Welcome to the ICM Forum. If you have an account but have trouble logging in, or have other questions, see THIS THREAD.
Polls: Favorite Movies (Results), 1945 (Results), 1929 awards (Apr 4th), South Asia (Apr 25th), Doubling the Canon (Ratings Apr 30th)
Challenges: Doubling the Canon, Nordic, 1950s
Film of the Week: The Music of Chance, May nominations (May 1st)
World Cup S4: Round 1 schedule, 1F: Brazil vs Greece vs Japan vs Poland (Apr 5th), 1G: Germany vs Pakistan vs Ukraine vs USA (Apr 22nd)

US Politics thread

Post Reply
Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

Re: US Politics thread

#17161

Post by Cippenham » March 21st, 2020, 1:15 pm

You all now know Trump was right to control borders with this virus thing demonstrating the dangers. Who supports globalism now?

User avatar
Onderhond
Posts: 3518
Joined: Dec 23, 2012
Contact:

#17162

Post by Onderhond » March 21st, 2020, 1:39 pm

Cippenham wrote:
March 21st, 2020, 1:15 pm
You all now know Trump was right to control borders with this virus thing demonstrating the dangers. Who supports globalism now?
Such a childish way of reasoning. I bet you don't eat with a knife because people have been stabbed to death, nor have driven a car because they cause fatal accidents.

Maybe you should stay locked inside forever, far away from all the dangers of the outside world.

User avatar
OldAle1
Donator
Posts: 4081
Joined: Feb 09, 2017
Location: Dairyland, USA
Contact:

#17163

Post by OldAle1 » March 21st, 2020, 2:18 pm

Onderhond wrote:
March 21st, 2020, 1:39 pm
Cippenham wrote:
March 21st, 2020, 1:15 pm
You all now know Trump was right to control borders with this virus thing demonstrating the dangers. Who supports globalism now?
Such a childish way of reasoning. I bet you don't eat with a knife because people have been stabbed to death, nor have driven a car because they cause fatal accidents.

Maybe you should stay locked inside forever, far away from all the dangers of the outside world.
It's also totally at odds with his expressed support for the imperialist/colonialist agenda of his country's history. I guess globalism was OK when it meant white men from rich countries going out and "colonizing" (enslaving, exterminating, dehumanizing, raping, pillaging) the rest of the world, but it's not so good when those former conquests now want to interact with modern-day Britain or other countries.

User avatar
Kublai Khan
Posts: 1007
Joined: Nov 09, 2014
Location: Sarasota, FL
Contact:

#17164

Post by Kublai Khan » March 21st, 2020, 3:19 pm

Cippenham wrote:
March 21st, 2020, 1:15 pm
You all now know Trump was right to control borders with this virus thing demonstrating the dangers. Who supports globalism now?
I don't understand. Do you think that a southern border wall with Mexico would have prevented the spread of CoVID-19? Or blocking air travel to muslim countries?

Do you think that the virus is only carried by illegal border crossers or terrorists? None of Trump's border control ideas would have done anything. This was spread by tourist and business travel which, if Trump had blocked would have killed the American economy. How can you type "You all now know Trump was right to control borders"? It such a dumb statement.

But if he had taken the threat more seriously from the beginning and not publicly referred to it as a "Democratic virus hoax", and hadn't dissolved important pandemic teams in his quest to shrink government, then this threat wouldn't be as bad.

Trump is a terrible President. He was a terrible President before, and now he's becoming a legendarily bad President.

Nobody is even really thinking about the election right now, we're just hunkered down, watching the climbing numbers and thinking "Oh god, I hope Trump's incompetence doesn't literally kill us".

User avatar
OldAle1
Donator
Posts: 4081
Joined: Feb 09, 2017
Location: Dairyland, USA
Contact:

#17165

Post by OldAle1 » March 21st, 2020, 4:52 pm

Such a great leader!

https://www.yahoo.com/news/government-o ... 40944.html

Best part is this quote:

Health and Human Services Secretary Alex Azar reportedly couldn't get Trump to speak with him about the virus until mid-January, two weeks after officials were alerted about its spread in China. Even then, Trump was reportedly more interested in when flavored vaping products were going to return to the market.

Any previous president - even lowbrows like Reagan and GW Bush - you'd have to assume this was a parody.

User avatar
Cocoa
Donator
Posts: 1713
Joined: Jul 17, 2013
Location: Chicago, USA
Contact:

#17166

Post by Cocoa » March 21st, 2020, 8:40 pm

Ohio's Attorney General is using the COVID-19 as an excuse to close abortion clinics.

https://www.dispatch.com/news/20200321/ ... -abortions

Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

#17167

Post by Cippenham » March 21st, 2020, 9:32 pm

Trump is right in thinking the more you control borders, you stop people coming and spreading the virus. The EU has done the same. He is a great President, if his approach is correct he can be considered one of the best. He is now taking it seriously alright and has taken stringent measures . 55 percent approval for his handling 43 against.

https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/coronav ... d=69696172

User avatar
Kublai Khan
Posts: 1007
Joined: Nov 09, 2014
Location: Sarasota, FL
Contact:

#17168

Post by Kublai Khan » March 22nd, 2020, 6:48 am

Sample size: 512. Error margin +-5%. So roughly 275 people approve of how Trump is handling things. Overwhelming.

And I need a laugh. Explain how Trump's southern border wall would have prevent the coronavirus coming from China.

The correct approach to dealing with infectious diseases would be how Obama dealt with Ebola and H1N1. Trump did the opposite of correct. He ignored it and told his audience that it was a hoax. This is why Trump is considered the worst.

Also, Trump is actively considering bailing out his own hotels. With taxpayer money. Because he's corrupt. https://www.the-sun.com/news/572160/tru ... go-closed/

User avatar
sebby
Posts: 6234
Joined: Jul 04, 2011
Contact:

#17169

Post by sebby » March 22nd, 2020, 8:38 am

Trump is going to jail if he loses the election, so I assume the GOP will operate with an even greater zeal to thieve a victory for him in November. This really is turning into one of the worst years ever.

User avatar
brokenface
Donator
Posts: 13308
Joined: Dec 29, 2011
Contact:

#17170

Post by brokenface » March 22nd, 2020, 9:25 am

He is actively dangerous in this situation. Yesterday he was touting one particular treatment combo as the solution. It's based on one small and limited study (20 patients). To go from that one small study to the loudest voice on the planet shouting 'this might be the cure' and demanding it be fast tracked is way beyond irresponsible. What if better treatments now get passed over because he fixates on this? What if it turns out this has little or no effect in larger studies? Or even makes things worse?

It's possible it could be a promising route (sidenote: people shouldn't kneejerk dismiss things, like i saw some saying 'dur it's an antibiotic, this is a virus', which is too simplistic, sometimes drugs can be effective in different indications, or be effective on symptoms rather than the cause), but you know the only reason he's shouting about it is that he's scrabbling around for ways to make it look like he's got it under control, to make himself look good.

And it's also his old long game, if he keeps confidently making wild predictions, in a few weeks/months when he's rewriting history, he can select the lucky ones and proclaim himself a genius (the Cippenham technique, with enough different predictions, you're bound to get one right that you can brag about).

Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

#17171

Post by Cippenham » March 22nd, 2020, 9:57 am

Kublai Khan wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 6:48 am
Sample size: 512. Error margin +-5%. So roughly 275 people approve of how Trump is handling things. Overwhelming.

And I need a laugh. Explain how Trump's southern border wall would have prevent the coronavirus coming from China.

The correct approach to dealing with infectious diseases would be how Obama dealt with Ebola and H1N1. Trump did the opposite of correct. He ignored it and told his audience that it was a hoax. This is why Trump is considered the worst.

Also, Trump is actively considering bailing out his own hotels. With taxpayer money. Because he's corrupt. https://www.the-sun.com/news/572160/tru ... go-closed/
There are two other similar polls. There is a chance the election could be delayed so in January you would have acting President Pelosi until elections can be held.

Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

#17172

Post by Cippenham » March 22nd, 2020, 10:13 am

It’s not about a particular border, it’s the principle of control of borders that matters

User avatar
Onderhond
Posts: 3518
Joined: Dec 23, 2012
Contact:

#17173

Post by Onderhond » March 22nd, 2020, 10:18 am

So clearly that principle doesn't work unless you control every border for every nationality. Bad Trump.

User avatar
St. Gloede
Moderator
Posts: 10477
Joined: May 06, 2011
Contact:

#17174

Post by St. Gloede » March 22nd, 2020, 12:27 pm


Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

#17175

Post by Cippenham » March 22nd, 2020, 12:37 pm

Well they closed borders to people from Europe yes

Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

#17176

Post by Cippenham » March 22nd, 2020, 12:37 pm

Bernie doing a good job does not alter the fact he is finished in the race.

User avatar
Onderhond
Posts: 3518
Joined: Dec 23, 2012
Contact:

#17177

Post by Onderhond » March 22nd, 2020, 12:50 pm

Cippenham wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 12:37 pm
Well they closed borders to people from Europe yes
Yea, once the virus was inside. Too late in other words. Bad Trump.

User avatar
OldAle1
Donator
Posts: 4081
Joined: Feb 09, 2017
Location: Dairyland, USA
Contact:

#17178

Post by OldAle1 » March 22nd, 2020, 1:39 pm

Here's a piece of an interview with Rosenbaum done in early February - so before this whole crisis became big news - that I think gets at a lot of the problem in this country's politics, and it's worldview and culture overall. The whole interview which is mostly about movies and criticism is HERE but the most pertinent point to this thread is:

You know, nostalgia tends to be a right-wing emotion. I say that even when I’m being nostalgic myself. The whole idea of “Make America great again” is based on that idea. The reason why Joe Biden polls more highly than all the other opponents of Trump is because that’s looking backwards with nostalgia at Obama. It’s not even desirable to look forward so much, which I find depressing. I can understand in large parts of the world people being afraid right now because of economic things but so many Americans that I know don’t have reasons to be all that afraid. Obviously, there are plenty of people who are legitimately hurting economically now, but there are also those who are not, and I can’t think of any excuse for supporting the right-wing now except for rich people wanting to become richer. Anyway, it’s a very upsetting time because it seems to me that even the left is part of the disease. For example, Rachel Maddow, someone I’ve admired in the past, reminds me of the Ed Sullivan Show when she says, “We have a big show tonight!”. Of course, it would be inconceivable for her to say she had a small show. So she says “we have a big show” every single night. She is so happy that Trump has come up with a new outrage so that she can have fun talking about it on her show. It’s true that Trump might be terrible for the world, and not just the United States, but he is supposedly “good for television” or at least good for the advertisers on television. I don’t even know what that means, “good for television.”

Anyway, capitalism is not a victimless crime, and we are its victims.

User avatar
Pretentious Hipster
Donator
Posts: 19907
Joined: Oct 24, 2011
Contact:

#17179

Post by Pretentious Hipster » March 22nd, 2020, 1:42 pm

Where did Biden run off to? Is he dead and they are just trying to cover it up? Or is he having a crisis when he realized this pandemic makes all his policies garbage.

Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

#17180

Post by Cippenham » March 22nd, 2020, 1:47 pm

Well what happens if a lot of these old politicians succumb to the virus, include Trump, Biden, Bernie , Hillary, who on earth would be President, maybe Mike Pence is tough enough to survive who knows

User avatar
St. Gloede
Moderator
Posts: 10477
Joined: May 06, 2011
Contact:

#17181

Post by St. Gloede » March 22nd, 2020, 2:31 pm

I don't think Sanders can make a comeback, the corona effect of people realizing the need for healthcare and a social safety net should have kicked in already, but Obama was behind Clinton with more delegates at this point in the race. The power of the media to show things as over is pretty incredible, but as always, the media will do everything they can to protect profits/murder people.

User avatar
Kublai Khan
Posts: 1007
Joined: Nov 09, 2014
Location: Sarasota, FL
Contact:

#17182

Post by Kublai Khan » March 22nd, 2020, 2:38 pm

Cippenham wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 10:13 am
It’s not about a particular border, it’s the principle of control of borders that matters
Do you think viruses are stopped by border checks?

Or do you think that all border crossings should be stopped, in which case do you understand why the stock market is currently crashing?


User avatar
Armoreska
Posts: 11573
Joined: Nov 01, 2012
Location: Ukraine
Contact:

#17184

Post by Armoreska » March 22nd, 2020, 3:03 pm

Pretentious Hipster wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 1:42 pm
Where did Biden run off to? Is he dead and they are just trying to cover it up? Or is he having a crisis when he realized this pandemic makes all his policies garbage.
What do you mean? He was just vlogging on his popular youtube channel a few days ago.
Image
currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Luis Bunuel, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

User avatar
Pretentious Hipster
Donator
Posts: 19907
Joined: Oct 24, 2011
Contact:

#17185

Post by Pretentious Hipster » March 22nd, 2020, 3:16 pm

Armoreska wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 3:03 pm
Pretentious Hipster wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 1:42 pm
Where did Biden run off to? Is he dead and they are just trying to cover it up? Or is he having a crisis when he realized this pandemic makes all his policies garbage.
What do you mean? He was just vlogging on his popular youtube channel a few days ago.
:O did he finally find out how the internet works?

Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

#17186

Post by Cippenham » March 22nd, 2020, 3:21 pm

Kublai Khan wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 2:38 pm
Cippenham wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 10:13 am
It’s not about a particular border, it’s the principle of control of borders that matters
Do you think viruses are stopped by border checks?

Or do you think that all border crossings should be stopped, in which case do you understand why the stock market is currently crashing?
No they are not but stopping border crossings help in the short term , in EU also doing that.

User avatar
Armoreska
Posts: 11573
Joined: Nov 01, 2012
Location: Ukraine
Contact:

#17187

Post by Armoreska » March 22nd, 2020, 3:39 pm

Pretentious Hipster wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 3:16 pm
Armoreska wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 3:03 pm
Pretentious Hipster wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 1:42 pm
Where did Biden run off to? Is he dead and they are just trying to cover it up? Or is he having a crisis when he realized this pandemic makes all his policies garbage.
What do you mean? He was just vlogging on his popular youtube channel a few days ago.
:O did he finally find out how the internet works?
Of course not. They have "special technical people" for that :lol:
Image
currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Luis Bunuel, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

User avatar
Cocoa
Donator
Posts: 1713
Joined: Jul 17, 2013
Location: Chicago, USA
Contact:

#17188

Post by Cocoa » March 22nd, 2020, 4:07 pm

The 'Biden is dead' thing that Bernie Bros are pushing is such a stupid thing. Biden can't have open rallies because of the COVID-19, and has already done an online townhall on March 13. Biden did a press call with former Surgeon General Vivek Murthy, senior policy advisor Jake Sullivan, and former FDA Commissioner David Kessler on March 20th. He's talking with people with experience behind the scenes. He already released a COVID-19 plan in January and he's not a health professional and there aren't any new debates, so there is no reason why he'd be on tv. His campaign have been releasing some good ads against Trump lately.




User avatar
Cocoa
Donator
Posts: 1713
Joined: Jul 17, 2013
Location: Chicago, USA
Contact:

#17189

Post by Cocoa » March 22nd, 2020, 4:11 pm

He also joined an IG thing yesterday that basically a bunch of government officials and celebrities were joining :lol: The Saturday ClubQuarantine by DJ D-Nice. :lol:

User avatar
St. Gloede
Moderator
Posts: 10477
Joined: May 06, 2011
Contact:

#17190

Post by St. Gloede » March 22nd, 2020, 4:15 pm

Have to agree, Biden is a right-wing extremist, and he disgusts me to my core, but I really don't see what this meme is good for. Trying to scare some voters away? Dishonesty like this is just bad optics. Attack him on a fact that he wishes to gleefully continue to murder US citizens not this nonsense.

(Same goes for the Trump will try to become a dictator rumours, etc.)

User avatar
Cocoa
Donator
Posts: 1713
Joined: Jul 17, 2013
Location: Chicago, USA
Contact:

#17191

Post by Cocoa » March 22nd, 2020, 5:47 pm



Republican Senator Rand Paul has tested positive for COVID-19. A few House of Representatives members have tested positive earlier this week as well as a VP Pence's staff member.

Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

#17192

Post by Cippenham » March 22nd, 2020, 6:38 pm

Biden is a Democrat and on the left and i do not consider he is right wing

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/nymag.co ... taxes.html

User avatar
Cocoa
Donator
Posts: 1713
Joined: Jul 17, 2013
Location: Chicago, USA
Contact:

#17193

Post by Cocoa » March 22nd, 2020, 8:04 pm

Rarely do I agree with Cippenham, but Joe Biden is left-wing. There are a few issues I wish he would be more to the left on such as the legalization of marijuana (he is states rights on the issue). If the Democrats keep the House, flip the Senate, and Joe is president, then it will probably be the most progressive time in America history with the only things in the way are the court systems and Republican governors.

User avatar
St. Gloede
Moderator
Posts: 10477
Joined: May 06, 2011
Contact:

#17194

Post by St. Gloede » March 22nd, 2020, 8:07 pm

Cippenham wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 6:38 pm
Biden is a Democrat and on the left and i do not consider he is right wing

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/nymag.co ... taxes.html
Democrats are further right than all major political parties in the world. Biden is right of Thatcher and every Tory, as was Obama, as was Clinton.

These people are so far to the extreme right they actively work against people having universal healthcare, they are even well to the right of you.

AND YOU KNOW THIS

Also: YOU have previously stated you would be a Democrat in the US.

User avatar
St. Gloede
Moderator
Posts: 10477
Joined: May 06, 2011
Contact:

#17195

Post by St. Gloede » March 22nd, 2020, 8:12 pm

Cocoa wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 8:04 pm
Rarely do I agree with Cippenham, but Joe Biden is left-wing. There are a few issues I wish he would be more to the left on such as the legalization of marijuana (he is states rights on the issue). If the Democrats keep the House, flip the Senate, and Joe is president, then it will probably be the most progressive time in America history with the only things in the way are the court systems and Republican governors.
Biden opposes universal healthcare ...

He is a right wing extremist.

I do understand he is "left" in the US in terms of elected officials, but that's because both parties in the US are right of all major political parties in the world.

Cippenham
Donator
Posts: 13087
Joined: May 09, 2011
Location: Dorset England
Contact:

#17196

Post by Cippenham » March 22nd, 2020, 9:24 pm

For a communist everyone else is a right wing extremist

User avatar
GruesomeTwosome
Donator
Posts: 2974
Joined: Feb 03, 2017
Location: Industrial Wasteland, USA
Contact:

#17197

Post by GruesomeTwosome » March 22nd, 2020, 10:13 pm

Trump press conference is on right now; he’s still saying “Chinese virus” instead of COVID-19. There have already been reported incidents of harassment of Chinese-Americans related to COVID and his rhetoric just keeps fueling the potential for more. What a shithead.
I’m to remember every man I've seen fall into a plate of spaghetti???

My IMDB profile
ICM
Letterboxd

User avatar
Cocoa
Donator
Posts: 1713
Joined: Jul 17, 2013
Location: Chicago, USA
Contact:

#17198

Post by Cocoa » March 22nd, 2020, 10:45 pm

Biden doesn't oppose universal healthcare. He wants a public option.

Also, trying to say he's to the right of other countries is a failure to acknowledge civil rights, the racism and homophobia (and also sexism, the right to abortions for example) of other parties and their political leaders in other countries.

User avatar
St. Gloede
Moderator
Posts: 10477
Joined: May 06, 2011
Contact:

#17199

Post by St. Gloede » March 22nd, 2020, 11:01 pm

Cocoa wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 10:45 pm
Biden doesn't oppose universal healthcare. He wants a public option.

Also, trying to say he's to the right of other countries is a failure to acknowledge civil rights, the racism and homophobia (and also sexism, the right to abortions for example) of other parties and their political leaders in other countries.

A public option is not universal healthcare .......................................

And I have no idea what your second sentence has to do with the fact that Biden is a Liberal.

Left and right is about economic policy, you can be a anti-LGBT, racist bigot and still be left-wing. Biden is a Liberal, and one on the extreme right of the political spectrum.

User avatar
St. Gloede
Moderator
Posts: 10477
Joined: May 06, 2011
Contact:

#17200

Post by St. Gloede » March 22nd, 2020, 11:03 pm

Cippenham wrote:
March 22nd, 2020, 9:24 pm
For a communist everyone else is a right wing extremist
If Biden is left wing, you are calling yourself a communist.

Post Reply