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The Political Lounge

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shugs
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Re: The Political Lounge

#6761

Post by shugs » April 16th, 2020, 10:10 am

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Seems about right.

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#6762

Post by Pretentious Hipster » April 26th, 2020, 12:42 pm

North Korea has a new leader

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#6763

Post by Dolwphin » April 26th, 2020, 1:58 pm

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#6765

Post by mightysparks » April 30th, 2020, 12:45 am

Armoreska wrote:
April 15th, 2020, 1:27 pm
Anyone take this test?
8values.github.io
i got 70% equality, 80% world, 72% liberal, 88% progress and it says im a libertarian socialist
I love tests and pretty results, but I didn't even understand the first question :lol:
"I do not always know what I want, but I do know what I don't want." - Stanley Kubrick

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#6766

Post by GruesomeTwosome » April 30th, 2020, 2:02 am

Armoreska wrote:
April 15th, 2020, 1:27 pm
Anyone take this test?
8values.github.io
i got 70% equality, 80% world, 72% liberal, 88% progress and it says im a libertarian socialist
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I’m to remember every man I've seen fall into a plate of spaghetti???

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#6768

Post by Pretentious Hipster » April 30th, 2020, 1:32 pm

It keeps going


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#6769

Post by matthewscott8 » April 30th, 2020, 2:56 pm

Pretentious Hipster wrote:
April 30th, 2020, 1:29 pm
is this some magic of tech, e.g. deepfake

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#6770

Post by Pretentious Hipster » May 3rd, 2020, 1:29 pm

Yea it's a deep fake.

I might be reading too much. At work we were discussing Canada's assault weapons ban. Someone asked why would someone need a 50 caliber assault rifle anyways and I said as a joke "to seize the means of production"



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#6773

Post by weirdboy » May 31st, 2020, 11:20 pm

Pretentious Hipster wrote:
May 31st, 2020, 2:24 am
It was reported literally a week ago. How is that breaking news?

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#6774

Post by Armoreska » June 3rd, 2020, 8:41 pm

Armoreska wrote:
April 15th, 2020, 1:27 pm
Anyone take this test?
8values.github.io
i got 70% equality, 80% world, 72% liberal, 88% progress and it says im a libertarian socialist
I'm not retaking it but would probably get close to 100% on equality now. Although I'm not sure if I should vote for what's better with the current system or with a good one.

Anyhow I took leftvalues too.
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rev 60.3 sci 64.7 dec 73.3 intl 82.1 union 63.5 eco 80.6 prog 89.7
--
Last edited by Armoreska on July 10th, 2020, 2:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): ANARCHISTS, 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

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#6775

Post by Pretentious Hipster » June 3rd, 2020, 9:37 pm

I got centrist Marxism when I took that

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#6776

Post by St. Gloede » June 4th, 2020, 8:13 pm

The Left Values test seems highly biased/flawed to me. It felt like it was written by from a specifically Marxist (possibly Leninist) viewpoints, including an over-reliance on idealism vs. scientific socialism - which is an extremely flawed and inaccurate representation of the socialist philosophers branded as such, especially with the added slur "Utopian".

(This kind of baseline misinformation usually comes from people reading Engels' "Socialism: Utopian and Scientific", which was a part of a hit-piece called "Anti-Dühring" where the goal was to use any means to destroy Dühring and get all German Socialists to rally behind the Social Democrats - essentially the movement was splitting and he deployed lies, misrepresentation and historical revisionism to show Marxism/SPD as the only path - you can argue it was a noble goal perhaps, but the result is a lot of extremely disinformed Socialists: The worst being the claim that Marx discovered both "Scientific Socialism" and "Surplus Labor Value", the former being coined by Proudhon, but you can even read Hodgskin, who was arguably the first Socialist economist (at least the first to publish a major economic work), for thorough materialist analysis based on scientific and historical data, the latter being a principle dating back to "Classical Economics", and thoroughly developed and explored by Socialists, including the previously mentioned Hodgskin and Proudhon, before Marx).

Another extreme oversight, and I realize that they like counter-points, but they essentially erased the co-operative/market socialist strategy (which is the strategy with the most vocal focus right now, was almost entirely erased), hell they didn't even have "market" as one of the 14 measuring points. In fact there is not a single question about co-ops and not a single question about markets.

In fact there is only one question related to ownership, which asks if businesses like factories should be socially owned ...

In other words it does not even see if you support worker ownership, or if you want a mixed model. Anarcho-Communists should also be upset, communes are not mentioned once, and in terms of economic management we see a few questions on centralism, and then an extremely broad one related to trade unions and worker councils (which literally encompasses everything from syndicates, to guilds to soviets). There was not even a question related to the Syndicalist general strike .... Yet "union" is one of the key measuring points.

More stunning, there were no questions related to why/how capitalism is problematic (or is worse than X alternative), which is one of the easiest ways of distinguishing the base frameworks

There are also some weird obfuscations such as "A highly centralized planned economy is not socialism but rather state capitalism." This is not what is called State Capitalism, the term is generally used to describe State Managed Capitalism or the State owning the means of production as opposed to the people (i.e. the state is not democratic). There is obviously a theoretical difference between State Capitalism and State Socialism, and it seems they don't even know/understand what the critiques of "Leninist" are.

Essentially, this poll reads like someone entirely ignorant of general Leftist theory and history, and it shows in the results as well.

Anyways, I got "Centrist Marxism", which I find pretty darn funny, but then again, these were the only other choices ...

Council Communism
Orthodox Marxism
Anarcho-Communism
Left-Wing Nationalism
Democratic Socialism
Market Anarchism
Eco-Marxism
Eco-Anarchism
Left Communism
Social Democracy
Utopian Socialism
Marxism-Leninism

So yeah ... not impressed.

Anyways, results:

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#6777

Post by Dolwphin » June 4th, 2020, 10:45 pm

I am a Eco-Anarchy Intergalactic Marxist myself, but all other people on Earth are reactionary bourgeoisie useful idiots. SAD!
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#6778

Post by St. Gloede » June 4th, 2020, 10:51 pm

Dolwphin wrote:
June 4th, 2020, 10:45 pm
I am a Eco-Anarchy Intergalactic Marxist myself, but all other people on Earth are reactionary bourgeoisie useful idiots. SAD!
:lol: :lol: :lol:

Are you saying the dialectic of ecological disaster was resolved by allowing the earthlings to destroy their planet while you live our your life harvesting blue tomatoes in your utopian space collective?

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#6779

Post by Armoreska » June 5th, 2020, 12:14 am

Yes those are by no means perfect. Even I noticed some of those omissions.
There's an address for feedback.
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currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): ANARCHISTS, 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

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#6780

Post by mightysparks » June 5th, 2020, 1:54 am

GruesomeTwosome wrote:
April 30th, 2020, 2:02 am
Armoreska wrote:
April 15th, 2020, 1:27 pm
Anyone take this test?
8values.github.io
i got 70% equality, 80% world, 72% liberal, 88% progress and it says im a libertarian socialist
Image
I finally decided to take this test, but I had to google some questions and had to choose unsure on a lot because I didn't really understand both sides or the question enough to answer. And some questions are just so badly worded it's hard to answer them. But here's mine:

Image
"I do not always know what I want, but I do know what I don't want." - Stanley Kubrick

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#6781

Post by Dolwphin » June 5th, 2020, 4:50 pm

I got Centrist Marxism. Centrist Marxism is a form of Marxism that adopts Marxist views on society and the economy while also refraining from taking a definitive position on revolution and reformism. Many Centrist Marxists may also be more nationalistic than other Marxists.

Left-Wing Nationalism: 74.3%
Democratic Socialism: 57%
Orthodox Marxism: 54.5%
Council Communism: 53.7%
Social Democracy: 45.4%
Eco-Marxism: 40.6%
Utopian Socialism: 38.6%
Left Communism: 26.6%
Market Anarchism: 24.6%
Anarcho-Communism: 21.5%
Eco-Anarchism: 7.7%
Marxism-Leninism: 0%
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#6782

Post by Onderhond » June 5th, 2020, 5:07 pm

Closest Match: Libertarian Socialism

Looking at the wiki for that though, I doesn't sound like me at all :D

Not always sure whether to answer these questions on a purely personal level, or what I feel is best for everyone. For example, I don't care about traditions at all, but I recognize others do and can see it would be better to preserve them at least to some degree, for the greater good.

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#6783

Post by Armoreska » June 7th, 2020, 12:26 am

I somehow got less equality than anybody else on 1st try :lol:
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currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): ANARCHISTS, 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

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#6784

Post by Armoreska » June 7th, 2020, 2:27 pm

It's interesting that I live on the territory of the first attempted large anarchist society
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Makhnovia
I better watch the 2 movies about it!
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currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): ANARCHISTS, 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

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#6785

Post by Cippenham » June 12th, 2020, 7:44 am

I am a right wing populist in that test, 8 values, no comment.

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#6786

Post by Armoreska » June 16th, 2020, 11:07 am

@Arthur, did you watch Marxist Analysis film reviews on YouTube?
Shrek
Animal Farm
Bee Movie
Bugs Life
Antz
The Room (lol)
Raid: Shadow legends (lol)
...
also watched separately
Lego movie
Gummo
Lion King
Falling Down
Snowpiercer

Maybe you have some recommends in this vein.
Last edited by Armoreska on June 16th, 2020, 11:12 am, edited 2 times in total.
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currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): ANARCHISTS, 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

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#6787

Post by Armoreska » June 16th, 2020, 11:08 am

Cippenham wrote:
June 12th, 2020, 7:44 am
I am a right wing populist in that test, 8 values, no comment.
Intrsng to know
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currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): ANARCHISTS, 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

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#6788

Post by matthewscott8 » June 17th, 2020, 4:51 pm

matthewscott8 wrote:
April 30th, 2020, 2:56 pm
Pretentious Hipster wrote:
April 30th, 2020, 1:29 pm
is this some magic of tech, e.g. deepfake
6:38 to 7:03 is frickin hilarious in Ayn Rand's voice. I'd actually much rather listen to this than read the manifesto.


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#6790

Post by Armoreska » July 1st, 2020, 11:01 pm

FYI it's not a referendum, it's just bells & whistles for the zombies of the state.
How to do referendums is in the constitution. They call this simply "voting".
The idea was to boycott the ugly thing but half the opposition decided to go the idiots.
The system is completely broken and they can vote online too which is even more broken and non-transparent.
Any independent observers were denied and/or announced the boycott.
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currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): ANARCHISTS, 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

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#6791

Post by Mario Gaborović » July 8th, 2020, 10:15 pm

Gendarmerie beats up people who're just sitting on the bench. Aleksandar Vučić is yet another autocrat jerk supported by EU who is supposed to be bastion of democracy. I can't see the end of his rule anytime soon.



Some more charming pictures later this evening:
https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=727149078148891

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#6792

Post by Gershwin » July 9th, 2020, 8:41 pm

Mario Gaborović wrote:
July 8th, 2020, 10:15 pm
Gendarmerie beats up people who're just sitting on the bench. Aleksandar Vučić is yet another autocrat jerk supported by EU who is supposed to be bastion of democracy. I can't see the end of his rule anytime soon.



Some more charming pictures later this evening:
https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=727149078148891
I don't know if it's of any help, but my Dutch newspaper was critical about this yesterday and had a quite extensive piece about Serbia and Vučić, and how he won the elections using corona measures. And that's a very MSM, somewhat elitist newspaper, slightly leftist, and pro EU.

So it's not like inside random European Union countries he's hailed like the ultimate liberal guy who deserves all the EU support he can get.
RokP 250

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#6793

Post by mjf314 » July 9th, 2020, 8:59 pm

I just took the 8values test. There were some questions that I didn't fully understand, so I'm not sure how accurate the results are.

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#6794

Post by Mario Gaborović » July 9th, 2020, 9:12 pm

I don't know if it's of any help, but my Dutch newspaper was critical about this yesterday and had a quite extensive piece about Serbia and Vučić, and how he won the elections using corona measures. And that's a very MSM, somewhat elitist newspaper, slightly leftist, and pro EU.
Basically he wins the elections from two major sources of people:

- Older, poorly educated, mostly rural folks who believe everything TV and media says (all the speleologists coming straight from his rectum who get massive financial support). They simply adore strong hand of a powerholder, they respect authority, and sadly they ALWAYS get to vote first in the morning; no rheumatism or hip pain can stop them. In news media anyone who oppose them is named "junky, hater, thief, drunkard, Albanian lobbist", you name it.
- People who are afraid of losing their job if they don't vote for the ruling party - even the cleaning women and coffeemakers are in obligation to come out voting and in some cases them even have to shoot with mobiles to prove it. Those who don't usually get sacked. Because every single state-owned company has managers put there because of loyalty to the party, regardless of expertise.

ANOTHER VIDEO OF POLICE BRUTALITY:

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#6795

Post by Armoreska » July 10th, 2020, 4:54 am

made a table

|_Armo_2019_pre-demarketization_|_70.5_|_79.4_|_71.8_|_88___|_309.7_|

|_MJF_2020_____________________|_73.1_|_76.1_|_70.2_|_81.8_|_301.2_|

|_GruesomeTwosome_2020________|_85.3_|_79.4_|_70.6_|_77.1_|_312.4_|

|_MightySparks_2020_____________|_67.3_|_61.7_|_63.5_|_70.3_|_262.8_|

|_Shugs_2020___________________|_74.4_|_69.4_|_61.5_|_78.7_|_284___|

|_Dol_W._Phin_2020_____________|_90.4_|_56.7_|_67.5_|_74.7_|_289.3_|

|_Onderhond_2020_______________|_78.2_|_75.6_|_63.1_|_84___|_300.9_|

|_Cinepolis_2020_________________|_54.5_|_40.6_|_42.1_|_40.3_|_177.5_|

|_Arthur_2020___________________|_92.3_|_82.2_|_75___|_89.3_|_338.8_|

|_Arthur_2018___________________|_68.3_|_76.6_|_73.8_|_77.2_|_295.9_|

|_RBG_2018_____________________|_79.9_|_77.7_|_75.8_|_78.8_|_312.2_|

|_Knaldskalle_2018_______________|_79.9_|_77.9_|_75.8_|_78.8_|_315___|

|_Xianjiro_2018__________________|_79.9_|_75.5_|_72.3_|_78.9_|_306.6_|

|_Sebby_2018____________________|_78___|_84.6_|_80.8_|_87.8_|_331.2_|
Last edited by Armoreska on July 10th, 2020, 2:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Image
currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): ANARCHISTS, 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

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#6796

Post by Cinepolis » July 10th, 2020, 7:37 am

My results:

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#6797

Post by Mario Gaborović » July 18th, 2020, 7:27 pm

Here's a new video from Serbia: the head of the city police crime branch in Novi Sad, with his helpers, pushes an autistic child from the bike and kicks him in the head.
The child was passing by, unaware of what is going on.
https://www.facebook.com/novanadakovaci ... 744350562/

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#6798

Post by Armoreska » July 21st, 2020, 10:47 am

Breaking news.
In Western Ukraine, an anarchist captured hostages and told everyone to watch Earthlings, among other non-movie requests.

(This all as I was here watching No Gods No Masters: A History of Anarchism covering Propaganda of the deed. :blink: )

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lutsk_hostage_crisis
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currently working towards a vegan/low waste world + thru such film lists (besides TV): ANARCHISTS, 2010s bests, RW Fassbinder, Yasujiro Ozu, Eric Rohmer, Visual Effects nominees, kid-related stuff, great animes (mini-serie or feature), very 80s movies, 17+ sci-fi lists on watchlist, ENVIRO, remarkable Silent Films and Pre-Code (exploring 1925 atm) and every shorts and docu list I'm aware of and
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1434
and "Gordon" Liu Chia-Hui/Liu Chia-Liang and Yuen Woo-ping and "Sammo" Hung Kam-bo

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