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New Official List Discussion

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72aicm
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#6121

Post by 72aicm »

David di Donatello - Best Italian Film (28/64) - #50
filmSPOT's Best Portuguese Films (29/75) - #28
Korean Screen's 100 Greatest Korean Films (52/100) - #46
Time Out’s The 100 Best Thrillers (85/100) - #515


I wish there was a «new» in the tabs at the progress page.
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#6122

Post by Tim2460 »

Traveller wrote: September 15th, 2021, 4:22 am David di Donatello - Best Italian Film (26/64) - #64
filmSPOT's Best Portuguese Films (22/75) - #60
Korean Screen's 100 Greatest Korean Films (100/100) - #1
Time Out’s The 100 Best Thrillers (96/100) - #100
Instant Platinium (and the only one ...) on the New Korean List :worship:
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#6123

Post by Lakigigar »

David di Donatello - Best Italian Film (2/64) - #8633
filmSPOT's Best Portuguese Films (0/75) - NOT RANKED
Korean Screen's 100 Greatest Korean Films (17/100) - #1375
Time Out’s The 100 Best Thrillers (21/100) - #22389
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#6124

Post by Lakigigar »

https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/kim+ ... y/lu-chin/

IMO if you check Ki Duk Kim's filmography, it totally doesn't make sense in regards to what is official and what is not. Every movie till Hwal is official, mostly due to the Asian book list, but some of his most acclaimed movies aren't like Soom, Hwal, maybe Moebius, and maybe Dream (at least more worthy of official status than almost half of his cinematography).

It really makes me question the value of that book list, although I suppose we don't have alternatives, and compared to Cinema Tropical (which has 125 films for the 2000s and 229 for the 2010s for films made in Latin America, which covers all the acclaimed movies there, so that's good) it is really an area that could use some improvement. Korea seems mostly okay partially due to their movie industry booming in the 21st century. It could use slightly improvements, but that seems okay, but when you look at Greater China, Japan and Southeastern Asia, it's an area that could use some improvement.

We don't have good representation of modern Japan cinema, Southeastern Asian cinema and China seems a bit lacking too, and very reliant on the book list or on other official lists (like Kaili Blues is only official due to ICM 500 <400 and DtC which are two user-made lists). Japan has their lists, but they're dated and mostly focused on classic Japanese cinema (that overwhelms the modern input). And Southeastern Asia completely doesn't have any list, covered by the book list at most, which is already 14 years old. Weerasethakul has the luck to be a highly acclaimed director, but that's about it, and it still puts him at a disadvantage, as he could easily be more on official lists.

https://www.icheckmovies.com/movies/ilo+ilo/ Ilo Ilo was a highly acclaimed movie from Singapore, and it's not on official list (it says 1 official list, but on the right you see none appearing). Malaysia, Indonesia, Laos, Vietnam, Thailand, Cambodia, maybe Myanmar. They seem all at a huge disadvantage. And so is Taiwan which does not have their own list, opposed to China and Hong Kong. Some movies appear on the China lists, but the same is true for Hong Kong which have their own list.

If 354 movies get an official check from Latin America, just for being Latin American and made in the 21st century, and Eastern Asia does not, than something is really wrong, especially since the book list is both very dated, very subjective (it's a book from a single writer) and doesn't cover the best films, especially from modern era cinema very well, since it's not supposed to be a "best of", but it serves an introduction list, so just a mention of Ki-Duk Kim's early career is enough to make those films official. Makes absolutely no sense to me.

It's an area where improvement is necessary, and it's not because a lot of people dislike modern Eastern Asian cinema, that it is doesn't have the right to be acknowledged. Part of the reason why people think Japan doesn't have good movies today, is because they don't watch it, because they focus only on official movies or rely solely on acclaimed movies, and than make such a conclusion, but that doesn't put you at the position to make such a statement.

Cult official lists also overlook this, and aren't really all that good to me either. They don't cover the issue, and are IMO not really cult-oriented enough, since a lot of them totally don't have that feal like https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/jenn ... =year&desc, very dated as well (2008, so a not dynamic list), and the movies on it are mostly not cult, like how can The Shawshank Redemption be a cult movie? Seems like the author totally has no idea what "cult" is, based on that maybe half of the IMDb list is on it (and yes i know some started as cult, and they should be in it like The Big Lebowski), but still.

I have proposed a number of lists that could be made official. Maybe they're not lists that do cover it very well, but there are lists currently official that don't either (like that book list). It fails on the same areas where moderators also claim that our proposed lists also fail on, and they seem to be much better at covering it, opposed to other lists.

Since we do have user lists that are official, why does everyone ignore me that the solution could be that we do our own Modern Asian list, if no other institution can provide that to us, and cooperate with maybe letterboxd and other sites (perhaps some dedicated to eastern Asian cinema). That seems like it could work. We have DtC and ICM <400. I suppose it cannot hurt to do that, especially if we look elsewhere to make it a more expansive list. I'm sure something could get done, so that it passes the quality standard necessary for a list to become official? It can than be official here, and be covered in the all-time stats of letterboxd, and there are some a lot of people that will help us out here, we do the same thing for DtC?

We even don't have unofficial forum lists dedicated to modern Eastern Asia? So, if no other institution can proved it to us, or does exist, than maybe we should become the institution ourselves. On letterboxd, there are plenty of Asian users out there, who watch a lot of modern Eastern Asian cinema. If we somehow have a way to connect to them or recruit them, and it could easily be done.
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#6125

Post by Lammetje »

Torgo wrote: September 13th, 2021, 5:07 pm
Tim2460 wrote: September 13th, 2021, 2:17 pm Also to avoid an fuss with our most advanced grammarly users we could add an "the" to the time out list so that it match the other ones ?

Time Out's 100 Best Thriller Films of All Time --> Time Out's The 100 Best Thriller Films of All Time
Time Out's 1000 Films to Change Your Life
Time Out's The 100 Best British Films
Time Out's The 100 Best French Films
Time Out's The 100 Best Romantic Films
Time Out's The 101 Best Action Movies Ever Made
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I'm late to the party, but glad this got fixed. :sweat:
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#6126

Post by Lakigigar »

Also, we have 29 award lists, 10 American, 15 European, 2 Latin American, 1 African and 1 Asian list (India). But none are from Eastern Asia? Are there no filmfestivals in Asia or focused on Asia? Apparently not. Seems to me directors like Ozu or Kurosawa must not have been that influential after all, at least not in their homeland...

Given the argument i sometimes got, we do not do country decade lists or something like that, I also want to remind that both Japan's production alone or China's production alone is bigger than the entire production of Latin America. Just a reminder.
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#6127

Post by jeroeno »

So just find a good list and present it to the moderators, I'm sure they can't wait to replace another list.
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#6128

Post by Lakigigar »

https://asianmoviepulse.com/2021/01/the ... -decade/6/

Why cannot we make this official? I mean it's a perfect list, and we used to have an AMP-list before it got replaced by Korean Screen. It focuses on all of Asia for this decade, and to be telling the truth. For Latin America, it's good enough. 30 films would gain official status of the 60, including some well-acclaimed ones and one that just got it's official status seen gone due to the replacement of the Korean lists. AMP really loves Moebius apparently.

https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/amps ... altoplists
jeroeno wrote: September 15th, 2021, 12:16 pm So just find a good list and present it to the moderators, I'm sure they can't wait to replace another list.
I'm not telling them to replace it, although the book list is indeed not that good esp. according to their own standards, but as long there's no better list, maybe we need to continue with that list. The book list is very similar to that one:

https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/mark ... altoplists
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#6130

Post by Torgo »

72aicm wrote: September 15th, 2021, 5:56 am David di Donatello - Best Italian Film (28/64) - #50
filmSPOT's Best Portuguese Films (29/75) - #28

I wish there was a «new» in the tabs at the progress page.
You'd rather need the "(new) lists I haven't bronzed yet" tab ;)
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#6131

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

It would actually be interesting if the lists could be sorted by adoption date, but I doubt that's even a field in the db.
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#6132

Post by Lonewolf2003 »

Lakigigar wrote: September 15th, 2021, 12:08 pm Also, we have 29 award lists, 10 American, 15 European, 2 Latin American, 1 African and 1 Asian list (India). But none are from Eastern Asia? Are there no filmfestivals in Asia or focused on Asia? Apparently not. Seems to me directors like Ozu or Kurosawa must not have been that influential after all, at least not in their homeland...

Given the argument i sometimes got, we do not do country decade lists or something like that, I also want to remind that both Japan's production alone or China's production alone is bigger than the entire production of Latin America. Just a reminder.
There are award in Asian countries of course, see above. Hopefully the Donatello adaptation means we will get more award lists, also from Asia. That at least was the plan before.
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#6133

Post by Lonewolf2003 »

Lakigigar wrote: September 15th, 2021, 10:05 am https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/kim+ ... y/lu-chin/

IMO if you check Ki Duk Kim's filmography, it totally doesn't make sense in regards to what is official and what is not. Every movie till Hwal is official, mostly due to the Asian book list, but some of his most acclaimed movies aren't like Soom, Hwal, maybe Moebius, and maybe Dream (at least more worthy of official status than almost half of his cinematography).

It really makes me question the value of that book list, although I suppose we don't have alternatives, and compared to Cinema Tropical (which has 125 films for the 2000s and 229 for the 2010s for films made in Latin America, which covers all the acclaimed movies there, so that's good) it is really an area that could use some improvement. Korea seems mostly okay partially due to their movie industry booming in the 21st century. It could use slightly improvements, but that seems okay, but when you look at Greater China, Japan and Southeastern Asia, it's an area that could use some improvement.

We don't have good representation of modern Japan cinema, Southeastern Asian cinema and China seems a bit lacking too, and very reliant on the book list or on other official lists (like Kaili Blues is only official due to ICM 500 <400 and DtC which are two user-made lists). Japan has their lists, but they're dated and mostly focused on classic Japanese cinema (that overwhelms the modern input). And Southeastern Asia completely doesn't have any list, covered by the book list at most, which is already 14 years old. Weerasethakul has the luck to be a highly acclaimed director, but that's about it, and it still puts him at a disadvantage, as he could easily be more on official lists.

https://www.icheckmovies.com/movies/ilo+ilo/ Ilo Ilo was a highly acclaimed movie from Singapore, and it's not on official list (it says 1 official list, but on the right you see none appearing). Malaysia, Indonesia, Laos, Vietnam, Thailand, Cambodia, maybe Myanmar. They seem all at a huge disadvantage. And so is Taiwan which does not have their own list, opposed to China and Hong Kong. Some movies appear on the China lists, but the same is true for Hong Kong which have their own list.

If 354 movies get an official check from Latin America, just for being Latin American and made in the 21st century, and Eastern Asia does not, than something is really wrong, especially since the book list is both very dated, very subjective (it's a book from a single writer) and doesn't cover the best films, especially from modern era cinema very well, since it's not supposed to be a "best of", but it serves an introduction list, so just a mention of Ki-Duk Kim's early career is enough to make those films official. Makes absolutely no sense to me.

It's an area where improvement is necessary, and it's not because a lot of people dislike modern Eastern Asian cinema, that it is doesn't have the right to be acknowledged. Part of the reason why people think Japan doesn't have good movies today, is because they don't watch it, because they focus only on official movies or rely solely on acclaimed movies, and than make such a conclusion, but that doesn't put you at the position to make such a statement.

Cult official lists also overlook this, and aren't really all that good to me either. They don't cover the issue, and are IMO not really cult-oriented enough, since a lot of them totally don't have that feal like https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/jenn ... =year&desc, very dated as well (2008, so a not dynamic list), and the movies on it are mostly not cult, like how can The Shawshank Redemption be a cult movie? Seems like the author totally has no idea what "cult" is, based on that maybe half of the IMDb list is on it (and yes i know some started as cult, and they should be in it like The Big Lebowski), but still.

I have proposed a number of lists that could be made official. Maybe they're not lists that do cover it very well, but there are lists currently official that don't either (like that book list). It fails on the same areas where moderators also claim that our proposed lists also fail on, and they seem to be much better at covering it, opposed to other lists.

Since we do have user lists that are official, why does everyone ignore me that the solution could be that we do our own Modern Asian list, if no other institution can provide that to us, and cooperate with maybe letterboxd and other sites (perhaps some dedicated to eastern Asian cinema). That seems like it could work. We have DtC and ICM <400. I suppose it cannot hurt to do that, especially if we look elsewhere to make it a more expansive list. I'm sure something could get done, so that it passes the quality standard necessary for a list to become official? It can than be official here, and be covered in the all-time stats of letterboxd, and there are some a lot of people that will help us out here, we do the same thing for DtC?

We even don't have unofficial forum lists dedicated to modern Eastern Asia? So, if no other institution can proved it to us, or does exist, than maybe we should become the institution ourselves. On letterboxd, there are plenty of Asian users out there, who watch a lot of modern Eastern Asian cinema. If we somehow have a way to connect to them or recruit them, and it could easily be done.
Just start doing it! Instead of bringing it up again and again.

There is a reluctance to adopting our own lists among mods, that’s also one of the reasons our 1001 Favs isn’t adopted yet. But if you succeed in gathering people also from other forums and sites it will be seen less like a circle jerk probably, and has a bigger change to succeed. I assume only that the mods won’t give you a guarantee for adaptation if you embark on this project. They probably will want to see how the project turns out first.
Of course there are perimeters you could set that increase your changes; limit it to East-Asia, list size (250-300 sounds good for this), a high participation rate, the quality and expertise of participants, good representation of smaller countries too instead of it being just a Japan+Korea+China list.
Onderhond seems to have some connections with Asian film buffs, maybe he could help draw people in for you.
And even if than it still isn’t up to standards and adaptation worthy, you and other modern Asian fans will still have a probably great list to work on.

If you do this I can explain to you how to use the programs for counting and making a list

Another route you could take is to make some kind of meta list, like the TSZDT list.
Last edited by Lonewolf2003 on September 15th, 2021, 5:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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#6134

Post by kongs_speech »

I don't like the sounds of that. I'd rather have something real, like an awards list.
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#6135

Post by Lonewolf2003 »

kongs_speech wrote: September 15th, 2021, 5:06 pm I don't like the sounds of that. I'd rather have something real, like an awards list.
The one doesn’t exclude the other.
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#6136

Post by OldAle1 »

kongs_speech wrote: September 15th, 2021, 5:06 pm I don't like the sounds of that. I'd rather have something real, like an awards list.
Awards lists have lots of pluses -

* assuming they aren't awards that have been discontinued, they are always up-to-date, they always have some small representation of what a cinema is up to in the here and now
* they are permanent - that is, the films once on the list won't ever go unofficial, unless the list is made so (has that ever happened to an awards list? I'm guessing not)
* they tend to be of a manageable size, rarely over 100 films

But they have some minuses too, most notably that they are (like every list of course in some way) dependent on the quality of the body giving them out. The flaws of the Oscars and Globes have been debated endlessly, and I'm sure knowledgeable people could make arguments against every other award list we have. You know I'm into Iranian cinema, and I'd love to have a better/more up-to-date list than what we have, but I can't in good conscience recommend the country's primary award list, the Crystal Simorgh, because there's too much obvious propaganda at work here, and the films seem to me to represent too narrow a slice of what that cinema has to offer. I could see there being similar problems with lists from China, Russia and many other countries where government has a heavy hand. And even when it doesn't, the politics in the film industries can really impact the awards.

So...ehh. I don't know that awards lists are any more representative of anything I'd want to see promoted than any other kinds of lists. Having an up-to-date look at a film industry is certainly of some value, but then again when that industry is as big and varied as those of France, Japan or Italy, I'm not sure how much one film from a given year can tell us.
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#6137

Post by Torgo »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: September 15th, 2021, 4:46 pm It would actually be interesting if the lists could be sorted by adoption date, but I doubt that's even a field in the db.
That indeed would be interesting (and I asked for a thread for this not too long ago - not that I need that info to live). When the parameter isn't set yet, maybe it still could be added now, or would that detonate the website? I sometimes underestimate how complex coding actually is .. ;)

Sorting lists by adoption date and your own progress (by percent / by checked films) .. mmmh. I do like the sound of that.
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#6138

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

Most things involving databases are:
a) doable
b) individually not super complicated
and
c) prone to blow everything up with a single typo or unforeseen connection.

I don't know what ICM's looks like, but I'd expect that adding a field like that isn't particularly hard, but could certainly have knock on effects depending on how the site is coded so even if the risk is minimal it's not worth it. But for all I know maybe that field exists already.
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#6139

Post by Lakigigar »

Lonewolf2003 wrote: September 15th, 2021, 5:03 pm
Lakigigar wrote: September 15th, 2021, 10:05 am https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/kim+ ... y/lu-chin/

IMO if you check Ki Duk Kim's filmography, it totally doesn't make sense in regards to what is official and what is not. Every movie till Hwal is official, mostly due to the Asian book list, but some of his most acclaimed movies aren't like Soom, Hwal, maybe Moebius, and maybe Dream (at least more worthy of official status than almost half of his cinematography).

It really makes me question the value of that book list, although I suppose we don't have alternatives, and compared to Cinema Tropical (which has 125 films for the 2000s and 229 for the 2010s for films made in Latin America, which covers all the acclaimed movies there, so that's good) it is really an area that could use some improvement. Korea seems mostly okay partially due to their movie industry booming in the 21st century. It could use slightly improvements, but that seems okay, but when you look at Greater China, Japan and Southeastern Asia, it's an area that could use some improvement.

We don't have good representation of modern Japan cinema, Southeastern Asian cinema and China seems a bit lacking too, and very reliant on the book list or on other official lists (like Kaili Blues is only official due to ICM 500 <400 and DtC which are two user-made lists). Japan has their lists, but they're dated and mostly focused on classic Japanese cinema (that overwhelms the modern input). And Southeastern Asia completely doesn't have any list, covered by the book list at most, which is already 14 years old. Weerasethakul has the luck to be a highly acclaimed director, but that's about it, and it still puts him at a disadvantage, as he could easily be more on official lists.

https://www.icheckmovies.com/movies/ilo+ilo/ Ilo Ilo was a highly acclaimed movie from Singapore, and it's not on official list (it says 1 official list, but on the right you see none appearing). Malaysia, Indonesia, Laos, Vietnam, Thailand, Cambodia, maybe Myanmar. They seem all at a huge disadvantage. And so is Taiwan which does not have their own list, opposed to China and Hong Kong. Some movies appear on the China lists, but the same is true for Hong Kong which have their own list.

If 354 movies get an official check from Latin America, just for being Latin American and made in the 21st century, and Eastern Asia does not, than something is really wrong, especially since the book list is both very dated, very subjective (it's a book from a single writer) and doesn't cover the best films, especially from modern era cinema very well, since it's not supposed to be a "best of", but it serves an introduction list, so just a mention of Ki-Duk Kim's early career is enough to make those films official. Makes absolutely no sense to me.

It's an area where improvement is necessary, and it's not because a lot of people dislike modern Eastern Asian cinema, that it is doesn't have the right to be acknowledged. Part of the reason why people think Japan doesn't have good movies today, is because they don't watch it, because they focus only on official movies or rely solely on acclaimed movies, and than make such a conclusion, but that doesn't put you at the position to make such a statement.

Cult official lists also overlook this, and aren't really all that good to me either. They don't cover the issue, and are IMO not really cult-oriented enough, since a lot of them totally don't have that feal like https://www.icheckmovies.com/lists/jenn ... =year&desc, very dated as well (2008, so a not dynamic list), and the movies on it are mostly not cult, like how can The Shawshank Redemption be a cult movie? Seems like the author totally has no idea what "cult" is, based on that maybe half of the IMDb list is on it (and yes i know some started as cult, and they should be in it like The Big Lebowski), but still.

I have proposed a number of lists that could be made official. Maybe they're not lists that do cover it very well, but there are lists currently official that don't either (like that book list). It fails on the same areas where moderators also claim that our proposed lists also fail on, and they seem to be much better at covering it, opposed to other lists.

Since we do have user lists that are official, why does everyone ignore me that the solution could be that we do our own Modern Asian list, if no other institution can provide that to us, and cooperate with maybe letterboxd and other sites (perhaps some dedicated to eastern Asian cinema). That seems like it could work. We have DtC and ICM <400. I suppose it cannot hurt to do that, especially if we look elsewhere to make it a more expansive list. I'm sure something could get done, so that it passes the quality standard necessary for a list to become official? It can than be official here, and be covered in the all-time stats of letterboxd, and there are some a lot of people that will help us out here, we do the same thing for DtC?

We even don't have unofficial forum lists dedicated to modern Eastern Asia? So, if no other institution can proved it to us, or does exist, than maybe we should become the institution ourselves. On letterboxd, there are plenty of Asian users out there, who watch a lot of modern Eastern Asian cinema. If we somehow have a way to connect to them or recruit them, and it could easily be done.
Just start doing it! Instead of bringing it up again and again.

There is a reluctance to adopting our own lists among mods, that’s also one of the reasons our 1001 Favs isn’t adopted yet. But if you succeed in gathering people also from other forums and sites it will be seen less like a circle jerk probably, and has a bigger change to succeed. I assume only that the mods won’t give you a guarantee for adaptation if you embark on this project. They probably will want to see how the project turns out first.
Of course there are perimeters you could set that increase your changes; limit it to East-Asia, list size (250-300 sounds good for this), a high participation rate, the quality and expertise of participants, good representation of smaller countries too instead of it being just a Japan+Korea+China list.
Onderhond seems to have some connections with Asian film buffs, maybe he could help draw people in for you.
And even if than it still isn’t up to standards and adaptation worthy, you and other modern Asian fans will still have a probably great list to work on.

If you do this I can explain to you how to use the programs for counting and making a list

Another route you could take is to make some kind of meta list, like the TSZDT list.
Well it sounds like an interesting idea. I feel if we can get Onderhond's film buffs, cooperate with Moviemeter, the people here on ICMForum who are interested and make Letterboxd aware of it, it could be done. But i'm not good with projects, and i'd rather have support for that, or prefer someone else to do it, although I could help wherever needed. It's just history hasn't proven i'm not really the guy for it.

The people are there, it's just a matter of bringing them together and doing the project.
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#6140

Post by Onderhond »

The problem with awards lists is they tend to favor very similar types of films. You'll just get East-Asia's Oscar fodder, yay for that ...
As for helming/aiding a project like that, I certainly not going to put much effort into it. I'm guessing there are much more useful ways to spend my time I'm afraid.
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#6141

Post by kongs_speech »

If the resident Asian genre film expert/fanatic isn't even on board, I just don't think this is a project worth pursuing. Can't stop anyone from doing so, but it hardly seems worth it.
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Lakigigar
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#6142

Post by Lakigigar »

I've also been looking for a good list to adopt from any southeastern asian country or the ASEAN countries itself, but there are just none that have ever been made that are larger than 25 films, or cover an entire film history of a certain country, let alone a combined list of that area.
kongs_speech wrote: September 15th, 2021, 6:00 pm If the resident Asian genre film expert/fanatic isn't even on board, I just don't think this is a project worth pursuing. Can't stop anyone from doing so, but it hardly seems worth it.
You're probably right, but it's a blind spot, and i don't know how to solve it.
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Onderhond
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#6143

Post by Onderhond »

kongs_speech wrote: September 15th, 2021, 6:00 pm If the resident Asian genre film expert/fanatic isn't even on board, I just don't think this is a project worth pursuing. Can't stop anyone from doing so, but it hardly seems worth it.
You need someone who likes rallying people, preferably someone with fair social skills and the time to see a project like that through until the very end. I'm honestly pretty occupied with watching films and maintaining my own blog. Thinks might be slightly different if I thought a list like that would have a fighting chance of making it on ICM, but I wouldn't bet an old sock on it.
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OldAle1
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#6144

Post by OldAle1 »

Onderhond wrote: September 15th, 2021, 5:58 pm The problem with awards lists is they tend to favor very similar types of films. You'll just get East-Asia's Oscar fodder, yay for that ...
As for helming/aiding a project like that, I certainly not going to put much effort into it. I'm guessing there are much more useful ways to spend my time I'm afraid.
Yeah, this too. I'm much more a fan of Oscar fodder than some here :P , but I certainly don't think we need more - particularly if an awards list being considered is coming from a country already represented significantly with other lists. Of course there are some specialized awards out there, like the Hugos, but none of the ones I've come across are worth supporting (and the Hugos in particular suck ass). I would imagine there are some Best-Asian-Horror-of-the-Year type awards out there but I also wouldn't imagine they'd be anything really special. Awards by their nature seem to be pretty conservative and safe, at least the awards that stick around long enough to get noticed much.

(now somebody post some lists that show me I'm wrong, please. No really. I want to see my thesis disproven)
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#6145

Post by dirty_score »

OldAle1 wrote: September 15th, 2021, 6:16 pm (now somebody post some lists that show me I'm wrong, please. No really. I want to see my thesis disproven)
Just the one and only that really matters to make it official by Christmas: Golden Raspberry Award Worst Pictures a.k.a. Razzie Awards :shifty:
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Torgo
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#6146

Post by Torgo »

LOL good god, that list. Honestly that's a more promising approach than much of the stuff of the uneven B-movies list :P
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OldAle1
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#6147

Post by OldAle1 »

dirty_score wrote: September 15th, 2021, 6:43 pm
OldAle1 wrote: September 15th, 2021, 6:16 pm (now somebody post some lists that show me I'm wrong, please. No really. I want to see my thesis disproven)
Just the one and only that really matters to make it official by Christmas: Golden Raspberry Award Worst Pictures a.k.a. Razzie Awards :shifty:
It would be appropriate to get it done by Christmas, if only to make the masterpiece that is Kirk Cameron's greatest work official. Also, Cocktail is only on 1 official list? CRIMINAL.
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Teproc
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#6148

Post by Teproc »

I mean, "Oscar-fodder" means something different everywhere. The type of film that I would consider "César-bait" has some cross-over with Oscars obviously, but each country's film industry (since that's who gives out awards) obviously has different tastes. Awards list never give a complete picture (not even close), but they do give you exactly that: what the country's film industry celebrates, which is interesting in and of itself.
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Onderhond
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#6149

Post by Onderhond »

dirty_score wrote: September 15th, 2021, 6:43 pm Just the one and only that really matters to make it official by Christmas: Golden Raspberry Award Worst Pictures a.k.a. Razzie Awards :shifty:
Number of dislikes: 3/17 (17.65%)

Certainly not the worst-scoring list on ICM for me.
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Lonewolf2003
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#6150

Post by Lonewolf2003 »

Teproc wrote: September 15th, 2021, 6:51 pm I mean, "Oscar-fodder" means something different everywhere. The type of film that I would consider "César-bait" has some cross-over with Oscars obviously, but each country's film industry (since that's who gives out awards) obviously has different tastes. Awards list never give a complete picture (not even close), but they do give you exactly that: what the country's film industry celebrates, which is interesting in and of itself.
Exactly. That’s also why I think award lists are interesting when viewed in contrast, compared to other country list that has a different, broader, longer view on a countries film history.
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Ebbywebby
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#6151

Post by Ebbywebby »

Asking for a frond: Why is someone with just over 1,000 checks and a #17,579 user rank arguing at length for what official lists should be chosen, as if they're some elite, expert tastemaker?
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#6152

Post by MMDan »

I like the new lists. Only hadn't seen two on the thriller list. The Korean and Italian lists are interesting.
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Onderhond
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#6153

Post by Onderhond »

Ebbywebby wrote: September 15th, 2021, 11:22 pm Asking for a frond: Why is someone with just over 1,000 checks and a #17,579 user rank arguing at length for what official lists should be chosen, as if they're some elite, expert tastemaker?
Because lower-ranking users might have a better idea of where the more pressing gaps are. But I also understand some would keep their little bubble intact.
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#6154

Post by Ebbywebby »

Onderhond wrote: Yesterday, 5:15 am
Ebbywebby wrote: September 15th, 2021, 11:22 pm Asking for a frond: Why is someone with just over 1,000 checks and a #17,579 user rank arguing at length for what official lists should be chosen, as if they're some elite, expert tastemaker?
Because lower-ranking users might have a better idea of where the more pressing gaps are.
Ah, so kind of a "The less you know, the more you know" Zen thing.
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Onderhond
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#6155

Post by Onderhond »

Ebbywebby wrote: Yesterday, 7:15 am Ah, so kind of a "The less you know, the more you know" Zen thing.
No, the "ICM isn't the be-all and end-all and cinephilia" thing.
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Ebbywebby
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#6156

Post by Ebbywebby »

I always thought the be-all and end-all of cinephilia was about being familiar with a lot of movies as opposed to not being familiar with a lot of movies.
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Onderhond
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#6157

Post by Onderhond »

It's being familiar with lots of different types of movies and being aware of your blind spots. And welcoming people who can help you with those blind spots. That's different from being elitists about numbers.
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Lonewolf2003
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#6158

Post by Lonewolf2003 »

Onderhond wrote: Yesterday, 8:47 am It's being familiar with lots of different types of movies and being aware of your blind spots. And welcoming people who can help you with those blind spots. That's different from being elitists about numbers.
Indeed, the input and opinion of someone with rank #20.000 is as worthwhile as someone with rank #4.
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#6159

Post by Ebbywebby »

Onderhond wrote: Yesterday, 8:47 am It's being familiar with lots of different types of movies and being aware of your blind spots. And welcoming people who can help you with those blind spots.
Well, that certainly eliminates you. You're a one-note joke in every thread you enter, and SO proud of your blind spots. They aren't really "spots" either...more like zones and regions and continents.

You're in the littlest "bubble" of anyone who posts here. At least Lakigigar has naivete as an excuse.
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Onderhond
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#6160

Post by Onderhond »

Sounds to me like you're confusing taste with interest. When it comes to taste, I'm certainly one of the people with the clearest preference here. At the same time, I'm probably one of the people here who ventures outside his comfort zone most often.
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