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Moderation and politics discussion

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AdamH
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#41

Post by AdamH »

OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:25 pm
AdamH wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:20 pm I'll be honest, I can't stand the political threads on here (I actually have a degree in politics although I haven't done anything politics-related since graduating). We have had endless issues on here because of the political threads and we've definitely had a few people quit the forum because of them (including some of the most active posters).

I don't really know how we can handle it. There is a lot of trolling in that thread. People seem to deny it but it's very obvious. As much as I love the forum, the political threads are not something I'm proud of at all. They have often been very toxic threads over the past few years.

I really don't want to see us lose more members because of it. I can't say an exact number who have left because of those threads (because it's impossible to really know) or have significantly reduced how often they post but I'm confident there have been a few.

Personally, I almost never post in the threads and try to avoid them as much as possible unless someone reports a post (which doesn't happen very often).
Honestly they are among the LEAST-toxic political threads I've ever seen - I think that's a tribute to the *generally* sane and mature group that we have, and better moderation than usual (even on threads most mods seem to hate!). But that just shows that politics ALWAYS ends up pissing people off and pitting them against each other.

Thank God we don't have a religion thread, and that I'm an atheist, with apologies to Buñuel.
I don't doubt what you say about them being among the least toxic political threads but that is probably a reflection of this forum compared to others (and, also, the small size of the forum meaning we attract fewer outright trolls).

I certainly think there is trolling on the threads and it's not just people disagreeing with each other.

It's really frustrating for me to have heard of a bunch of people over the years who have quit because of those threads but I'm not sure what the answer is.
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PeacefulAnarchy
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#42

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:08 pm Maybe just moderate stuff like "you're an idiot", or at the very least back it up with stuff when you say that?
Report it. If no one reports it, then we can only moderate what we stumble on and the four of us who ever set foot in those threads take regular breaks from them so things get missed without reports.
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#43

Post by kongs_speech »

OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:25 pm Thank God we don't have a religion thread
That would likely be 50 people insulting my faith, so yes, I'm definitely good without that one. :lol:
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#44

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:25 pm Thank God we don't have a religion thread, and that I'm an atheist, with apologies to Buñuel.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2555
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#45

Post by OldAle1 »

AdamH wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:27 pm
OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:25 pm
AdamH wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:20 pm I'll be honest, I can't stand the political threads on here (I actually have a degree in politics although I haven't done anything politics-related since graduating). We have had endless issues on here because of the political threads and we've definitely had a few people quit the forum because of them (including some of the most active posters).

I don't really know how we can handle it. There is a lot of trolling in that thread. People seem to deny it but it's very obvious. As much as I love the forum, the political threads are not something I'm proud of at all. They have often been very toxic threads over the past few years.

I really don't want to see us lose more members because of it. I can't say an exact number who have left because of those threads (because it's impossible to really know) or have significantly reduced how often they post but I'm confident there have been a few.

Personally, I almost never post in the threads and try to avoid them as much as possible unless someone reports a post (which doesn't happen very often).
Honestly they are among the LEAST-toxic political threads I've ever seen - I think that's a tribute to the *generally* sane and mature group that we have, and better moderation than usual (even on threads most mods seem to hate!). But that just shows that politics ALWAYS ends up pissing people off and pitting them against each other.

Thank God we don't have a religion thread, and that I'm an atheist, with apologies to Buñuel.
I don't doubt what you say about them being among the least toxic political threads but that is probably a reflection of this forum compared to others (and, also, the small size of the forum meaning we attract fewer outright trolls).

I certainly think there is trolling on the threads and it's not just people disagreeing with each other.

It's really frustrating for me to have heard of a bunch of people over the years who have quit because of those threads but I'm not sure what the answer is.
Well, one thing to keep in mind is that some of those people may well have quit even without specific politics threads, because of political/social issues that might come up in the forums in general. I mean, I remember the thread about Japanese pinku getting pretty heated and I wouldn't be surprised if that and other gender/sex related issues are why flaiky disappeared, and of course political issues come up in other film discussions all the time. Don't even get me started on the meat-eating thread - looked at that once and never will again. I think many of us - and I am certainly in this category - get angry or upset fairly easily and sometimes either take it out on the forum, or just get more pissed than we maybe should at something somebody says. My solution is to ignore people, others don't like to do that but refuse to quit engaging when I'm sure they know they shouldn't. I don't know what the solution is either but shutting down the forums that are specifically about politics isn't going to make the problem go away entirely. People are very invested in their opinions and their worldviews and it's difficult sometimes coming in conflict with others who are their polar opposites. And this may well be specific only to me but I don't have any real-life contacts right now apart from a few people who live across the country, so this forum has an outsize importance to me, so I probably get more emotionally attached to - or repelled from - people and discussions here than I should. COVID is only amping that shit up - I was in a bad mood today for instance, but didn't want to go out to any of the couple of places locally I could go to spend a few hours, because it's the weekend and they'll probably have too many maskless people around. So I stayed inside and let the bile build up.

Time to go watch some Cheers I think.
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#46

Post by OldAle1 »

Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:32 pm
OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:25 pm Thank God we don't have a religion thread, and that I'm an atheist, with apologies to Buñuel.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2555
Damn that thread was only active for a couple of months. Guess people really didn't care, or just didn't want to get into it. Good.
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#47

Post by kongs_speech »

Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:32 pm
OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:25 pm Thank God we don't have a religion thread, and that I'm an atheist, with apologies to Buñuel.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2555
lol I was right, I want no fucking part of that.
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#48

Post by OldAle1 »

kongs_speech wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:30 pm
OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:25 pm Thank God we don't have a religion thread
That would likely be 50 people insulting my faith, so yes, I'm definitely good without that one. :lol:
Pastafarianism rules, dude. I won't mock you, promise. I follow Aegir myself.
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#49

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:38 pm
Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:32 pm
OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:25 pm Thank God we don't have a religion thread, and that I'm an atheist, with apologies to Buñuel.
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2555
Damn that thread was only active for a couple of months. Guess people really didn't care, or just didn't want to get into it. Good.
Damn indeed. Made me notice how much more personality I've had before my mental health issues too.
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#50

Post by OldAle1 »

Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:42 pm
OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:38 pm
Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:32 pm

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2555
Damn that thread was only active for a couple of months. Guess people really didn't care, or just didn't want to get into it. Good.
Damn indeed. Made me notice how much more personality I've had before my mental health issues too.
You still have plenty of personality, and you are not necessarily the best person to judge your own personality. I'm always very, very down on myself and on those rare occasions when I'm not I do realize that there have been a couple of people in my life who thought I was something beyond pond scum. The truth is somewhere between my own low assessment of my self-worth and the rare extravagant praise that I've received, maybe closer to the former but still I'm not a total loser. And neither are you.
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#51

Post by Onderhond »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 10th, 2021, 9:09 pm Can we please not turn this into a politics thread too :(
I'm completely unaware of the specific, I would also think it weird he left about what was being said in the politics threads as, well, they're there to talk politics. But man it would be nice if politics could be left out of all the other threads.

Americans may complain about the rest of the world commenting on their politics, but they're the ones bringing it up every chance they get.
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#52

Post by kongs_speech »

OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:47 pm
Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:42 pm
OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:38 pm

Damn that thread was only active for a couple of months. Guess people really didn't care, or just didn't want to get into it. Good.
Damn indeed. Made me notice how much more personality I've had before my mental health issues too.
You still have plenty of personality, and you are not necessarily the best person to judge your own personality. I'm always very, very down on myself and on those rare occasions when I'm not I do realize that there have been a couple of people in my life who thought I was something beyond pond scum. The truth is somewhere between my own low assessment of my self-worth and the rare extravagant praise that I've received, maybe closer to the former but still I'm not a total loser. And neither are you.
I can definitely relate to that. I always thought I was a piece of shit, and honestly, I was right. But I was living with an undiagnosed severe mental illness until the end of 2017, at which point I began a long journey towards becoming significantly less shitty. Once I finally gained control of my own brain for the first time, I decided to minimize the toxicity as much as possible and treat people better. As a result, I have a ton of friends now and I'm not aware of anyone in my life who truly hates me, but I still think I'm fucking garbage a lot of the time because my self-esteem sucks after having it beaten into my head for years by teachers, peers and family. For what it's worth, you were a cool guy on FG and you're still a cool guy.
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#53

Post by Onderhond »

The only suggestion I have for the politics thread: turn off the auto-render of twitter messages. It sounds silly, but it's easy to not click the links, but hard to not read the tweets.
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#54

Post by xianjiro »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 10th, 2021, 9:59 pm
kongs_speech wrote: January 10th, 2021, 9:40 pm I don't really see this forum as a "safe space," so I think a political thread should exist. It would be pretty lame to tell a group of adults, nearly all of whom are in our late 20s or older, that we can't discuss politics at all. It should probably be more regulated than it is, yes, but ultimately, if someone chooses to leave, that's their choice.
My, and I think the other mods, annoyance isn't about "safe space," it's about not feeling equipped to moderate it appropriately. The moderation level we have for the rest of the forum doesn't really work in a thread where people troll with disingenuous posts, answer easy questions and ignore the challenging ones, passively (and sometimes actively) insult each other, and probably other issues that I don't know because I, like others, avoid it for stretches of time. Could I moderate a politics thread? sure, probably. Do I want to? not really, and especially not without clear guidelines as to what to moderate.
guidelines is a big issue. Address that and find one person to moderate the controversial threads - I think those are mostly the one with a version of Politic in the title, but of course Covid (has? and) could get testy.

Do the software not allow you to treat given threads with special rules?
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#55

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

Onderhond wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:58 pm The only suggestion I have for the politics thread: turn off the auto-render of twitter messages. It sounds silly, but it's easy to not click the links, but hard to not read the tweets.
I can't do that on a per thread basis. I'm not even sure I can do it on a per forum section basis.
xianjiro wrote: January 10th, 2021, 11:00 pm Do the software not allow you to treat given threads with special rules?
No, there are board wide settings and per forum section settings, but the only thread specific options are lock and unlock.
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#56

Post by Lakigigar »

OldAle1 wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:25 pm
AdamH wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:20 pm I'll be honest, I can't stand the political threads on here (I actually have a degree in politics although I haven't done anything politics-related since graduating). We have had endless issues on here because of the political threads and we've definitely had a few people quit the forum because of them (including some of the most active posters).

I don't really know how we can handle it. There is a lot of trolling in that thread. People seem to deny it but it's very obvious. As much as I love the forum, the political threads are not something I'm proud of at all. They have often been very toxic threads over the past few years.

I really don't want to see us lose more members because of it. I can't say an exact number who have left because of those threads (because it's impossible to really know) or have significantly reduced how often they post but I'm confident there have been a few.

Personally, I almost never post in the threads and try to avoid them as much as possible unless someone reports a post (which doesn't happen very often).
Honestly they are among the LEAST-toxic political threads I've ever seen - I think that's a tribute to the *generally* sane and mature group that we have, and better moderation than usual (even on threads most mods seem to hate!). But that just shows that politics ALWAYS ends up pissing people off and pitting them against each other.

Thank God we don't have a religion thread, and that I'm an atheist, with apologies to Buñuel.
i agree, like this is the least toxic place for politics on the entire internet that i've ever seen.
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#57

Post by Onderhond »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 10th, 2021, 11:03 pm
Onderhond wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:58 pm The only suggestion I have for the politics thread: turn off the auto-render of twitter messages. It sounds silly, but it's easy to not click the links, but hard to not read the tweets.
I can't do that on a per thread basis. I'm not even sure I can do it on a per forum section basis.
Just disable it altogether? It's a forum, people shouldn't be encouraged to talk through length-capped messages of others.
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#58

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

Onderhond wrote: January 10th, 2021, 11:09 pm
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 10th, 2021, 11:03 pm
Onderhond wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:58 pm The only suggestion I have for the politics thread: turn off the auto-render of twitter messages. It sounds silly, but it's easy to not click the links, but hard to not read the tweets.
I can't do that on a per thread basis. I'm not even sure I can do it on a per forum section basis.
Just disable it altogether? It's a forum, people shouldn't be encouraged to talk through length-capped messages of others.
I'm open to this.
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#59

Post by xianjiro »

Onderhond wrote: January 10th, 2021, 10:58 pm The only suggestion I have for the politics thread: turn off the auto-render of twitter messages. It sounds silly, but it's easy to not click the links, but hard to not read the tweets.
this is a good suggestion and personally, if posters don't provide context for the links, I just skip them

another suggestion: put all "Toxic" threads in one sub-forum then provide some basic guidelines - not sure exactly what I'd advocate for these to be just off the top of my head - beyond that any users who enter, enter at their own risk

I'm not sure what AdamH is seeing that's trolly - I see it mostly as the way certain users wish to present their thoughts. I may not be excited by either the methodology or their position, but I don't want to see them "controlled" for either reason.

If the toxic threads were moved to a special folder, could a group of frequent posters or other interested members be tasked with responsibility for keeping order?
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#60

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

xianjiro wrote: January 10th, 2021, 11:13 pm another suggestion: put all "Toxic" threads in one sub-forum then provide some basic guidelines - not sure exactly what I'd advocate for these to be just off the top of my head - beyond that any users who enter, enter at their own risk
We've discussed this in the past and the idea of making a subforum for 3 threads has always felt like it would invite more problems than it solves, but maybe it is the answer.
I'm not sure what AdamH is seeing that's trolly - I see it mostly as the way certain users wish to present their thoughts. I may not be excited by either the methodology or their position, but I don't want to see them "controlled" for either reason.
I won't speak for Adam, but I'll leave it at this: It's a discussion forum, "presenting your thoughts" is worthless if you're not going to reasonably reply to criticism of your thoughts. Presenting thoughts which may or may not be your own, or even ones you agree with, to stir things up and you'll decide later if they are thoughts you feel like defending is another common issue. Both of these I'd consider trolling, especially when done regularly. There's other more overt trolling in those threads too. These concerns are completely independent of whatever position the posters in question may be presenting.
xianjiro wrote: January 10th, 2021, 11:13 pm If the toxic threads were moved to a special folder, could a group of frequent posters or other interested members be tasked with responsibility for keeping order?
They could, I'm not sure who I'd want to give such a cursed thankless task to, though.
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#61

Post by xianjiro »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 10th, 2021, 11:22 pm
xianjiro wrote: January 10th, 2021, 11:13 pm If the toxic threads were moved to a special folder, could a group of frequent posters or other interested members be tasked with responsibility for keeping order?
They could, I'm not sure who I'd want to give such a cursed thankless task to, though.
was thinking about this while making a cup of tea. I'm a big believer in putting the responsibility on the group involved. Let them propose a list of simple rules (no trolling, no flaming, argue the position - maybe with some explanation or examples). Everyone who posts has to agree to those rules and something like three strikes and they're banned from the subforum.

As for mods, best solution would be one from the left, one from the right, and someone both moderate in their views but also in their approach to the forum. Another option: after we got passed the rules, ask the users who'd they like to be moderators.

If the group can't solve a problem on their own, then they can request help from the regular mod team who will review the questioned post(s) and provide a final decision, but really, it should be upon the heads of those who participate to do it respectfully and honestly. However, without clear rules that can be pointed to easily, no one really knows what goes beyond the pale. And even though one recent exchange wasn't pleasant, those two users have an on going battle so I decided to let it pass without reporting. Plus it seemed to be short-lived.
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#62

Post by 3eyes »

The prospect of a subforum "Trolls and toxic threads" raises interesting possibilities.

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#63

Post by Armoreska »

Maybe it actually was the casual use of the I-word and such.
No, can't be, only 2 words have entered the US liberal bannosphere so far.
Oprah? Ellen?
he or A. or Armo or any

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#64

Post by 72aicm »

joachimt wrote: January 10th, 2021, 7:58 pm Sorry to tell you guys...... Cocoa left the forum. He also deleted his iCM-account.
Damn. He’ll be missed. :(
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#65

Post by Tim2460 »

I actually set someone to ignore status after spending only 3 days reading the thread ....

That's indeed Toxic :facepalm:

It's a shame seeing Cocoa leaving
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#66

Post by Onderhond »

Honestly: that ignore option should be disabled.
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#67

Post by OldAle1 »

Onderhond wrote: January 11th, 2021, 1:28 pm Honestly: that ignore option should be disabled.
Good way to get me to cancel my account immediately.
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#68

Post by Onderhond »

OldAle1 wrote: January 11th, 2021, 1:59 pm
Onderhond wrote: January 11th, 2021, 1:28 pm Honestly: that ignore option should be disabled.
Good way to get me to cancel my account immediately.
That would be a shame, but it's better to learn to live with others than to get lost in your own echo chamber.
I don't ignore anyone here (wouldn't even know how to) and I have no idea which posts could be considered so bad that they are better left unseen.
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#69

Post by AdamH »

I ignore a small number of users on a football forum I use. I think it's fair enough for people to use the ignore function.
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#70

Post by Teproc »

Onderhond wrote: January 11th, 2021, 1:28 pm Honestly: that ignore option should be disabled.
It really shouldn't. Ignoring things that may piss you off on the Internet is a healthy thing to do. Whatever you may say about bubbles, real life provides more than enough irritating behaviour and adversarial opinions that I don't need to get annoyed by people on the Internet. If this forum didn't have an ignore option, I would never come on here.
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#71

Post by Onderhond »

Teproc wrote: January 11th, 2021, 2:21 pm Ignoring things that may piss you off on the Internet is a healthy thing to do.
Learning not to get pissed off by things on the internet is a healthy skill to have (and a very necessary one too). But it's clear people are really lacking that skill and it only gets worse when they can easily ignore everything and everyone they don't agree with.

I mean, I'd kinda get it if this was 4chan and people had to worry about running into freaky pornography, extreme trolling and rampant incel/SJW behavior, but you won't find much here beyond an occasional curse word or a strongly worded controversial opinion. If that's crossing the line of being able to tolerate someone, I find that worrying.
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#72

Post by Torgo »

What, really? I'm de facto surprised that several users are making use of the ignore option. :blink: I totally thought that feature was just "there" as part of the BB-Board-infrastructure and easier to just leave on than to eliminate. And it works globally, not only in the Off-Topic forums, I assume?
Worst case is you have 2 people discussing a film in a poll, passing opinions back and forth. How do you as a third participant make any profit of a such an exchange with missing 50% of the conversation? Very weird.

The board really has a quite civil community, especially since some of the loudest posters here have gone into retirement or been politely removed (Lim ..). Didn't think we'd need a block feature. :/
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#73

Post by mightysparks »

Wait I don’t know why the meat thread is political, I just post yummy vegetarian and vegan recipes that I find :/
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#74

Post by OldAle1 »

Here's a little personal context -

10-12 years ago I was a regular on the Amazon forums. I had written a fair number of reviews, and got involved in the reviewer forums, where there were several of the top reviewers - there were reviewer rankings at that time which were a big deal, you could get LOTS of free stuff out of it, some people got $10,000+ worth of free stuff to review per year direct from manufacturers. Anyway it was almost totally unregulated and there certainly was no ignore function IIRC, or it was useless. One of the things we used to do quite a lot was to point out fake reviews and reviewers to each other, and occasionally try to push Amazon into doing something about it, which they almost never did. $$$ is way more important than integrity. But one guy - who I think was in the top 50 overall reviewers at the time (out of millions) or maybe even top 10 - we found to have plagiarized virtually 100% of his 4,000+ reviews. It was easy to track him because nearly everything he reviewed was about gay and/or Jewish or Southern (USA) issues, it was nearly all books, and most of them had very few other reviews. And he stole all of his stuff, and was getting rewarded for it with lots of free shit. We notified Amazon over and over, they did nothing. THEN he came onto the forum and started threatening us, and using lots of vile racist and misogynist invective - he was gay and Jewish himself, but he was perfectly ok attacking black or Hispanic or Asian people or women. Eventually he started doxxing people, including me (though he hilariously got my info 100% wrong), and threatening to kill us. Amazon still didn't do anything - until they found he'd plagiarized some NYT reviews and they started worrying about legal action. Eventually he did get booted entirely, all his reviews removed, and I think he was investigated by the cops.

In the 2 years before the IMDb forums self-destructed, there was a particularly awful troll who started posting heavily on the two forums - Film General and the Classics Board - that I frequented. He had dozens of names that I and others figured out - I think around 70-80 that I figured out belonged either to him or someone allied with him, but of course there were probably more, because he had many accounts that were wiped within 24 hours. He also threatened to doxx me and wipe my account out - and my account was given the "red letters of death" over and over during this period, meaning that I'd been reported multiple times and I'd best be careful. This person attacked lots of people - he was a fairly sophisticated troll so there were lots of different gimmicks he used to build support for his trolling and build hatred for the people he'd decided to attack - but I think I and a user who last went by "Dusty6" were the most frequent targets. Dusty killed himself during this period - for reasons not having anything to do with the trolling I should be clear - and this troll continued to attack and mock him. He got many of my threads wiped on the Classics board, and he was joined (spiritually you might say) by another troll in the last couple of years who usurped one of my yearly polls and posted the results himself, because he was pissed that I wouldn't allow his (clearly fake - he posted lists of all lost or nonexistent films) participation in another poll. IMDb DID have an ignore function, and it also had a report function, but it was all fairly useless, and this is much of the reason why they ended up closing the forums - it was clear that the only way for them to have non-troll-racism-etc infected forums was to spend some money, which they adamantly were against doing.

Now when they closed the forums of course those people (like me) that were regulars all migrated to other platforms (like this one). The two IMDb trolls I just mentioned had lots of support from people - including somebody who has since become a regular here. This particular person always comes off as a nice, polite person, but he always loved to interact with even the worst people on IMDb, as long as they weren't insulting or using nasty language (and again, trolls had multiple accounts, and often would have a "nice" one that was less abrasive and overtly insulting, which wasn't hard to figure out if you were paying attention); either he is terribly naive, the kind of person who thinks you're not a racist if you don't use the n-word, or dissembling in his behavior. Because anybody on those forums as much as he or I were could see that these same people kept coming back, changing their names, and attacking me and others, over and over, trying to get us wiped out, and in the case of the first IMDb troll I mentioned, trying to wipe out the forums altogether; he had in fact nearly destroyed a forum devoted to chess before moving on to IMDb. This same troll-sympathizer now on this forum also said a lot of pretty reactionary things over the 5 years or more I've "known" him (like being against gay marriage just because "tradition"), and apparently still thinks our current fascist Pres is a good guy. So though I gave him the benefit of the doubt after joining this forum - and frankly over time sort of forgot about some of the bad stuff from IMDb - I have to say I consider him a very bad actor, at the best like I said hopelessly naive, at worst a terrible bigot and supporter of abusive assholes. Because "free speech", y'know? Well, I'm not interested in his particular conception of free speech, and I'm not interested in reading anything he has to say anymore, even if he does have good taste in movies. The whole picture is important.

So I've taken a LOT of abuse from people online, and seen others take a lot more than I have. And yeah, this forum is different, and we have very few people like the ones I've mentioned. But they can still cause harm by trolling or attacking people, and frankly I don't think it should be entirely or even mostly on us to grow thicker skins, as Onderhond seems to imply is the right thing. Just because we don't want to interact with a few people - I have 5 people on ignore, and two of them don't post much at all anymore - does not mean we're' in little bubbles or crybabies; it's not an either/or where you let anybody say anything or you clamp down on everybody's "free speech". And in the real world we have some choice in whom to associate with and to ignore, so I'm not sure why cyberspace, which over the last year has become the only world for a lot of us, should be radically different.
Last edited by OldAle1 on January 11th, 2021, 3:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#75

Post by OldAle1 »

Sorry that was so long but this is something I feel strongly about. I've never seen a forum that I considered healthy that didn't have fairly strong moderation and an ability for people to keep away from others they consider abusive.
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#76

Post by Onderhond »

OldAle1 wrote: January 11th, 2021, 3:22 pm and frankly I don't think it should be entirely or even mostly on us to grow thicker skins, as Onderhond seems to imply is the right thing.
I'm not advocating people need to grow thicker skins (though that would be helpful), I'm merely saying that it helps a lot if you can put things in perspective. There's a difference between a personal attack and a belief for example, even when that belief discriminates on a group of people. Personal attacks need to be moderated and don't belong on a forum like this, but people should be able to express their beliefs and feelings freely (as long as they're genuine).

I think your example of "being against gay marriage" is actually quite fitting for this discussion, as I don't think stating that isn't inherently wrong or malicious, not should it be something that is so aggravating to see that you simply can't occupy the same space with a person. There's a civil way to disagree about things like that and proper conversation is usually the best way to get people to rethink their own opinions. Also, blocking that person doesn't make the world a different place, the person doesn't just vanish.

And while I agree that it's sometimes better to avoid discussions with certain people (not everyone can get along), that's different from an "ignore" functionality, which blacks out entire conversations. When you don't want to interact or react to a comment, that should be a conscious decision every time you come into contact with a person, not a blanket functionality.
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#77

Post by RogerTheMovieManiac88 »

Just so people know for sure, it is me that Ale is referencing in his second-to-last paragraph above.

I always try to be open to talking and engaging with users, and it is true that one of my turn-offs is crude language/profanities. Perhaps there is a naivety on my part...
Last edited by RogerTheMovieManiac88 on January 11th, 2021, 4:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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#78

Post by kongs_speech »

I personally do not use the ignore function on this forum, though I certainly used it back in the day on IMDb, but I'm glad it's there for people like Ale who shouldn't have to see posts from people who only upset them. It's a perfect way for everyone to feel comfortable here without requiring any harsher moderation.
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#79

Post by Torgo »

Okay, so OldAle brought quite some (hi)story with him and that other person, which I won't judge here (because who would I be to do so?). Not saying that this case doesn't matter, but it's a pretty special situation and a total exception to the forum's norm .. or isn't it? :ermm:

Teproc wrote: January 11th, 2021, 2:21 pm Whatever you may say about bubbles, real life provides more than enough irritating behaviour and adversarial opinions that I don't need to get annoyed by people on the Internet. If this forum didn't have an ignore option, I would never come on here.
Excuse me if I'm getting too curious, but just upon looking up your user profile (without diving too deep into stalking territory), you joined in 2015 and have 45% of your posts in "Our lists and projects", as well as Challenges and stuff. At first glance, it looks highly unpolitical.
Have you still had encounters you deemed so annoying that you seriously considered leaving the forum, or which truly degraded your forum experience? Maybe even without getting into fights, but by reading alone.
Not implying you're a wimpy kid or something and also everyone has to decide for himself on how to get through the internet. It just seems so improbable to me, personally, to be enraged or annoyed simply by our list threads.
(But then again, I only participate in the <400 posts ..)

Because then, we wouldn't need to lock down politic threads. :think: People still can be dicks if they want to.

Which reminds me ..
Two very prominent users of this forum used to have fights and childish arguments in every single thread. It was a mess. Both of them have become very quiet in the following years.
I don't think(?) it even had anything to do with politics, and it was hard to moderate. When you throw a bunch of people together, some might clash. It's the way humans are. Especially if they come in all ages, forms and nationalities like here - a fact which I very much appreciate.
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#80

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

Torgo wrote: January 11th, 2021, 5:22 pm Two very prominent users of this forum used to have fights and childish arguments in every single thread. It was a mess. Both of them have become very quiet in the following years.
I don't think(?) it even had anything to do with politics, and it was hard to moderate.
Yeah, and it was a mistake to let them go on like that. They are (were?) both good posters and reigning in their silly maybe real maybe played up feud would have made things more readable for everyone and probably better for them too.
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