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Covid-19 Quarantine

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Got it?

Yeah, I got it and feel HORRIBLE.
0
No votes
Yes, I got it, but am doing okay.
1
5%
Yes, I had it but have recovered.
2
10%
I think I had it, but not sure.
1
5%
No, still waiting.
10
50%
No, I know I won't get it. Ever.
3
15%
I got vaccinated!
1
5%
What are we talking about? I live under a rock.
2
10%
 
Total votes: 20

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AdamH
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#1761

Post by AdamH »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-53575964

"US President Donald Trump has again defended the use of hydroxychloroquine to ward off coronavirus, contradicting his own public health officials.

He said the malaria medication was only rejected as a Covid-19 treatment because he had recommended its use."

:circle: :circle: :circle: :circle: :circle: :circle:
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#1762

Post by brokenface »

AdamH wrote: July 29th, 2020, 5:17 pm https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-53575964

"US President Donald Trump has again defended the use of hydroxychloroquine to ward off coronavirus, contradicting his own public health officials.

He said the malaria medication was only rejected as a Covid-19 treatment because he had recommended its use."

:circle: :circle: :circle: :circle: :circle: :circle:
They've gone hard back to promoting this again the last couple of days, back for another round of hail Mary cure because the death rate is going up and it's clear they lost control across numerous states.

As said when he did his first round promoting this, it's dangerous on several levels. First, the obvious, that it's a drug with known side effects that can be dangerous to some people. His promotion encourages people to think it's safe for everyone. Second yes, it could be that it does have some effectiveness, but the politicising damages in both directions. There is enough plausibility that it's worth testing which is why it's in trials, but there's also plenty of other similar candidates that might be getting overlooked because of all this political focus. In a way he could be right that there is more scrutiny and cynicism about it because he has promoted it, but that is his fault as well. This is why you shouldn't just blindly promote something before you have evidence if you are in a position as powerful as his.

I am pretty dubious though, given that most of its promoters beyond Trump seem highly untrustworthy. There's this slipperiness in its promoters where they'll keep shifting goalposts in terms of how it's supposed to work, so that if a trial shows it not working, they'll say oh it's meant to be used earlier, and with zinc, and in lower doses, and so on. Wouldn't be surprised if it's getting to homeopathic doses soon. If you take a microdose of HCQ every morning and don't get Covid that day it must be working, that sort of thing. The French guy who promoted it originally is a quack who used it in a clinic with no ethical approvals or consent process, and a massive selection bias because his clinic basically doesn't take any properly sick people. So he gave it to low risk Covid patients who would likely recover anyway, with no control of people not getting it and then proclaims it a cure on the basis they recover, when very high % would recover anyway. It's hard to dig through the bullshit, but the majority of serious studies have had mixed or negative results that I've seen. There must be some financial reason at the back of why this particular drug was promoted originally, but it seems to have morphed into a pure cult belief thing.
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#1763

Post by Knaldskalle »

Another factor is that we have people who use and need hydroxychloroquin to treat shingles. They're having a harder time getting it now.
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#1765

Post by xianjiro »

brokenface wrote: July 29th, 2020, 5:09 pm
peeptoad wrote: July 29th, 2020, 2:20 pm Just had a nasal swab done and it wasn't so bad... assuming I did it correctly.
I didn't find it painful as such but it's a really unpleasant feeling in a spot where you don't normally feel anything or are really aware exists :yucky: I could sense it there for about 24hrs afterwards.
While far from pleasant or fun, it certainly wasn't the most invasive medical procedure I've endured. Sure, it was uncomfortable, but it was only 10 seconds. Can't say I noticed any after effects or even thought much about it.

I hope early stories about bad experiences (found online, etc) don't keep anyone who needs a test from getting tested.
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#1766

Post by xianjiro »

Not sure if anyone's read this op-ed by a Yale don, but it got me to wondering what's behind this divide. If it wasn't for the steady stream of people saying basically this same thing in hope of propping up a failing White House, including today's viral video, I might be tempted to believe this Harvey A. Risch, MD, PhD, professor of epidemiology at Yale School of Public Health. Guess that the main proponents of hydroxychloroquine aren't trustworthy sources of information.

I read an article about "America's Frontline Doctors", their love of that drug, hatred of masks and SD/PD, etc, that links them to some group called "Tea Party Patriots" :o and, well, let's say all credibility went out the window. But the opinion piece linked above doesn't carry the same baggage nor am I able to find the kind of repudiation of Risch as say, someone who believes demons steal sperm while men sleep ... :blink:
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#1767

Post by OldAle1 »

2012 long-shot Republican Presidential candidate Herman Cain has died of COVID - 5 weeks after attending Agent Orange's Tulsa rally, mask-free, at the age of 74 - the same age as the "President". I was thinking Cain was one of the few people out there on the national stage both as clueless and as crazy as the current WH resident, but then I thought about it for 3 seconds. Unfortunately it's a vast percentage of the Republican "leadership" on the state, national and local level - Cain is in fact more typical than atypical. And I posted this here rather than in the Obit thread because I'd imagine only a few non-Americans would remember or care about 2nd-tier candidates from 8 years ago. While I certainly didn't wish him dead, and feel bad for his family - some of whom are probably living closer to the real world than Cain was, I can only hope that if more people like him - national conservative figures - get sick and/or die, it might - might, very small chance - help to move the needle in the right direction.
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#1768

Post by peeptoad »

brokenface wrote: July 29th, 2020, 5:09 pm
peeptoad wrote: July 29th, 2020, 2:20 pm Just had a nasal swab done and it wasn't so bad... assuming I did it correctly.
I didn't find it painful as such but it's a really unpleasant feeling in a spot where you don't normally feel anything or are really aware exists :yucky: I could sense it there for about 24hrs afterwards.
I didn't even have that. The worst part was holding it in there for 10 seconds, but even that wasn't so much. Makes me think something is awry. :unsure:
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#1769

Post by blocho »

Some tests require a swab that goes deep into the nostril, but there's a different kind of test where I don't think it has to go that far up the sinus cavity.
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#1770

Post by brokenface »

peeptoad wrote: July 30th, 2020, 6:40 pm
brokenface wrote: July 29th, 2020, 5:09 pm
peeptoad wrote: July 29th, 2020, 2:20 pm Just had a nasal swab done and it wasn't so bad... assuming I did it correctly.
I didn't find it painful as such but it's a really unpleasant feeling in a spot where you don't normally feel anything or are really aware exists :yucky: I could sense it there for about 24hrs afterwards.
I didn't even have that. The worst part was holding it in there for 10 seconds, but even that wasn't so much. Makes me think something is awry. :unsure:
I'm sure it's fine, wouldn't worry. As blocho says could be different type of swab and, besides, i know from talking to people who got one same place i did, people experience them differently.
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#1771

Post by sebby »

Perhaps brokenface was unknowingly chosen to be a beta tester of the Bill Gates corona mind control nano chip.
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#1772

Post by peeptoad »

brokenface wrote: July 30th, 2020, 7:33 pm
peeptoad wrote: July 30th, 2020, 6:40 pm
brokenface wrote: July 29th, 2020, 5:09 pm

I didn't find it painful as such but it's a really unpleasant feeling in a spot where you don't normally feel anything or are really aware exists :yucky: I could sense it there for about 24hrs afterwards.
I didn't even have that. The worst part was holding it in there for 10 seconds, but even that wasn't so much. Makes me think something is awry. :unsure:
I'm sure it's fine, wouldn't worry. As blocho says could be different type of swab and, besides, i know from talking to people who got one same place i did, people experience them differently.
Yeah, it's probably fine I agree... they were smaller/shorter swabs than I've seen before (got it done at my work since they are falling just short of mandating weekly swabs at this point).
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#1773

Post by peeptoad »

Result= negative
That means mask wearing, distancing and sanitizing shit works (though most reasonable people get this remedial fact by now). I've been taking public transport and going all over campus for the last 6 weeks, without being anal retentive about it and no problems so far.
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#1774

Post by Onderhond »

I doubt doubt the effectiveness of masks themselves, I do think there are genuine concerns regarding the way most people deal with them.

Masks are now mandatory here, but it's obvious they give people a false sense of security, which reduces the effect of social distancing. Furthermore, people are crap at handling their masks. You're decently protected when walking around, but when you fondle the outside while taking them off or you keep reusing the same mask, it's all been for naught. It's a shame "wearing masks" has become one of the US left vs right issues again, because there's more than just science at play here.
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#1775

Post by joachimt »

The mayors of Rotterdam and Amsterdam said they will enforce wearing masks in some areas of the city, even though the government doesn't want to enforce the use of masks in public spaces. Several experts in law already said it's impossible to enforce it like those two mayors want to do, because it's in conflict with the constitution.

In the meantime beaches were getting very crowded today, because of the warm weather. At several places roads had to be closed down.
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#1776

Post by Kublai Khan »

Good find:

Owner of two platinums:
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#1777

Post by xianjiro »

Read this article about how parents are adapting to the new reality in schooling and like always, those best able are doing better at dealing with the changed world. Wonder what ripples will become waves in the years ahead thanks to the virus. I also knew that some folks would figure out how to make money off of this - for better or worse - we'll have to wait and see.

But it does bring up an interesting topic: society has created schools to teach children (granted there is a heavy amount of socialization that happens and this is either good or bad depending on one's view). It isn't a stretch to argue that public schools - especially in places where the goal is to get everyone up to a certain standard - are an exercise in socialism, even in very capitalistic societies (or especially so). There doesn't seem to be much thought about "pawning off" one's offspring on the collective, but is this because everyone believes it is for the better or simply because it's been made an easy means to an end - parents want/need to work and thus someone has to take care of raising the offspring when a parent isn't home to do the job.

So while the thought that an entire cohort of learners is being 'left behind', as long as everyone is experiencing the same stagnation in their education, it hardly seems worth fretting too much about. But as the linked article clearly suggests, some parents are better able to deal with the challenges regardless if it's through purchasing a replacement or supplement for their local school or by knowing where to look for help/advice. It does seem clear that this isn't just about the money, but one has to have a certain skill set to be able to network and discern what will work well for one's children.

And like we're seeing with the changes to the concept of 'going to work', I'm now starting to wonder if this pandemic won't change other parts of society - for better or worse. Imagine if people are able to figure out a better model for educating and socializing their youngsters; what incentive will there be to keep school's open unless it's simply to manage other parent's children while they are away from home?

I'd hate to see this be another call for further erosion of funding for the public school system.
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#1778

Post by xianjiro »

Being a small state, Oregon doesn't have the usual depth and breadth often found elsewhere academically, so here's another instance of how CoV-19 is changing things - and probably not for the better.

Loss of high-level engineer at state geology agency is ‘a detriment to public safety in Oregon'

While we can hope that such an important job will eventually be brought back, I fear this is the start of the pain yet to come. While everyone is focused on work and school, we haven't really started to address what will happen to other responsibilities we share as a society. I'm thinking the next budget cycle(s) are going to be particularly brutal with a great deal of pain for smaller governments unable to print money the way DC has been doing.
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#1779

Post by maxwelldeux »

xianjiro wrote: August 4th, 2020, 8:28 am So while the thought that an entire cohort of learners is being 'left behind', as long as everyone is experiencing the same stagnation in their education, it hardly seems worth fretting too much about.
Yeah, that's the problem - not everyone is experiencing the same stagnation in their education.

Money solves problems. Kid is struggling a bit with school? Hire a tutor. Need to devote a ton of time to home schooling? Parent1 can stay home and do that because Parent2 makes well into the six-figures. Can't get all the kids working on the family computers? Buy some more. Etc. It's a SES problem, which correlates with ethnicity, unfortunately. The next 1-5 years are going to be SUPER telling about the "lost generation" of kids and how far behind they are.
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#1780

Post by Knaldskalle »

xianjiro wrote: August 4th, 2020, 8:28 am I'd hate to see this be another call for further erosion of funding for the public school system.
I have absolutely no doubt that it'll be used to reduce funding to schools. "You couldn't even open schools on time, why should we fund you?" - I can already hear it.

xianjiro wrote: August 4th, 2020, 8:53 am While we can hope that such an important job will eventually be brought back, I fear this is the start of the pain yet to come. While everyone is focused on work and school, we haven't really started to address what will happen to other responsibilities we share as a society. I'm thinking the next budget cycle(s) are going to be particularly brutal with a great deal of pain for smaller governments unable to print money the way DC has been doing.
It'll be a bloodbath next year. In NM the state legislature met for a special session in June because the budget for 2020-2021 clearly wasn't going to unfold as planned in January. They decided to cut most stuff that wasn't education (ed was only cut by 1%), but with state income - largely from oil and gas - drastically down we're facing serious cuts next year. I wouldn't be surprised to see 20% cuts across the board.
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#1781

Post by xianjiro »

Yeah, that 20% number comes as no surprise, but how do you cut 20% from healthcare or nutrition during a health crisis? UGH!
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#1782

Post by xianjiro »

This is very telling -Detroit Lions' Matthew Stafford's wife blames NFL for harassment received after false positive coronavirus test
"I have been losing my mind because of how my Family has been treated since my husband was put on COVID-IR," Kelly Stafford wrote. "Even after we knew it was false positive, our school told us they were not allowed back, I was approached in a grocery store and told I was 'endangering others,' my kids were harassed and kicked off a playground, I was told I needed to wait in my car when trying to pick up food, and people closest to us had to get tested just so they could go back to work."
I just can't tell what it's telling us, although, if this is what happens to famous white guy and upper middle class family, I can only imagine what happens to most people dealing with this.
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#1784

Post by xianjiro »

huh, you mean kids in school aren't social distancing? Who'dathunkit?
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#1785

Post by mightysparks »

There was a social distancing sign on an elevator at uni saying ‘maximum 1 person’—4 of us went in lol. Granted we have 0 cases in WA at the moment..
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#1786

Post by xianjiro »

Why health experts can’t figure out coronavirus surge: ‘No access to data’

headline above says it all - a bit longer read, but if you're curious about topic, there's plenty of information to mull over.
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#1788

Post by xianjiro »

If I wasn't convinced the world had gone nuts a few years ago, I would be now.
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#1789

Post by xianjiro »

Pretentious Hipster wrote: August 5th, 2020, 8:43 pm
A bit more information about what may be the source of these photos - I don't know specifically that these photos were posted by the girl referenced in my link, but it seems very likely.

Anyway, she was suspended - retaliation much? - the suspension has been rescinded while they are 'investigating'. They are also reporting a 10% !!! mask rate. Sorry, in my earlier response I indicated my lack of surprise (that they weren't socially distancing) - that seems like a rather dramatic understatement.

I'm firmly convinced we need to figure out how to live with this and denial is not an option. It's just way too clear to me (anecdotally) that reopening leads to viral spread and we can't stay in lockdown indefinitely.

Denial is such bull shit.
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#1790

Post by blocho »

I read a news article where the principal of the school said he didn't have the ability to force students to wear masks. That is completely insane. There are many, many schools across the country that enforce a dress code. The school I most recently taught at had a dress code. I think it's more probable that the principal was scared of angry parents and politicians who react to masks the same way I react to cockroaches.
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#1791

Post by sebby »

You don't count the dead when God's on your side. I think Bob Dylan sang that. Sums up the sentiments of American conservative policy pretty well. Who or what their god is varies by the individual (money, ignorance, Trump, etc). Part of the reason children and educators will be allowed to get sick and sometimes die is that so many sitting in positions of power don't actually give a fuck about the human cost.
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#1792

Post by brokenface »

Is everyone experiencing this thing where you meet friends you haven't seen for a while and it's pretty much fifty-fifty if they've gone covid-paranoid or covid-denial and it's actually not that easy to predict which way they've gone?
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#1793

Post by Knaldskalle »

blocho wrote: August 8th, 2020, 8:37 pm I read a news article where the principal of the school said he didn't have the ability to force students to wear masks. That is completely insane. There are many, many schools across the country that enforce a dress code. The school I most recently taught at had a dress code. I think it's more probable that the principal was scared of angry parents and politicians who react to masks the same way I react to cockroaches.
The high school in question has a lengthy dress code.
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#1794

Post by blocho »

Knaldskalle wrote: August 8th, 2020, 11:29 pm
blocho wrote: August 8th, 2020, 8:37 pm I read a news article where the principal of the school said he didn't have the ability to force students to wear masks. That is completely insane. There are many, many schools across the country that enforce a dress code. The school I most recently taught at had a dress code. I think it's more probable that the principal was scared of angry parents and politicians who react to masks the same way I react to cockroaches.
The high school in question has a lengthy dress code.
What the fuck is the matter with that principal.

By the way, if you click the link above, you can see this excerpt from the school's dress code: skirts must be no more than “3 [inches] from the top of the kneecap as measured by a ruler or the length of a 3 x 5 index card

My bold. That's American education in action right there.
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#1795

Post by xianjiro »

brokenface wrote: August 8th, 2020, 10:36 pm Is everyone experiencing this thing where you meet friends you haven't seen for a while and it's pretty much fifty-fifty if they've gone covid-paranoid or covid-denial and it's actually not that easy to predict which way they've gone?
So far it hasn't been an issue for the most part. The people I associate with have generally been pretty upfront with their viewpoints but are also respectful of others. Can't really say I know anyone who's in full-stage denial, but will say that that general political viewpoint colors their views on appropriateness of the response to a large degree. For instance, one neighbor/friend who has always been a big Trump fan (and had a personal connection to him once upon a different life), still wears a mask at the grocery store - I bumped into him there a couple weeks back - but if I see him while walking the dog, neither of us wear masks and we hang out in the yard chatting while the dogs play.

Another couple I know, is pretty right-wing, wears masks but eats in restaurants in Texas all the time. Not really sure how to parse that. I do know that he doesn't like anyone telling him he can't do what he wants to do though.

The one most surprising situation happened when I contacted someone over text and got back something posted to an anti-Guardian website, but alas, he also believes thermite charges were planted in the WTC. He asked me what I thought and I told him in no uncertain terms and why. While I agree it's useful to question what we are reading and told, as I've said many times on this forum, knowing the source and their agenda is just as important as what they say. My text contact just wants life to be better: he wants to do the right thing, but like that hydroxychloroquinine (or whatever it's called) piece from a Yale don I posted some time back, it's easy to get off on the wrong tangent (IMO) for the 'best' of intentions.

Imagine if I had a much wider circle of acquaintances I might experience more of what you're suggesting though, so I don't expect my experience to be transferable.
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#1796

Post by Knaldskalle »

blocho wrote: August 9th, 2020, 2:17 am
Knaldskalle wrote: August 8th, 2020, 11:29 pm
blocho wrote: August 8th, 2020, 8:37 pm I read a news article where the principal of the school said he didn't have the ability to force students to wear masks. That is completely insane. There are many, many schools across the country that enforce a dress code. The school I most recently taught at had a dress code. I think it's more probable that the principal was scared of angry parents and politicians who react to masks the same way I react to cockroaches.
The high school in question has a lengthy dress code.
What the fuck is the matter with that principal.

By the way, if you click the link above, you can see this excerpt from the school's dress code: skirts must be no more than “3 [inches] from the top of the kneecap as measured by a ruler or the length of a 3 x 5 index card

My bold. That's American education in action right there.
Indeed. Maybe they think "length" is 3 and 5 is "height"?

And we're strangely going through something similar here. Our local superintendent just "outed" himself on Facebook as a mask-hating covid-denier. School board is meeting Monday evening with the superintendent as the only item on the agenda. Granted, the government can't punish people for speaking their minds, but I don't want him to be in charge of children's safety, not when his personal opinion is in direct opposition to his duty.
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#1797

Post by xianjiro »

Got not problem with someone being personally "a mask-hating covid-denier" as long as they confine such beliefs to their own life and can separate that from how they do their job, but it's similar (in my mind) to Christian fundamentalists that are anti-gay or pro-life refusing to serve someone who is LGBTQ+ or pro-choice. However, it's super easy to understand why being against something would cause a serious crisis in trust. However, I always tend to prefer that people are up-front about this shit: nothing is worse than someone acting on their personal convictions, those actions affecting others, especially people unable to make a choice to do something different, and no one understanding the real reason why they are doing what they are doing.

We really have a second pandemic in many countries. It's called a crisis of confidence in our social institutions.
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#1798

Post by joachimt »

brokenface wrote: August 8th, 2020, 10:36 pm Is everyone experiencing this thing where you meet friends you haven't seen for a while and it's pretty much fifty-fifty if they've gone covid-paranoid or covid-denial and it's actually not that easy to predict which way they've gone?
Yeah, so annoying and awkward often. Last week we met a friend after a while who asked “are you guys doing hugs again or still not?” Almost feels like you’re weird for not hugging.
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joachimt
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#1799

Post by joachimt »

Btw, I’m on vacation. We rented a house at a park. It’s just my wife and kids and it’s mostly not hard to keep distance from others, except for the supermarket.

The park also has houses for 8 people. The policy is you can rent such a house with a group of friends if you keep distance from people from another household. Yeah right. Next to us is such a group of 8 people aged about 20-24. Do they really think they will keep distance?
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Knaldskalle
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Post by Knaldskalle »

xianjiro wrote: August 9th, 2020, 7:25 am Got not problem with someone being personally "a mask-hating covid-denier" as long as they confine such beliefs to their own life and can separate that from how they do their job, but it's similar (in my mind) to Christian fundamentalists that are anti-gay or pro-life refusing to serve someone who is LGBTQ+ or pro-choice. However, it's super easy to understand why being against something would cause a serious crisis in trust. However, I always tend to prefer that people are up-front about this shit: nothing is worse than someone acting on their personal convictions, those actions affecting others, especially people unable to make a choice to do something different, and no one understanding the real reason why they are doing what they are doing.
See, I agree with your first point, he's free to think whatever he wants (and to express those thoughts) - but at the same time he's in charge of a whole lot of kids' safety in school. It's a bit like finding out your doctor doesn't believe in "germ theory" and thinks antibiotics don't work. S/He is of course free to believe anything, but do you really still want that person as your doctor, especially if you have an infection?
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Please don't hurt yourself, talk to someone.
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