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World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 8th, 2020, 8:00 pm
by joachimt
This is match 1F of the fourth season of iCM Forum's Film World Cup.

CountryOriginal TitleEnglish TitleYearManagerIMDBICM
BrazilA Alma do OssoThe Soul of the Bone2004beavislinklink
GreeceI fotografiaThe Photograph1986burneyfanlinklink
JapanTsigoineruwaizenZigeunerweisen1980Gordon_Gekkolinklink
PolandKorczak1990sebbylinklink

ScreenshotsShow
A Alma do Osso
Image

I fotografia
Image

Tsigoineruwaizen
Image

Korczak
Image
Voting Rules:
- You must watch all 4 films before you vote.
- To vote, rank the 4 films from most favorite to least favorite. (note: you're ranking the individual films, not the countries)

Voting deadline = Apr 5th
Countdown till deadline

The countries that end at 1st and 2nd place proceed to the next round. The ranking of the match will be decided using these rules:
- Ranked by highest average ranking (= lowest number).
- In case of a tie between two movies, head-to-head determines the winner (how many people thought A>B and how many thought B>A).
- In case there's still a tie after the previous rule or there is a tie between three or four movies, most #1-votes determines the winner.
- Still a tie? Fewest #4-votes determines the winner.
- Still a tie? The match will have a 3 day extension (except when the tie is only between #3 and #4).
Here's a quick summary of how the tournament worksShow
We start with 32 films from 32 countries. Each country has a manager who determines which movie will be watched. In the first round the countries are divided into 8 groups of 4. From each group the countries that end up at #1 and #2 proceed to the next round. In the 2nd round the 16 remaining countries will be divided into 8 matches of 2. The managers pick a new movie. The winner of each match proceeds to the next round. This continues till the final.
iCM-list of all movies in this World Cup

List of all topics related to the World Cup including previous seasons

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 8th, 2020, 8:24 pm
by 72aicm
1. Korczak
2. I fotografia
3. A Alma do Osso
4. Tsigoineruwaizen

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 8th, 2020, 8:32 pm
by Mario Gaborović
1. Korczak
2. A Alma do Osso
3. I fotografia
4. Tsigoineruwaizen

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 8th, 2020, 9:51 pm
by Armoreska
What an OP group. Two previous winners, top of the ranks in all time success, #11 Greece and #19 Brazil.
Japan off into a hole from the start (again actually).

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 10th, 2020, 12:50 am
by Cocoa
1. Tsigoineruwaizen 7/10
2. Korczak 6/10
3. I fotografia 4/10
4. A Alma do Osso 3/10

THE BOREDOM I felt watching most of these films (plus annoyance in the case of I fotografia). A Alma do Osso would have been ranked third or second if it was just scenery shots and no man. The film gave me no reason to care about the guy and I would have liked some narration at the beginning to give me a reason to care but then the man ends up rambling near the end and I end up disliking the film even more so maybe no sound at all would have been better. Tsigoineruwaizen was the only film I watched years ago out of this group and I remember the colors fondly. Korczak was decent but made me yawn frequently. I watched Korczak immediately after A Alma do Osso, so perhaps the first film made me sleepy from boredom while the second just had a bunch of slow moments that could have been cut without harming the film overall.

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 10th, 2020, 10:43 pm
by pitchorneirda
1. I Fotografia
2. Korczak
3. A Alma do Osso
4. Tsigoineruwaizen

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 14th, 2020, 10:58 am
by jvv
1. Korczak
2. Tsigoineruwaizen
3. I Fotografia
4. A Alma do Osso

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 14th, 2020, 7:08 pm
by klaus78
1. A Alma do Osso (Brazil) 8/10
2. Korczak (Poland) 7/10
3. Tsigoineruwaizen (Japan) 7/10
4. I fotografia (Greece) 7/10

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 16th, 2020, 8:46 am
by Mario Gaborović
Image Korczak 15-3
Image I fotografia 8-10
Image A Alma do Osso 7-11
Image Tsigoineruwaizen 6-12

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 16th, 2020, 8:59 am
by joachimt
Image

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 16th, 2020, 9:20 am
by Armoreska
If Japan loses, Poland may become the #1 all time WC country

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 17th, 2020, 4:35 am
by sebby
Armoreska wrote:
March 16th, 2020, 9:20 am
If Japan loses, Poland may become the #1 all time WC country
Finally, #1 in something other than vodka-fueled wedding outbursts.

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 18th, 2020, 5:24 am
by zhangalan
1. I Fotografia
2. Tsigoineruwaizen
3. Korczak
4. A Alma do Osso

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 19th, 2020, 6:34 pm
by joachimt
Image

Image

Image

Image

Is he talking about the Covid-19 crisis?

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 19th, 2020, 6:50 pm
by mjf314
I haven't seen the others, but I'm surprised that Tsigoineruwaizen is doing poorly. I thought it was very good.

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 20th, 2020, 11:37 am
by Smoover
1. Korczak 8.0/10
2. A Alma do Osso 6.0/10
3. Tsigoineruwaizen 5.0/10
4. I Fotografia 5.0/10

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 21st, 2020, 7:20 am
by joachimt
1. Korczak 8-
2. I Fotografia 7+
3. Tsigoineruwaizen 7-
4. A Alma do Osso 6

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 22nd, 2020, 1:59 am
by Armoreska
Korczak 7-
Zigeunerweisen 5-
I fotografia 4
A Alma do Osso 3+

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 26th, 2020, 10:07 pm
by clemmetarey
1. Tsigoineruwaizen (1980) 6/10
2. I fotografia (1986) 6/10
3. Korczak (1990) 5/10
4. A Alma do Osso (2004) 5/10

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 27th, 2020, 4:40 pm
by beavis
A Alma do Osso - 8.5
Zigeunerweisen - 8.5
Korczak - 8
I fotografia - 7

damn, pool of death for me here... :)
best round of the cup!!

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 27th, 2020, 6:32 pm
by kingink
1. I Fotografia
2. Korczak
3. Tsigoineruwaizen
4. A Alma do Osso

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 27th, 2020, 7:32 pm
by joachimt
Image

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 27th, 2020, 8:08 pm
by Mario Gaborović
Image Korczak 29-10
Image I fotografia 19-20
Image Tsigoineruwaizen 17-22
Image A Alma do Osso 13-26

9.5 days left.

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 28th, 2020, 6:48 am
by joachimt
Mario Gaborović wrote:
March 27th, 2020, 8:08 pm
Image Korczak 29-10
Image I fotografia 19-20
Image Tsigoineruwaizen 17-22
Image A Alma do Osso 13-26

9.5 days left.
Double check:

Image Korczak: 1.769 (29-10)
Image I fotografia: 2.538 (19-20)
Image Tsigoineruwaizen: 2.615 (18-21)
Image A Alma do Osso: 3.077 (12-27)

Let's both recount...

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 28th, 2020, 6:51 am
by joachimt
I can't find mistakes in my count.

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 28th, 2020, 8:34 am
by Mario Gaborović
joachimt wrote:
March 28th, 2020, 6:51 am
I can't find mistakes in my count.
That's possible, I often go wrong with these numbers. So we'll take your count.

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: March 30th, 2020, 9:32 am
by weirdboy
1. Tsigoineruwaizen ツウィゴイネルワイゼン AKA Zigeunerweisen (1980) - Seijun Suzuki
2. Korczak (1990) - Andrzej Wajda
3. I fotografia (1986) - Nikos Papatakis
4. A Alma do Osso AKA The Soul of the Bone (2004) - Cao Guimarães

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 11:39 am
by filmbantha
This was a mixed bag for me, quite a range of scores:

1. I Fotografia - 7/10
SpoilerShow
The Photograph is a gripping Greek tale of obsession and betrayal set during a time of political turmoil for the nation. It follows the exploits of Ilias, a young soldier who is forced to leave Greece due to his father's ties with communism, as he seeks refuge in France with a distant relative.

This is a simple yet fascinating story involving a lie that spirals rapidly out of control, which is handled incredibly well as the narrative tangles with comedy and tragedy in equal measure. The way in which Director Nikos Papatakis weaves these two aspects together creates an uncomfortable experience - but one that we cannot look away from - as Ilias finds himself in a predicament of his own making that there seems to be no escape from. Both a sombre meditation on the military dictatorship in 1970s Greece and a riveting exploration of human morality, The Photograph is a minor classic of Greek cinema that is deserving of far more exposure.
2. Korczak - 6/10
SpoilerShow
Based upon the moving account of a Jewish intellect who devoted his time to the children he cared for in his orphanage, Korczak is a troubling account of the atrocities that became commonplace during World War Two in Poland. This bleak film from Andrzej Wajda is shot in black and white and paints a poignant picture of a selfless and dedicated man as Korczak consistently puts his needs second to those of his children, providing the ultimate sacrifice during a time of great turmoil.

Life for these orphans proves extremely gruelling due to the onset of war and this despair takes its toll on Korczak as he does all that he can to protect them. The harrowing subject matter is alleviated somewhat by the inspirational actions of Korczak but this is at times a difficult picture to endure. The film delivers an important message of hope yet it feels like a minor work in comparison to some of Wajda's other outings, as it lacks the emotional impact you would come to expect from a talented filmmaker adapting a story of this magnitude
3. Tsigoineruwaizen - 4/10
SpoilerShow
My first encounter with the eccentric work of Director Seijun Suzuki was not a great experience. Zigeunerweisen overreaches with its surreal psychological melodrama that encapsulates geishas, ghosts and German records, in a meandering storyline that appears to ignore the conventions of logic and reason. Somehow this film was nominated for nine Japanese Academy awards and won a total of four; perhaps much of this film's supposed brilliance is lost in translation but this was, at times, a real struggle to persevere with.

I would never completely disregard the oeuvre of a film-maker based upon a single film but it may be a while before I muster up the energy to tackle another of Suzuki's films. If anyone can recommend a film of his that is likely to change my perception on the Director then please point me in its direction. He appears to be highly regarded in his native country but this largely incoherent mess does little to confirm such a status.
4. A Alma do Osso - 3/10 - Not to my taste sadly.

Thanks to the managers for their picks! Fingers crossed we get to see more from Greece.

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 1:22 pm
by zuma
01 - Tsigoineruwaizen

02 - A Alma do Osso

03 - Korczak

04 - I Fotografia

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 3:14 pm
by Armoreska
pitchorneirda and zuma have flipped rankings, either order is curious

13/24 possible combinations, 5 repeat combinations
all 6/6 combinations with Alma placing last taken
0/6 with Korczak placing last
SpoilerShow
Kor-Foto-Alma-Zig 2
Kor-Foto-Zig-Alma 2 (JT,Sac)
Kor-Alma-Foto-Zig 2
Kor-Alma-Zig-Foto 1
Kor-Zig-Foto-Alma 5 (JVV,me,zzz)
Foto-Kor-Alma-Zig 3 (Pit,Bur,Mue)
Foto-Kor-Zig-Alma 2 (Ink,FBa)
Foto-Zig-Kor-Alma 2
Zig-Kor-Foto-Alma 2 (Coc,Wei)
Zig-Foto-Kor-Alma 1
Zig-Alma-Kor-Foto 1
Alma-Kor-Zig-Foto 3
Alma-Zig-Kor-Foto 1

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 5:02 pm
by joachimt
Armoreska wrote:
April 1st, 2020, 3:14 pm
pitchorneirda and zuma have flipped rankings, either order is curious

Still waiting for someone to agree with the official situation as last posted.

13/24 possible combinations, only 3 repeat combinations
all 6/6 combinations with Alma placing last taken
0/6 with Korczak placing last
SpoilerShow
Kor-Foto-Alma-Zig 1
Kor-Foto-Zig-Alma 1
Kor-Alma-Foto-Zig 1
Kor-Alma-Zig-Foto 1
Kor-Zig-Foto-Alma 2 (JVV,me)
Foto-Kor-Alma-Zig 1
Foto-Kor-Zig-Alma 2 (Ink,FBa)
Foto-Zig-Kor-Alma 1
Zig-Kor-Foto-Alma 2 (Coc,Wei)
Zig-Foto-Kor-Alma 1
Zig-Alma-Kor-Foto 1
Alma-Kor-Zig-Foto 1
Alma-Zig-Kor-Foto 1
Do you keep track of this every match? Manually or automated? My spreadsheet calculates this as well.

It has become a nice battle between Greece and Japan!

Image

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 7:48 pm
by kingink
Aaaaaa can I revote? Pleaseeeee.... :circle: :D

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 8:35 pm
by pitchorneirda
kingink wrote:
April 1st, 2020, 7:48 pm
Aaaaaa can I revote? Pleaseeeee.... :circle: :D
If you want to put Tsigoineruwaizen in 4th position, yes please let him revote ^^'

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 9:25 pm
by PGonzalez
kingink wrote:
April 1st, 2020, 7:48 pm
Aaaaaa can I revote? Pleaseeeee.... :circle: :D
Honest question, is this still allowed? I remember this happened in the first season, but I'm not sure if there's anything against it now.

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 10:04 pm
by kingink
pitchorneirda wrote:
April 1st, 2020, 8:35 pm
kingink wrote:
April 1st, 2020, 7:48 pm
Aaaaaa can I revote? Pleaseeeee.... :circle: :D
If you want to put Tsigoineruwaizen in 4th position, yes please let him revote ^^'
I would still save that position for A Alma do Osso I'm afraid. B) It didn't work for me.

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 10:05 pm
by kingink
PGonzalez wrote:
April 1st, 2020, 9:25 pm
kingink wrote:
April 1st, 2020, 7:48 pm
Aaaaaa can I revote? Pleaseeeee.... :circle: :D
Honest question, is this still allowed? I remember this happened in the first season, but I'm not sure if there's anything against it now.
Was it really allowed? :blink:

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 10:34 pm
by Armoreska
My understanding is you can still revote at any time until deadline, why not? :blink:
As long as you don't do this repeatedly, ofc.

@ JT
No, I noticed how all over the place the rankings were and looked into it. You've got the data - you should tweet about it.

Now the situation is as me & JVV predicted. We're so mainstream <_<

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 1st, 2020, 10:53 pm
by jvv
I didn't predict anything, I just gave my preferences.

And yes, I am rather mainstream. :P

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 2nd, 2020, 7:14 am
by sacmersault
The Top 3 were very good. Each had it's own thing. Korczak resonated more with me though. Tsigoineruwaizen in my opinion was the best made, but it's not my style of movie at all. And A Alma do Osso, I have no idea what others are seeing. It was torture watching it; I know there are people who like experimental films, but I truly didn't get it. Maybe someone can share with me their thoughts on why they thought it was so positive. On the other hand, WTF! He kept pouring water from one can to another for no reason!

1.- Korczak
2. - I Fotografia
3.- Tsigoineruwaizen
4.- A Alma do Osso

Re: World Cup, Season 4, Match 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th)

Posted: April 2nd, 2020, 4:59 pm
by joachimt
I don't want to make a set rule about not changing your vote, but I just want to trust people to be honest. I mean, if we want to disallow changing votes, we should also disallow opening the thread before making your vote. Late voters can do strategic votes without changing their vote. I just hope they don't.

The only way to avoid strategic votes is to have silent votes: everyone submits their vote to me and the result will be posted at once after the deadline. But where's the fun in that?