by joachimt »

Image November: 5
Image La caza: 4
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#12

Post by Muellwind »

1. La caza
2. November
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#13

Post by filmbantha »

Although November is wildly original and beautiful to look at for some reason it left me underwhelmed. If anyone enjoyed the horror elements of November then I would recommend seeking out Hagazussa. It's been a while since I have seen La Caza but it was a 7/10 so it's the clear winner for me here.

1. La caza 7/10
2. November 5/10
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#14

Post by hurluberlu »

Angel Glez wrote: June 22nd, 2020, 9:38 am The only really great Saura, the only time that his movie works and its associated allegory* works.

*Not sure foreigners realize this, do you?
Spoiler
(Spanish Civil War)
They are Franquist hunting on a former Civil War battlefield so it is barely an allegory ;). Or you need to extend it to Spain. But that is the issue I have with the film (and why it is not a masterpiece in my book) it lacks subtely in many regards (also abusing from close shots, drumbeats, voice-overs...).
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#15

Post by Angel Glez »

hurluberlu wrote: June 23rd, 2020, 7:52 pm
Angel Glez wrote: June 22nd, 2020, 9:38 am The only really great Saura, the only time that his movie works and its associated allegory* works.

*Not sure foreigners realize this, do you?
Spoiler
(Spanish Civil War)
They are Franquist hunting on a former Civil War battlefield so it is barely an allegory ;). Or you need to extend it to Spain. But that is the issue I have with the film (and why it is not a masterpiece in my book) it lacks subtely in many regards (also abusing from close shots, drumbeats, voice-overs...).
Subtlety does not characterize Saura's cinema. :P

Not only location has a symbolic meaning, also actions, words, characters and even casting (!) have.
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#16

Post by edward5 »

1. November
2. La caza
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#17

Post by jvv »

1. November
2. La caza
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#18

Post by joachimt »

1. November 9/10 :wub:
2. La caza 7/10
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#19

Post by zhangalan »

1. La Caza
2. November
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#20

Post by joachimt »

Image November: 8
Image La caza: 7
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#21

Post by Smoover »

1. November 7/10
2. La caza 6.5/10
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#22

Post by Cocoa »

1. La caza 5/10
2. November 4/10

The black and white cinematography in November is amazing. Unfortunately, everything else about the film is awful and I felt pain while watching the film because it was so bad. La caza was mostly meh, sometimes the cinematography was good but overall the story is just meh and there are some cringe moments. The film gets worse near the 2/3 point of the film and it never recovers. Carlos Saura has better films than this.
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#23

Post by Armoreska »

Cocoa wrote: July 2nd, 2020, 9:33 pm 1. La caza 5/10
2. November 4/10

The black and white cinematography in November is amazing. Unfortunately, everything else about the film is awful and I felt pain while watching the film because it was so bad. La caza was mostly meh, sometimes the cinematography was good but overall the story is just meh and there are some cringe moments. The film gets worse near the 2/3 point of the film and it never recovers. Carlos Saura has better films than this.
We finally pretty much agree
he or A. or Armo or any

Image
currently working towards a vegan/free world + thru such film lists: GODARD, r/antinatalism recommends,..
the rest
ANARCHISTS, ANIMAL RIGHTS, Assisted suicide, Existential films, SOCIALIST CINEMA (an amalgamation of lists), Feminist lists, various GSSRM lists (aka LGBTQ+), 2010s bests, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, mah huge sci-fi list, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
/forum.icmforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo
imaginary awards | youtube channels | complaint lounge | explain how big a fan of slavery you are here, ..viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1535 and here: ..viewtopic.php?f=12&t=4484
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#24

Post by clemmetarey »

1. November (2017) 9/10
2. La caza (1966) 5/10

November is one of the highlight of this year for me.
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#25

Post by zzzorf »

1. November (2017) 7/10
2. La caza (1966) 5/10
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#26

Post by kingink »

1. November (2017) 9/10 (Where can I find a kratt? :D )
2. La caza (1966) 6/10
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#27

Post by weirdboy »

1. November (2017) - Rainer Sarnet
2. La caza AKA The Hunt (1966) - Carlos Saura [re-watch]
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#28

Post by joachimt »

Looks like this is the decisive gap.

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#29

Post by Mario Gaborović »

Image November: 13
Image La caza: 8

1.5 day left.
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#30

Post by Nathan Treadway »

Looks like I'm going to end the streak.

1. La Caza
2. November
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#31

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

:( I'm watching Novemeber tomorrow so I'll get a vote in, I hope.
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#32

Post by Gorro »

I'm going to miss this round and probably the next as well. I'm on holiday and didn't get around to watching the Spanish entry (and neither of the films in the next round).
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#33

Post by burneyfan »

1. La caza
2. November

Both great movies, thank you!
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#34

Post by wasabi »

01 - November -- I really like dark fairy tale.

02 - La caza
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#35

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

1. La caza
2. November

November's not my kind of weird.
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#36

Post by Fergenaprido »

Forgot this match was ending today. Managed to finish November with 10 minutes to spare.

1. La caza - 7ish
2. November - 7ish

I only knew about The Hunt because of the controversy over the rabbit hunting, but after seeing it I don't think it's nearly that controversial.
Spoiler
I'd argue the killing of the marten or even the beetle as more unnecessary; at least the rabbits were all eaten and other parts used
Taut and effective, and a rare film with no likeable characters that I actually enjoyed. But where did the dog disappear to halfway through?

November just didn't hit it with me. Beautiful cinematography, but sometimes too washed out or too dark to actually make out what was happening. Acting was solid, story was solid (especially the folklore of the kratts), but it felt overlong and didn't coalesce into anything substantial for me. It does make me want to read the book, though.
Spoiler
And why didn't the plague kill everyone after swearing to spare the two young folk? That didn't make sense to me. Also, when that guy ate the shit-filled bread, I was eating chocolate-dipped dried mango; I almost vomited right then and there. And did he really rape the servant? Or was that just him fantasizing? I couldn't tell. And the baron was really effete and effeminate... was he lusting over Hans and that's why he made him overseer?
Oh, and I was going to comment that this film definitely should be on the Weird list... just checked it and it is indeed; don't know why I thought it was unofficial.

Thanks to both managers for selecting these films that I probably would have kept putting off watching for years.
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#37

Post by joachimt »

Deadline is over. Estonia wins. Congratulations to jvv.
Also thanks to PeacefulAnarchy for his pick and to the 26 people who voted this match.

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#38

Post by Armoreska »

Spain follows Japan home. Open invitation for Poland to take a comfortable all-time lead.
This is what happens to rabbit murderers :whistling:
Estonia-Georgia QFs come on!
he or A. or Armo or any

Image
currently working towards a vegan/free world + thru such film lists: GODARD, r/antinatalism recommends,..
the rest
ANARCHISTS, ANIMAL RIGHTS, Assisted suicide, Existential films, SOCIALIST CINEMA (an amalgamation of lists), Feminist lists, various GSSRM lists (aka LGBTQ+), 2010s bests, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, mah huge sci-fi list, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
/forum.icmforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo
imaginary awards | youtube channels | complaint lounge | explain how big a fan of slavery you are here, ..viewtopic.php?f=12&t=1535 and here: ..viewtopic.php?f=12&t=4484
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