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Italian Challenge (May 2018)

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sol
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Italian Challenge (May 2018)

#1

Post by sol » April 29th, 2018, 3:24 am

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[Pictured: Elio Petri's masterpiece, Investigation of a Citizen Above Suspicion]
Italy Challenge
Goal
Watch as many Italian movies as you can from May 1, 2018 to May 31, 2018.

What is an Italian Film?
- Any film listed with Italy as first country of production on IMDb automatically qualifies
- Any film shot entirely on location in Italy automatically qualifies
- Any film listed in one of the Official lists below automatically qualifies
- Any other film that you genuinely believe to be an Italian Movie qualifies. You should be prepared to back up your reasoning though! There needs to be a sensible reason for you to classify a film as Italian. You are not allowed to include The Italian Job because "there is the word Italian in the title", etc. :folded:

Rules
- Each feature film (over 40 minutes) counts as one entry.
- 60 minutes of short films counts as one entry.
- 60 minutes of TV episodes counts as one entry.
- 60 minutes of music videos counts as one entry.
- The usual miniseries rule applies (ask if unsure).
- Rewatches are allowed and are good for the soul.

I reserve the right to exclude participants who intentionally number their viewings incorrectly. If you play the game, you're expected to play properly.

DEADLINE
Final results will be posted between 7:30am and 8:00am GMT on June 2 - at which point it will have been May everywhere in the world for almost a whole day. While you are welcome to post updates beyond this point, any such updates will not be included in the final results. Your choice whether you miss the deadline or not; besides, if it's June on your side of the world, shouldn't you be starting on one of next month's challenges, mm?

Stuck for ideas of what to watch? Look no further:

Official Lists
Il Grande Cinema Italiano
One hundred film and one country, Italy
UNESCO / entries for Italy: 391-405
SWDB's Top 50 Spaghetti Westerns

Non-Official Lists
Italian Neo-Realism
Italian Gothic Movies
Italian submissions for the Academy Award for Best Foreign Language Film
'I Capolavori' - The 4 and 5 star Italian classics, according to the Morandini dictionary
Jean A. Gili's Italian Cinema

Films Streaming Online
For the small percentage of users who reside in the US

This thread will be updated at least twice a day (more often if I am around and feel like it). Since I am updating manually, I would appreciated it if you to list new films seen in a new post. If you would prefer just to endlessly edit your original post, please let me know so that I remember to check your post.

Participants
RankParticipant# of Watches
1 72allinncallme 95
2 psychotronicbeatnik 84
3 Eve-Lang-El-Coup 61
4 Nopros 60
5 jdidaco 56
6 Simba63 46
7 sortile9io 36
8 RogerTheMovieManiac88 29
9 flavo5000 28
10 sol 26
11 Mate_cosido 25
12 3eyes 16
13 allisoncm 15
13 OldAle1 15
15 frbrown 14
16 hurluberlu 11
16 India Istanbul 11
16 jeroeno 11
16 morrison-dylan-fan 11
20 cinephage 10
20 maxwelldeux 10
20 peeptoad 10
23 vortexsurfer 8
23 weirdboy 8
25 Knaldskalle 6
26 jvv 5
27 ororama 4
28 Lonewolf2003 3
28 tommy_leazaq 3
30 Hippiemans 2
30 Lilarcor 2
32 blocho 1
32 Melvelet 1
32 sebby 1
Last edited by sol on June 1st, 2018, 11:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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#2

Post by weirdboy » April 29th, 2018, 4:28 am

I have a couple on my watchlist from the 500< 400 list for next month. I haven't decided how many I'll try to watch beyond that just yet.

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#3

Post by Eve-Lang-El-Coup » April 29th, 2018, 5:29 am

I'll be watching a lot. The aim is to get close or into the top 100 of both main lists in addition to eating spaghetti.

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#4

Post by maxwelldeux » April 29th, 2018, 6:47 am

Just to be clear, to qualify, Italy must the the primary contributor, and not merely a significant contributor, correct?

For the sake of consistency, let's apply the Viridiana (1961) test: For the Latin American challenge, I argued that Viridiana should be included, because Mexico had an important role in the film getting made (i.e., "significant contributor"). Ultimately, it was decided that because Spain was the main country (i.e., "primary contributor"), Viridiana would not be eligible.

I tend to judge country challenges on the "significant contributor" doctrine, and others go with the "primary contributor" doctrine. Both are fine (IMHO), but I want to be clear about how you're judging the challenge to avoid any confusion.

[This is probably something we should decide on collectively to avoid future confusion...]

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#5

Post by sortile9io » April 29th, 2018, 8:23 am

In, mostly for a silver on the "One hundred films and one country, Italy" list and a few guilty pleasures (not that a feel any guilt anyway).

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#6

Post by 72allinncallme » April 29th, 2018, 8:53 am

Sono con te! Will’a try to achieve bronze on the two country lists.

One hundred film and one country, Italy 28/110 +27 (rank: 491)

Il Grande Cinema Italiano 51/250 +74 (rank: 680)
Last edited by 72allinncallme on April 29th, 2018, 9:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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#7

Post by sol » April 29th, 2018, 9:38 am

maxwelldeux on Apr 29 2018, 12:47:10 AM wrote:Just to be clear, to qualify, Italy must the the primary contributor, and not merely a significant contributor, correct?

For the sake of consistency, let's apply the Viridiana (1961) test: For the Latin American challenge, I argued that Viridiana should be included, because Mexico had an important role in the film getting made (i.e., "significant contributor"). Ultimately, it was decided that because Spain was the main country (i.e., "primary contributor"), Viridiana would not be eligible.

I tend to judge country challenges on the "significant contributor" doctrine, and others go with the "primary contributor" doctrine. Both are fine (IMHO), but I want to be clear about how you're judging the challenge to avoid any confusion.

[This is probably something we should decide on collectively to avoid future confusion...]
Not correct.

Let's look at what I wrote in the OP:
What is an Italian Film?
- Any film listed with Italy as first country of production on IMDb automatically qualifies
- Any film shot entirely on location in Italy automatically qualifies
- Any film listed in one of the Official lists below automatically qualifies
- Any other film that you genuinely believe to be an Italian Movie qualifies. You should be prepared to back up your reasoning though! There needs to be a sensible reason for you to classify a film as Italian.
As far as I am concerned, any co-production that meets the above guidelines is eligible for the Challenge.

Personally speaking, I don't see what the issue is with co-productions being eligible for more than one Challenge. There is the same issue with genres. Are you going to stop someone watching Shaun of the Dead for the Comedy Challenge because you think it is more horror than comedy - or vice versa?

In any case, I don't have enough time to run through every film that gets mentioned on this thread and police it. Sure, if someone submits something obviously wrong (like The Wizard Oz), I will chime in. Same for genuine easy-to-make mistakes (e.g. Amer is a giallo homage but not Italian). But I'm not about to go looking up the IMDb details for every film included here. Of course, if you - or somebody else - wants to do that, that's perfectly fine with me.
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#8

Post by sortile9io » April 29th, 2018, 10:42 am

sol on Apr 28 2018, 09:24:43 PM wrote:- Any film shot entirely on location in Italy automatically qualifies
But this can conflict with the primary contributor rule ("Italy must the the primary contributor"), take for instance William Wyler's "Roman holiday".

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#9

Post by sol » April 29th, 2018, 10:52 am

sortile9io on Apr 29 2018, 04:42:16 AM wrote:
sol on Apr 28 2018, 09:24:43 PM wrote:- Any film shot entirely on location in Italy automatically qualifies
But this can conflict with the primary contributor rule ("Italy must the the primary contributor"), take for instance William Wyler's "Roman holiday".
What primary contributor rule? I never said that there was a primary contributor rule. That was Max.

For what it's worth, these are the exact same rules that I used last year when I hosted the India and Japan Challenges and everybody was happy with these rules then. :shrug:
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#10

Post by peeptoad » April 29th, 2018, 4:23 pm

sol on Apr 28 2018, 09:24:43 PM wrote: - Rewatches are allowed and are good for the soul.
...like my grandma's gravy recipe. :thumbsup:

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#11

Post by Nopros » April 29th, 2018, 6:14 pm

I'm in.

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#12

Post by sortile9io » April 29th, 2018, 6:30 pm

sol on Apr 29 2018, 04:52:14 AM wrote:
sortile9io on Apr 29 2018, 04:42:16 AM wrote:
sol on Apr 28 2018, 09:24:43 PM wrote:- Any film shot entirely on location in Italy automatically qualifies
But this can conflict with the primary contributor rule ("Italy must the the primary contributor"), take for instance William Wyler's "Roman holiday".
What primary contributor rule? I never said that there was a primary contributor rule. That was Max.

For what it's worth, these are the exact same rules that I used last year when I hosted the India and Japan Challenges and everybody was happy with these rules then. :shrug:
Sorry, I misread that part. So, just to be sure, it qualifies even though it is not an Italian coproduction, right?

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#13

Post by 3eyes » April 29th, 2018, 6:46 pm

I'm in.
:run: STILL the Gaffer!

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#14

Post by maxwelldeux » April 29th, 2018, 8:01 pm

sol on Apr 29 2018, 03:38:02 AM wrote:
maxwelldeux on Apr 29 2018, 12:47:10 AM wrote:Just to be clear, to qualify, Italy must the the primary contributor, and not merely a significant contributor, correct?

For the sake of consistency, let's apply the Viridiana (1961) test: For the Latin American challenge, I argued that Viridiana should be included, because Mexico had an important role in the film getting made (i.e., "significant contributor"). Ultimately, it was decided that because Spain was the main country (i.e., "primary contributor"), Viridiana would not be eligible.

I tend to judge country challenges on the "significant contributor" doctrine, and others go with the "primary contributor" doctrine. Both are fine (IMHO), but I want to be clear about how you're judging the challenge to avoid any confusion.

[This is probably something we should decide on collectively to avoid future confusion...]
Not correct.

Let's look at what I wrote in the OP:
What is an Italian Film?
- Any film listed with Italy as first country of production on IMDb automatically qualifies
- Any film shot entirely on location in Italy automatically qualifies
- Any film listed in one of the Official lists below automatically qualifies
- Any other film that you genuinely believe to be an Italian Movie qualifies. You should be prepared to back up your reasoning though! There needs to be a sensible reason for you to classify a film as Italian.
As far as I am concerned, any co-production that meets the above guidelines is eligible for the Challenge.

Personally speaking, I don't see what the issue is with co-productions being eligible for more than one Challenge. There is the same issue with genres. Are you going to stop someone watching Shaun of the Dead for the Comedy Challenge because you think it is more horror than comedy - or vice versa?

In any case, I don't have enough time to run through every film that gets mentioned on this thread and police it. Sure, if someone submits something obviously wrong (like The Wizard Oz), I will chime in. Same for genuine easy-to-make mistakes (e.g. Amer is a giallo homage but not Italian). But I'm not about to go looking up the IMDb details for every film included here. Of course, if you - or somebody else - wants to do that, that's perfectly fine with me.
OK. So let's apply the Blow-Up (1966) test:

1. UK is listed first on IMDB, so Blow-Up wouldn't qualify under this criteria
2. It was shot in the UK, so Blow-Up wouldn't qualify under this criteria
3. It's not on any of the official Italian lists, so Blow-Up wouldn't qualify under this criteria
4. This is where my question lies - I'm prepared to back up my reasoning as to why Italy had a significant contribution to the film (e.g., Italian co-producers, Italian director), though I would never argue that it's an Italian film.

So, if would Blow-Up qualify? I'm perfectly fine with whatever decision, I just want to better understand this...

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#15

Post by Knaldskalle » April 29th, 2018, 8:44 pm

I'm in. I have a feeling I'll be watching (and rewatching?) a bunch of gialli and Spaghetti Westerns.
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#16

Post by sol » April 29th, 2018, 11:52 pm

sortile9io on Apr 29 2018, 12:30:36 PM wrote:Sorry, I misread that part. So, just to be sure, it qualifies even though it is not an Italian coproduction, right?
Yes... if you really wanted to include it. :shrug:
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#17

Post by sol » April 29th, 2018, 11:57 pm

maxwelldeux on Apr 29 2018, 02:01:31 PM wrote:OK. So let's apply the Blow-Up (1966) test:

1. UK is listed first on IMDB, so Blow-Up wouldn't qualify under this criteria
2. It was shot in the UK, so Blow-Up wouldn't qualify under this criteria
3. It's not on any of the official Italian lists, so Blow-Up wouldn't qualify under this criteria
4. This is where my question lies - I'm prepared to back up my reasoning as to why Italy had a significant contribution to the film (e.g., Italian co-producers, Italian director), though I would never argue that it's an Italian film.

So, if would Blow-Up qualify? I'm perfectly fine with whatever decision, I just want to better understand this...
As per the Low IMDb Rating Challenge -- where I set the limit as 5.4 but told participants that they could be stricter on themselves if they wanted -- I would always prefer to have more leniency and openness to encourage more participation. I don't know it is quite 'in the right spirit' of the Challenge if one spends the whole month watching borderline Italian movies like Roman Holiday and Blowup, however, it is an Italy Challenge, and the Wyler film does show off the country in all its glory and if you're prepared to back up the Italian element of Blowup, I'm not going to stop you.

You do need to prepared though, because (as mentioned), I will challenge something like The Wizard of Oz that obviously doesn't qualify, and others might challenge you too. I don't know. Play the Challenge how you want. We're all adults here and it is up to you to live with your decisions.
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#18

Post by maxwelldeux » April 30th, 2018, 3:08 am

sol on Apr 29 2018, 05:57:04 PM wrote:As per the Low IMDb Rating Challenge -- where I set the limit as 5.4 but told participants that they could be stricter on themselves if they wanted -- I would always prefer to have more leniency and openness to encourage more participation. I don't know it is quite 'in the right spirit' of the Challenge if one spends the whole month watching borderline Italian movies like Roman Holiday and Blowup, however, it is an Italy Challenge, and the Wyler film does show off the country in all its glory and if you're prepared to back up the Italian element of Blowup, I'm not going to stop you.

You do need to prepared though, because (as mentioned), I will challenge something like The Wizard of Oz that obviously doesn't qualify, and others might challenge you too. I don't know. Play the Challenge how you want. We're all adults here and it is up to you to live with your decisions.
OK cool - this helps a lot! Thank you! :thumbsup:

I'm really not trying to push the limits of what qualifies; I have plenty of Fellini et al. to watch that's clearly Italian. I think you and I tend to judge these things similarly now that I see where you're coming from.

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#19

Post by jdidaco » April 30th, 2018, 8:09 pm

In. Thanks for hosting, sol!

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#20

Post by maxwelldeux » May 1st, 2018, 7:53 am


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#21

Post by Eve-Lang-El-Coup » May 1st, 2018, 11:10 am

I'll start things off by being Divorce[d], Italian Style. (1961)
It turns out that divorce is much better than marriage, at least when it comes to the Italians.

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#22

Post by sol » May 1st, 2018, 4:05 pm

1. Night Train Murders (1975)

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I'm weary of revealing too much and possibly ruining a fresh experience of this nifty Italian thriller (and it is best not to view the iCM page either) but suffice it to say that when a film opens with its antagonists assaulting a man in a Santa's Claus outfit in broad daylight, you know that you are in for a grisly and decidedly offbeat affair -- and not your average bit of Xmas cheer.
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#23

Post by India Istanbul » May 1st, 2018, 4:40 pm

1. Conquest dir. by Lucio Fulci

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#24

Post by maxwelldeux » May 1st, 2018, 4:59 pm

I like to try and fit my 2018 film goals into the challenges each month, and I often find myself asking stupid questions... like "Any Italian movies on the 100 Korean Films" list?

No. Just... no.

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#25

Post by Lilarcor » May 1st, 2018, 5:22 pm

In, hoping for 5 (busy month). I haven't seen a single giallo in my life, where is a good place to start?

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#26

Post by peeptoad » May 1st, 2018, 7:20 pm

Lilarcor on May 1 2018, 11:22:11 AM wrote:In, hoping for 5 (busy month). I haven't seen a single giallo in my life, where is a good place to start?
IMHO any of these would suffice:

Blood & Black Lace (1964)- Bava and arguably the "first" giallo, at least in the traditional vein.
The Fifth Cord (1971)
The Strange Vice of Mrs Wardh (1971)
What Have You Done to Solange? (1972)
Your Vice Is a Locked Room and Only I Have the Key (1972)
Torso (1973)
Deep Red (1975)
Tenebrae (1982)

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#27

Post by allisoncm » May 1st, 2018, 9:54 pm

I'm in. I have some spaghetti westerns to catch up on.

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#28

Post by 72allinncallme » May 1st, 2018, 10:30 pm

1. Indagine su un cittadino al di sopra di ogni sospetto (1970) (l)
2. Riso amaro (1949)
3. Accattone (1961)
4. La ragazza con la valigia (1961)
5. Cronaca di un amore (1950)

I love Italy :wub:

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#29

Post by Nopros » May 1st, 2018, 10:43 pm

1. Sciuscià (1946)
2. I pugni in tasca (1965)
3. I vitelloni (1953)
4. Il grido (1957)
5. Miracolo a Milano (1951)
6. Stromboli (1950)

All great movies. I've been missing out, Italy.

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#30

Post by flavo5000 » May 1st, 2018, 10:43 pm

For anyone going for all three challenges this month, just focus on spaghetti westerns.

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#31

Post by jdidaco » May 1st, 2018, 11:35 pm

1. Spartaco (Sins of Rome, Story of Spartacus, Riccardo Freda, 1953) 9/10
2. Il figlio di Spartacus (The Slave: The Son of Spartacus, Sergio Corbucci, 1962) 8/10
3. Minnesota Clay (Sergio Corbucci, 1964) 7/10
4. La morte non conta I dollari (Death at Owell Rock, Riccardo Freda, 1967) 7/10

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#32

Post by 3eyes » May 2nd, 2018, 1:56 am

1. Quién sabe? / A bullet for the general (67) [Triple]
:run: STILL the Gaffer!

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#33

Post by maxwelldeux » May 2nd, 2018, 3:13 am

1. La Strada (1954)

Hi, and welcome to Human Trafficking 101. Today's unit will be taught by Professor Fellini, and will focus on labor trafficking... I thought it pretty great - you can see all the elements of despair that would land a person in a trafficking situation like this, and the sorts of mental tricks done to keep someone in the life. I thought it was great exposition of that weird love/hate/dependency you see in relationships like this, and had a good moral element to it. Quite enjoyable, though heavy and sad.

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#34

Post by weirdboy » May 2nd, 2018, 3:19 am

Oh, right I suppose this movie counts here, too.

1. Milano calibro 9 (Caliber 9) - 1972 - Fernando Di Leo 7/10

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#35

Post by Lilarcor » May 2nd, 2018, 3:28 am

peeptoad on May 1 2018, 01:20:57 PM wrote:
Lilarcor on May 1 2018, 11:22:11 AM wrote:In, hoping for 5 (busy month). I haven't seen a single giallo in my life, where is a good place to start?
IMHO any of these would suffice:

Blood & Black Lace (1964)- Bava and arguably the "first" giallo, at least in the traditional vein.
The Fifth Cord (1971)
The Strange Vice of Mrs Wardh (1971)
What Have You Done to Solange? (1972)
Your Vice Is a Locked Room and Only I Have the Key (1972)
Torso (1973)
Deep Red (1975)
Tenebrae (1982)


Thanks!

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#36

Post by peeptoad » May 2nd, 2018, 4:32 am

*rewatch

1. Cannibal Ferox (1981) 7*

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#37

Post by cinephage » May 2nd, 2018, 10:06 am

01. La casa sperduta nel parco, by Ruggero Deodato (1980) 7/10

A gritty exploitation film, quite sadistic...

02. Roma, by Federico Fellini (1972) 5/10

I guess this is a very good film, but I can't really get into Fellini's capharnaum... Too loud, too confuse, too unfocussed...

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#38

Post by sol » May 2nd, 2018, 1:12 pm

The Italian JobShow
1. Night Train Murders (1975)
2. Let Sleeping Corpses Lie (1974)

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A zombie movie with a difference, this Italian offering taps into fears of radiation and environmental concerns as an experimental new form of pesticide (see above) that aggravates insects causes the undead to rise from their graves. Oddball touches include a doctor who wants the male protagonist to donate his body to science and babies born with zombie-like tendencies. The reliable Arthur Kennedy is also on hand as a grumpy cop.
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#39

Post by Simba63 » May 2nd, 2018, 3:17 pm

1. Il pistolero dell'Ave Maria (1969) - 6/10
2. Une corde... un Colt... (1969) - 6/10
3. Il grande silenzio (1968) - 8/10
4. Prega il morto e ammazza il vivo (1971) - 6/10

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#40

Post by frbrown » May 2nd, 2018, 4:08 pm

1. Top Model (1988)
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