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Improving Screenshots

500<400, Favourite 1001 movies, Doubling the Canon, Film World Cup and many other votes
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Improving Screenshots

#1

Post by Dolwphin » October 4th, 2017, 11:11 pm

Maybe here is a good place to start: viewtopic.php?t=2409&1/?author=173546

Current Screen shots used: http://i.icmforum.com/

Some suggestions to get things started. With screens that I happened to have available..

#9: Citizen Kane:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
#5: 12 Angry Men:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
#3: Vertigo:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
#2: 2001:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
(This sequence have many better individual frames, but I don't have access to the film in HD. Perhaps somebody could provide some cooler screen shots?)

Feel free to make own suggestions about other titles. Or counter-suggestions or disagree vehemently. Etc.
Last edited by Dolwphin on October 7th, 2017, 10:51 am, edited 1 time in total.
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#2

Post by sebby » October 4th, 2017, 11:40 pm

All I ask for screenshots in a poll is that they're the same size (by height; obviously AR makes it impossible for them to all be exactly the same). OCD me would be awfully appreciative.

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#3

Post by PeacefulAnarchy » October 5th, 2017, 12:14 am

sebby on Oct 4 2017, 05:40:30 PM wrote:All I ask for screenshots in a poll is that they're the same size (by height; obviously AR makes it impossible for them to all be exactly the same). OCD me would be awfully appreciative.
Why by height and not width? Doing by height is a huge pain in the ass and results in either tiny 4:3 screens or gigantic 2.2:1 ones.

In general our screenshots are 640x480 for 4:3 and either 700 or 800 width for widescreen. A few movies have smaller screens because of lack of sources with higher resolution.

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#4

Post by PeacefulAnarchy » October 5th, 2017, 12:21 am

Dolwphin: I'd be curious to hear why you think that's a better screenshot for Kane or 12 Angry Men? I also disagree about 2001, but it's a film with a lot of visual styles and not a favourite of mine, so what I appreciate and consider representative won't be what others do. A Vertigo screenshot without Stewart is blasphemy, but there are certainly ones that are more representative of it's surreal style than the current one.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the 12 Angry Men one you picked, but it's a plainer shot than the current one.

The current Kane shot also has the snowglobe, but hints at its use of depth and shadows that I don't think yours does.

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#5

Post by PeacefulAnarchy » October 5th, 2017, 12:33 am

Here's most of our screenshots: http://i.icmforum.com/
Needs a bit of updating which I'll work on after the 500<400 screenshots.

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#6

Post by sebby » October 5th, 2017, 12:44 am

PeacefulAnarchy on Oct 4 2017, 06:14:13 PM wrote:
sebby on Oct 4 2017, 05:40:30 PM wrote:All I ask for screenshots in a poll is that they're the same size (by height; obviously AR makes it impossible for them to all be exactly the same). OCD me would be awfully appreciative.
Why by height and not width? Doing by height is a huge pain in the ass and results in either tiny 4:3 screens or gigantic 2.2:1 ones.

In general our screenshots are 640x480 for 4:3 and either 700 or 800 width for widescreen. A few movies have smaller screens because of lack of sources with higher resolution.
Oof. I meant width. Compare the following pairs and it's easy to see why exact width looks cleaner as you scroll through results.

By height:

Image
Image

By width:

Image
Image

It's not that big a deal, really. It's just many polls seem to have screenshots that are randomly grabbed and not resized, so it looks a bit messy. Probably doesn't bother most people. To me, matching by width is like a nice, ordered sock drawer. Heavenly heavenly. (Screenshots of my sock drawer available upon request).
Last edited by sebby on October 5th, 2017, 12:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

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#7

Post by PeacefulAnarchy » October 5th, 2017, 2:17 am

It bothers me too, but same height or same width both bother me. Those ratios are just too different to have a fixed equivalent dimension. 640 for 4:3, 720 for 16:9, 800 for 2.1:1 have roughly the same area so those are the three widths I aim for.

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#8

Post by Nathan Treadway » October 5th, 2017, 3:19 am

Can you just matte them?
Last edited by Nathan Treadway on October 5th, 2017, 3:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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#9

Post by weirdboy » October 5th, 2017, 3:51 am

Fixed width is better for not breaking web browsers.

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#10

Post by PeacefulAnarchy » October 5th, 2017, 4:11 am

weirdboy on Oct 4 2017, 09:51:26 PM wrote:Fixed width is better for not breaking web browsers.
This forum hasn't allowed images to break tables for at least a year, so that's not really an issue here, though people who post gigantic images still cause slow load times.

Nathan, I don't know of any way to automatically matte images, and I'm not sure what that's solving, but if it's something people want and there's a way to script it we could consider it.

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#11

Post by maxwelldeux » October 5th, 2017, 5:04 am

sebby on Oct 4 2017, 06:44:21 PM wrote:It's not that big a deal, really. It's just many polls seem to have screenshots that are randomly grabbed and not resized, so it looks a bit messy. Probably doesn't bother most people. To me, matching by width is like a nice, ordered sock drawer. Heavenly heavenly. (Screenshots of my sock drawer available upon request).
While I don't quite understand the mechanics of how would you take a screenshot of your sock drawer, I will formally put in the request for one. :whistling:

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#12

Post by Dolwphin » October 5th, 2017, 9:22 am

PeacefulAnarchy on Oct 4 2017, 06:21:40 PM wrote:Dolwphin: I'd be curious to hear why you think that's a better screenshot for Kane or 12 Angry Men? I also disagree about 2001, but it's a film with a lot of visual styles and not a favourite of mine, so what I appreciate and consider representative won't be what others do. A Vertigo screenshot without Stewart is blasphemy, but there are certainly ones that are more representative of it's surreal style than the current one.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the 12 Angry Men one you picked, but it's a plainer shot than the current one.

The current Kane shot also has the snowglobe, but hints at its use of depth and shadows that I don't think yours does.
I really liked both the aesthetics and meaning conveyed in my choice for Citizen Kane. Good point about the use of depth not being reflected in my suggestion though. And current SS does reflect that quite good. But surely there are better individual frames for that purpose? When it comes to 12 Angry Men I prefer my suggestion because it distinctly represent the whole premise/theme of the film. Current screen shot of Vertigo is insignificant/random and is unlikely to convince anybody to see it. Mine is both intriguing and represent its surreal style like you said. 2001 is criminally represented I think and its aesthetic vision needs fairer representation!

Current screen shots of discussed titles:

2001:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Vertigo:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
12 Angry Men:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Citizen Kane:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
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#13

Post by Dolwphin » October 7th, 2017, 12:00 pm

Some more suggestions.

#26: The Third Man

Suggestion:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Old:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
From this film I can think of a memorable CU and abundance of other good cinematography. Feel free to counter-suggest, I don't have the film available on my computer, but irregardless current one feels insignificant.

#67: Zerkalo

Suggestion:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Old:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Same sentiment as for previous title.

#68: Sherlock Jr.

Suggestion:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Old:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
I think my choice captures its comedic quality better. There are perhaps some more dynamic moments in the film worth capturing, but irregardless current SS is very mediocre.

#78: Man With a Movie Camera

Suggestion:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Old:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
This could almost be considered an upgrade. Better resolution and "timing" which more clearly expresses the dynamic dialectics. Other frames, with superimposition for instance, in this film is equally impressive. Feel free to post other suggestions.
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#14

Post by Lonewolf2003 » October 7th, 2017, 3:03 pm

With the 1920s poll coming up, improvements of 20s movies ss are most welcome. Thanks for the two above

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#15

Post by joachimt » October 7th, 2017, 7:18 pm

I updated the screens for The Third Man and Man With a Movie Camera in the masterlist of screens. I think these are clearly improvements. Most of the others are a matter of opinion.

There are probably lots of screens that really need updating, because the quality is bad and upgrades are available. During the countdown of polls, just pay attention everyone and offer better screens when something really needs an upgrade.

I don't feel like discussing which shot resembled a movie the best.
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#16

Post by Dolwphin » October 7th, 2017, 8:28 pm

Lonewolf2003 on Oct 7 2017, 09:03:18 AM wrote:With the 1920s poll coming up, improvements of 20s movies ss are most welcome. Thanks for the two above
Coeur fidèle:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
La Roue:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Le retour à la raison:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Finis terrae:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
H2O:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
I'll post a short list for that poll tomorrow.
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#17

Post by Dolwphin » October 7th, 2017, 8:37 pm

joachimt on Oct 7 2017, 01:18:26 PM wrote:I updated the screens for The Third Man and Man With a Movie Camera in the masterlist of screens. I think these are clearly improvements. Most of the others are a matter of opinion.

There are probably lots of screens that really need updating, because the quality is bad and upgrades are available. During the countdown of polls, just pay attention everyone and offer better screens when something really needs an upgrade.

I don't feel like discussing which shot resembled a movie the best.
Cool! From my perspective almost all screen shots needs replacement. But that is obviously not going to happen over night. But would be nice if Top 100/250 looked better. With that said taste is subjective etc.
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#18

Post by joachimt » October 8th, 2017, 9:41 am

Please post comparisons with the current screens, please. Otherwise I need to find the current shots in a separate file before being able to decide if they need replacements.
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#19

Post by Dolwphin » October 8th, 2017, 2:35 pm

joachimt on Oct 8 2017, 03:41:36 AM wrote:Please post comparisons with the current screens, please. Otherwise I need to find the current shots in a separate file before being able to decide if they need replacements.
I have for previous ones.

Here are 1920s ones from previous post.

Coeur fidèle:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
(This is actually not bad, but more impressive DP exist in this film)
La Roue:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Le retour à la raison:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
Finis terrae:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
H2O:
Spoiler: click to toggleShow
Image
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#20

Post by joachimt » October 8th, 2017, 3:19 pm

I really don't see why your proposal for Le retour à la raison is any better than the current one. I don't want to sound ungrateful, because I am grateful for your effort, but please only post improvements for screenshots where it's absolutely clear that there should be something better available. If so, I'd be happy to change links in the master-list, but the way it's going now, I'm not going to bother at all.
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#21

Post by joachimt » October 8th, 2017, 3:23 pm

......or someone else should take over hosting the screenshots-list.
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#22

Post by Dolwphin » October 8th, 2017, 5:20 pm

joachimt on Oct 8 2017, 09:19:45 AM wrote:I really don't see why your proposal for Le retour à la raison is any better than the current one. I don't want to sound ungrateful, because I am grateful for your effort, but please only post improvements for screenshots where it's absolutely clear that there should be something better available. If so, I'd be happy to change links in the master-list, but the way it's going now, I'm not going to bother at all.
I think all are clearly improvements! With that said I'm not claiming that all my suggestions are perfect. That is why I suggested people feel free to post counter-suggestions. But currently many SS is not in ideal resolution and/or unappealing from an aesthetic point of view. Vertigo, for instance, is quite clear improvement in both senses.

It would be interesting to hear some other opinions of my suggestions; especially about Top 100 titles which I'm focusing on. I'll limit myself to Top 100 for the foreseeable future; don't worry about being flooded with suggestions.
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#23

Post by PeacefulAnarchy » February 7th, 2019, 1:48 am

I'm working on upgrading some of the screenshots, I'll ask for more feedback suggestions in a while but for now:
Which is better:
SpoilerShow
Image
Image

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#24

Post by mjf314 » February 7th, 2019, 1:51 am

I don't know which film it is, but I prefer the first screenshot.

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#25

Post by mightysparks » February 7th, 2019, 1:56 am

I prefer the second.
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#26

Post by funkybusiness » February 7th, 2019, 2:08 am

#2 is a better composition but far more suggestive, it makes the film seem rather dour, so if it's a romantic comedy or something, than #1.

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#27

Post by PeacefulAnarchy » February 7th, 2019, 2:24 am

I agree the second shot has interesting composition. It's a better image, but I feel like the first gives me a better sense of the film. I also think people sometimes undervalue composition in a shot like the first one. I haven't seen the film, though, so I don't actually know just my impression based on scrolling through it look for something to screenshot.

It's not really important, I don't know that the film will show up in any of our lists, besides DtC, any time soon, I just realized I took two shots and was curious.

Edit: It's Furitvos: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0073028/

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#28

Post by mightysparks » February 7th, 2019, 2:47 am

funkybusiness wrote:
February 7th, 2019, 2:08 am
#2 is a better composition but far more suggestive, it makes the film seem rather dour, so if it's a romantic comedy or something, than #1.
Yea this is basically what I thought and couldn’t put into words. It really depends on the type of film, but I responded to the image I was more drawn to.
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#29

Post by Lonewolf2003 » February 8th, 2019, 11:53 pm

PeacefulAnarchy wrote:
February 7th, 2019, 2:24 am
I agree the second shot has interesting composition. It's a better image, but I feel like the first gives me a better sense of the film. I also think people sometimes undervalue composition in a shot like the first one. I haven't seen the film, though, so I don't actually know just my impression based on scrolling through it look for something to screenshot.

It's not really important, I don't know that the film will show up in any of our lists, besides DtC, any time soon, I just realized I took two shots and was curious.

Edit: It's Furitvos: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0073028/
This. From these screenshots I get the impression those two are the main characters of the movie. And therefor the first I guess gives a better impression about the movie.

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#30

Post by Mate_cosido » February 9th, 2019, 4:41 am

Second is better and gives a better sense of the film (i did watch it, although 2 years ago)

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#31

Post by PeacefulAnarchy » February 23rd, 2019, 5:07 am

Our screenshot repository stands at around 6400 films. I've upgraded a bunch and added some more. It includes everything in our last Top 2000, the 1000<400, plus most polls from the last couple of years. I decided to look up the films on most lists we don't have screenshots for. There are (were, as I'm adding some of them) 780 films on 3 or more official lists we didn't have screenshots for, 115 in 6 or more official lists.
These are the top ones:
The Birth of a Nation - 21 Official Lists
The Quiet Man - 15 Official Lists
Sholay - 13 Official Lists
Saturday Night Fever - 13 Official Lists
The Chronicle History of King Henry the Fifth with His Battell Fought at Agincourt in France - 12 Official Lists
W.R. - Misterije organizma - 12 Official Lists
Chariots of Fire - 12 Official Lists
L'arrivée d'un train à La Ciotat - 11 Official Lists
Tom Jones - 11 Official Lists
Pretty Woman - 11 Official Lists
Sense and Sensibility - 11 Official Lists
Shakespeare in Love - 11 Official Lists
Cabiria - 10 Official Lists
Superman - 10 Official Lists
The Last Seduction - 10 Official Lists
SpoilerShow
La sortie de l'usine Lumière à Lyon - 9 Official Lists
Little Caesar - 9 Official Lists
French Cancan - 9 Official Lists
Mother India - 9 Official Lists
One-Eyed Jacks - 9 Official Lists
The Nutty Professor - 9 Official Lists
Pink Flamingos - 9 Official Lists
Out of Africa - 9 Official Lists
A Room with a View - 9 Official Lists
Broadcast News - 9 Official Lists
Ghost - 9 Official Lists
There's Something About Mary - 9 Official Lists
Avengers: Infinity War - 9 Official Lists
It's a Gift - 8 Official Lists
The Bank Dick - 8 Official Lists
Flaming Creatures - 8 Official Lists
One Hundred and One Dalmatians - 8 Official Lists
This Sporting Life - 8 Official Lists
Faster, Pussycat! Kill! Kill! - 8 Official Lists
Sweet Sweetback's Baadasssss Song - 8 Official Lists
Roma - 8 Official Lists
Top Gun - 8 Official Lists
Cyrano de Bergerac - 8 Official Lists
Howards End - 8 Official Lists
Independence Day - 8 Official Lists
Spider-Man - 8 Official Lists
The Bourne Supremacy - 8 Official Lists
Histoire(s) du cinéma - 8 Official Lists
The Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse - 7 Official Lists
Horse Feathers - 7 Official Lists
She Done Him Wrong - 7 Official Lists
Sergeant York - 7 Official Lists
Woman of the Year - 7 Official Lists
Duel in the Sun - 7 Official Lists
The Barefoot Contessa - 7 Official Lists
Becket - 7 Official Lists
Darling - 7 Official Lists
Love Story - 7 Official Lists
The Go-Between - 7 Official Lists
Shaft - 7 Official Lists
Beverly Hills Cop - 7 Official Lists
Hope and Glory - 7 Official Lists
Dangerous Liaisons - 7 Official Lists
Salaam Bombay! - 7 Official Lists
Working Girl - 7 Official Lists
Field of Dreams - 7 Official Lists
Batman Returns - 7 Official Lists
Dilwale Dulhania Le Jayenge - 7 Official Lists
Jerry Maguire - 7 Official Lists
Chicken Run - 7 Official Lists

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#32

Post by joachimt » February 23rd, 2019, 8:13 am

As long as these movies don't end up in poll results, I see no reason to spend time adding them.
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#33

Post by PeacefulAnarchy » February 23rd, 2019, 8:28 am

joachimt wrote:
February 23rd, 2019, 8:13 am
As long as these movies don't end up in poll results, I see no reason to spend time adding them.
The ones I added were for other reasons (they were on runner up lists, or I expect them in an upcoming list) I'm certainly not adding all, or even most, of them. I just thought it was interesting to see what highly regarded movies don't interest us much.

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