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RogerTheMovieManiac88
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#18561

Post by RogerTheMovieManiac88 »

1. Carter
2. Trump
3. Clinton
4. Obama
5. Bush

Haha, I wasn't around for Carter. I admire him quite a bit though.
That's all, folks!
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#18562

Post by sebby »

Dolwphin wrote: January 8th, 2021, 7:07 am
sebby wrote: January 8th, 2021, 6:54 am It is 100% warranted. The greatest danger is allowing an unhinged sociopath cult leader to continue holding so much power. This is not even mentioning the fact that he has, over the last 4 years committed so many impeachable offenses that one can't even keep them straight anymore.
Krassenstein have joined the chat :facepalm:
Your trolling is a headache and inflammatory. You don't know what you're talking about here and you're embarrassing yourself. And what wonderful tact you show fanning the flames after a domestic terror attack committed by an unhinged, large-in-number cult whose leader is still wielding tremendous power. Take a fucking break, bud.
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#18563

Post by Kublai Khan »

Dolwphin wrote: January 8th, 2021, 8:30 am Now that Trump is leaving office, time to rank the living ceremonial figures (this is a list forum after all) :

1. Trump (R)
2. Carter (D)
3. Obama (D)
4. Clinton (D)
5. Bush (R)
Trump's legacy ends with him proving that he got people to love a politician more than their country. And now that they've sent him all the money, risked their livelihood, health, and freedom to protest his legally leaving office (due to receiving less votes), they win their prize: Trump came out told them that he loves them very much. A greeting card message that isn't even personalized to them.

It's so tragically pathetic.

I'll agree with your hero and thought-leader Michael Tracey. It wasn't a coup. Those people aren't smart enough to have thought about anything that happens on 1/7 or beyond. They are the epitome of the term "disposable idiot".
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#18564

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

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#18565

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

Coca Cola saying that while hiring Columbian hitmen to kill trade union leaders is hilarious.
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#18566

Post by Armoreska »

sebby wrote: January 7th, 2021, 11:55 pm If impeached he can never run for office again
Isn't it good to have Trump run again?
he or A. or Armo or any

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#18567

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#18568

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#18569

Post by kongs_speech »

Obama
Carter
Clinton
Bush
every shit I've ever taken in my life
Wonder Woman 1984
Trump
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#18570

Post by peeptoad »

Well, that pretty much clinches me not seeing the new WW flick.
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#18571

Post by Onderhond »

I never understood why some people dump so much on going to the toilet (pun intended). I find it, generally speaking, a pleasant experience. Unless it's in a public bathroom or spice food was involved of course.
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#18572

Post by OldAle1 »

Onderhond wrote: January 8th, 2021, 2:09 pm I never understood why some people dump so much on going to the toilet (pun intended). I find it, generally speaking, a pleasant experience. Unless it's in a public bathroom or spice food was involved of course.
+1 My mom spent a lot of time in the bathroom - in her last years it was more for necessary reasons, but all the way back to my childhood I remember it being a refuge for her. My dad wasn't ever physically abusive but he believed that the only purpose in life was to work, all day long every day, and he thought reading in particular was stupid and a waste of time - and that was mom's greatest love. So she read in the bathroom to escape him as much as possible. And yeah, it's usually not a bad experience (but then I'm lucky in my digestion - even with spicy food).

As to the question du jour, keeping in mind that any leader of a country like this is going to be a compromised person who does bad things, it's the nature of being at the top of the most powerful country, it's the nature of power frankly -

Carter - almost certainly the best person we've had as Pres in my lifetime from a moral/ethical standpoint; not a very effective leader but it's very hard to separate out effectiveness of one individual when you have the political set-up we have (which wasn't nearly as unworkable in his day but was still very hard to manage).

Obama - generally a relatively good guy and a better leader than Carter, though he lives in a time when politics are tougher and the compromises more difficult and probably largely unavoidable. No, universal healthcare is NOT possible in this country at this time, get that out of your heads Europeans.

Clinton - deeply compromised, and not nearly as progressive as some thought he was at the time (if only in comparison to his two predecessors)

Bush II - I've said before, he'd have made a great manager of a chain of sports bars in suburban Dallas. Probably not that terrible a person if you could separate him from the family he grew up in and the way he let his political life enshroud him, but his mistakes and bad moves overshadow any moral goodness in him ultimately, and by a big margin

Trump - likely one of the worst human beings ever democratically elected anywhere in the world, and the worst human being ever to hold a position of such power in this country. Up until last March I think he was only in the running as worst Pres ever, but since then, and especially since Nov 3, and ESPECIALLY ESPECIALLY since 2 days ago he has vaulted well past Bush II, Harding, Buchanan and Andrew Johnson.

I'm not surprised though by the two folks here who've ranked him highly - or pretend to. I'm just glad that on this forum they're in an extreme minority (I think).
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#18573

Post by 3eyes »

I pretty much agree with your assessments, OldAle.
The Carters walking to the White House after the inauguration was the most memorable thing, I guess. He got hit with the OPEC oil blockade and a few other things -- I've read that he was delighted to be defeated for a second term - couldn't wait go get out of there and get back to doing real stuff.

Meanwhile a hopeful note: https://www.axios.com/trump-advisers-25 ... 3cee4.html
:run: STILL the Gaffer!
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#18574

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

I dunno much about Carter but can all the other presidents there be tied for #5?
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#18575

Post by Dolwphin »

RogerTheMovieManiac88 wrote: January 8th, 2021, 9:08 am 1. Carter
2. Trump
3. Clinton
4. Obama
5. Bush

Haha, I wasn't around for Carter. I admire him quite a bit though.
Me too. I don't think anybody is going to surpass him as a moral individual in his post-presidency. It is a pretty remarkable contrast with all other Presidents. Maybe should have put Carter above Trump on my list. I just tried to think of the worst atrocity committed during his Administration and could not recall anything that significant during Trump. But History might change that since the worst atrocities is usually revealed much later.
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#18576

Post by Dolwphin »

sebby wrote: January 8th, 2021, 9:21 am
Dolwphin wrote: January 8th, 2021, 7:07 am
sebby wrote: January 8th, 2021, 6:54 am It is 100% warranted. The greatest danger is allowing an unhinged sociopath cult leader to continue holding so much power. This is not even mentioning the fact that he has, over the last 4 years committed so many impeachable offenses that one can't even keep them straight anymore.
Krassenstein have joined the chat :facepalm:
Your trolling is a headache and inflammatory. You don't know what you're talking about here and you're embarrassing yourself. And what wonderful tact you show fanning the flames after a domestic terror attack committed by an unhinged, large-in-number cult whose leader is still wielding tremendous power. Take a fucking break, bud.
Yes I am the one who is inflammatory. :thumbsup:
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#18577

Post by prodigalgodson »

Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 8th, 2021, 12:47 pm
Hey don't do Dale like that.

Also the Trump love from dolwphin and roger is nuts...the damage he's done to this country is inestimable. The family separation policy alone, truly monstrous.
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#18578

Post by Onderhond »

Dolwphin wrote: January 8th, 2021, 6:57 pm I just tried to think of the worst atrocity committed during his Administration and could not recall anything that significant during Trump.
That sounds like you didn't try very hard.
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#18579

Post by RogerTheMovieManiac88 »

I end up disliking most American Presidents, unfortunately. I just happen to admire some of Trump's positions.

Just a bit of fun, ranking the five of them. I have reservations about all five administrations, even Carter's. It's an imperfect world and I'm a multi-issue political animal, so I tend to like some stances and dislike others. If that makes me nuts, so be it!
That's all, folks!
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#18580

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

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#18581

Post by xianjiro »

Onderhond wrote: January 8th, 2021, 8:57 am
Myeah, in theory I agree. On the other hand, these companies spend billions on psychology to trick people into this (often bad) behavior. I'm all for taking personal responsibility, but it's not fair to expect an unsuspecting society to win against a company like Facebook that spends billions to mislead them (and is plainly allowed to do so).
You hit on an area that is indeed crying out for regulation, so no disagreement there. Once it became clear that FB was experimenting on users without their knowledge, BIG GOVERNMENT should have started paying very close attention.

But isn't it kind of funny: people don't want the vaccine because they don't trust how it was developed/government etc but even as it's been widely publicized how FB and others do things people just shrug and go meh. What does this say about priorities? Okay, one is a slightly invasive medical procedure, but the other one is harvesting data on pretty much everything you do, where you go, and even who you have contact with and what you read, not only now, but indefinitely into the future. Talk about Big Brother. I just don't understand why people are so much more comfortable with a corporate big brother.

We saw the EU's good faith attempt to move control over cookies from sites to users and plenty of sites offer the option to disable all but technically necessary without too much hassle. Still, how many sites default to "use of this site constitutes acceptance of our cookie policy". I mention this because I wonder how to truly effectively regulate these institutions. It would be even worse it the public thought big tech was being policed and could be trusted because some do-nothing law got passed.

The other thing, after I last responded, I was wondering if you'd want regulation of all forms of "social media" or only the biggest players?
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#18582

Post by xianjiro »

Armoreska wrote: January 8th, 2021, 12:31 pm
sebby wrote: January 7th, 2021, 11:55 pm If impeached he can never run for office again
Isn't it good to have Trump run again?
sure, if you mean run from the law :lol:
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#18583

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

xianjiro wrote: January 8th, 2021, 9:30 pm
Armoreska wrote: January 8th, 2021, 12:31 pm
sebby wrote: January 7th, 2021, 11:55 pm If impeached he can never run for office again
Isn't it good to have Trump run again?
sure, if you mean run from the law :lol:
I can kind of see why, if he runs third party. It'll split the right wing vote.
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#18584

Post by xianjiro »

So, who supports 25th Amendment removal, impeachment/trial, resignation, censure, or just ignoring the bastard for the remaining time?

While I support removal or impeachment, I don't believe either will actually have their intended result: Pence doesn't seem cooperative publicly and I doubt the Senate would try him before the 20th. Plus it will inflame the Cult. Censure and (Nixonian) resignation wouldn't be so terrible, but I don't think it would keep him from trying to run again. This is really a hard one. He's crying out to be punished but I just don't see how we get there.
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#18585

Post by OldAle1 »

xianjiro wrote: January 8th, 2021, 9:43 pm So, who supports 25th Amendment removal, impeachment/trial, resignation, censure, or just ignoring the bastard for the remaining time?

While I support removal or impeachment, I don't believe either will actually have their intended result: Pence doesn't seem cooperative publicly and I doubt the Senate would try him before the 20th. Plus it will inflame the Cult. Censure and (Nixonian) resignation wouldn't be so terrible, but I don't think it would keep him from trying to run again. This is really a hard one. He's crying out to be punished but I just don't see how we get there.
It's apparent already that some of the comradeship that seemed to have developed for a second two days ago has disappeared - I don't see any chance that he would be convicted in the Senate, and if Pence isn't going to push for the 25th Amendment fix, that won't happen either. The only way DJT will resign is if he can be assured of a pardon from Pence, which I'd say is 50-50 - I think he's finally alienated his top yes-man enough that Pence isn't going to want to help him, even if he won't vote to remove him. Any way you slice it I don't see this getting any better any time soon though, and I don't see him going away easily. Even if he's prosecuted by states he will have enough dough and even cult followers to keep him out of jail in all likelihood, and still living in his mansions and tweeting out violent rhetoric. There isn't enough will to go to the massive lengths it will take to stop him among the 55% who don't think he's a pure ball of malicious ego.
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#18586

Post by OldAle1 »

RogerTheMovieManiac88 wrote: January 8th, 2021, 7:48 pm I end up disliking most American Presidents, unfortunately. I just happen to admire some of Trump's positions.
...

It's an imperfect world and I'm a multi-issue political animal, so I tend to like some stances and dislike others. If that makes me nuts, so be it!
RogerTheMovieManiac13, interviewed on the street in 1945 about a recently fallen major world leader "Well I liked some things about him and didn't like others. I mean sure there were the millions murdered, but the autobahn was a lovely idea."
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#18587

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

It's funny how they tout a good welfare state for the third reich as well. Also the argument that the nazis were socialist because it says so in the name. When people think socialism they think "big government". The term privatization was literally named after the economic method the nazis used.
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#18588

Post by Dolwphin »

This "coup attempt" at the Capitol was clearly staged and allowed to happen on purpose. The videos are stunning, police escorting "rioters" and even opening doors for them to get into the building.
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#18589

Post by Onderhond »

xianjiro wrote: January 8th, 2021, 9:27 pm The other thing, after I last responded, I was wondering if you'd want regulation of all forms of "social media" or only the biggest players?
I think size matters there (which has been a returning train of thought for regulation these past couple of years). Our forum, or some small social network, probably doesn't need regulation. A platform of millions probably needs some. Same idea as with monopolies. Once you reach a certain size, other rules apply.

As for the EU cookie story, it's clear that you can't leave things too much to the companies, because they won't think twice about using dark patterns to fool you into clicking whatever. Which is actually more problematic, since you've now given active consent to companies (ab)using your data. I think the best way there is transparency (show the public the size/impact of the data they share) rather than abstractions and checkboxes and big buttons labelled "GO ON" next to very small links saying "set up cookie preference".

It made me think of this tweet, which I think was quite interesting:


Also, I would take it further than just social media. The entire ad/marketing industry is crooked as fuck. If you ever wondered where fake news and public lying got so popularized, look no further :)
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#18590

Post by Onderhond »

Dolwphin wrote: January 8th, 2021, 9:59 pm This "coup attempt" at the Capitol was clearly staged and allowed to happen on purpose. The videos are stunning, police escorting "rioters" and even opening doors for them to get into the building.
They did a terrible job staging it as two protagonists died. Not mentioning the three extras that suffered accidental deaths.
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#18591

Post by prodigalgodson »

RogerTheMovieManiac88 wrote: January 8th, 2021, 7:48 pm I end up disliking most American Presidents, unfortunately. I just happen to admire some of Trump's positions.

Just a bit of fun, ranking the five of them. I have reservations about all five administrations, even Carter's. It's an imperfect world and I'm a multi-issue political animal, so I tend to like some stances and dislike others. If that makes me nuts, so be it!
That is one twisted sense of fun. My best friend lost his US residency status because of Trump's policies. My girlfriend's been shouted at to "get the fuck out of my country" by a xenophobic bigot the likes of which make up his constituency. And that's just something that effects me personally, how about the $365+ million Americans dead because of the utter disregard and lack of preparedness with which this administration addressed the coronavirus?

It does make you nuts to treat a subject where human lives hang in the balance so flippantly. Shame on you. Enjoy those tax breaks though.
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#18592

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

Going to start going through Trump University to learn his lessons, and see how it applies to his video game to see if it indeed teaches you something. Might make an entertaining video?
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#18593

Post by OldAle1 »

prodigalgodson wrote: January 8th, 2021, 10:12 pm
RogerTheMovieManiac88 wrote: January 8th, 2021, 7:48 pm I end up disliking most American Presidents, unfortunately. I just happen to admire some of Trump's positions.

Just a bit of fun, ranking the five of them. I have reservations about all five administrations, even Carter's. It's an imperfect world and I'm a multi-issue political animal, so I tend to like some stances and dislike others. If that makes me nuts, so be it!
That is one twisted sense of fun. My best friend lost his US residency status because of Trump's policies. My girlfriend's been shouted at to "get the fuck out of my country" by a xenophobic bigot the likes of which make up his constituency. And that's just something that effects me personally, how about the $365+ million Americans dead because of the utter disregard and lack of preparedness with which this administration addressed the coronavirus?

It does make you nuts to treat a subject where human lives hang in the balance so flippantly. Shame on you. Enjoy those tax breaks though.
Roger's not American so the tax cuts don't matter. I get the sense that he's a free speech absolutist and that's probably his main thing - and of course something he shares with Trump. Just remembering some shit from IMDb days though and I remember why I didn't engage with him for a long time. Probably should go back to that.
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#18594

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#18595

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#18596

Post by Knaldskalle »

Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 8th, 2021, 11:30 pm Trust me, click on this

https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump?lang=en
:party:
ImageImageImageImage

Please don't hurt yourself, talk to someone.
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#18597

Post by Knaldskalle »

Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 8th, 2021, 10:51 pm Image
Three words to counter your lovely little exercise: Civil Asset Forfeiture.
ImageImageImageImage

Please don't hurt yourself, talk to someone.
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#18598

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

Knaldskalle wrote: January 8th, 2021, 11:35 pm
Pretentious Hipster wrote: January 8th, 2021, 10:51 pm Image
Three words to counter your lovely little exercise: Civil Asset Forfeiture.
Going through more of the school now and it's legit scary. They're talking shit about social security now.
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#18599

Post by OldAle1 »

I just saw that. If the Republicans in power won't do anything, maybe it's big business - which may not be democracy-friendly, but which likes orderly transitions and dislikes violent extremism as much as anybody - that will ultimately put this guy where he belongs, out of public sight.

You gotta imagine this is sending him into frenzies now though. As is more information coming to light that much of what happened was in fact well-planned in advance, and that he may have been actually helping to plot assassinations.

But he did some good things, right Roger?
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#18600

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

OldAle1 wrote: January 8th, 2021, 11:37 pm I just saw that. If the Republicans in power won't do anything, maybe it's big business - which may not be democracy-friendly, but which likes orderly transitions and dislikes violent extremism as much as anybody - that will ultimately put this guy where he belongs, out of public sight.

You gotta imagine this is sending him into frenzies now though. As is more information coming to light that much of what happened was in fact well-planned in advance, and that he may have been actually helping to plot assassinations.

But he did some good things, right Roger?
He did some good things if you're an exploitative capitalist.
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