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Film Purism: How Extreme Are You? [TALKING IMAGES]

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St. Gloede
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Film Purism: How Extreme Are You? [TALKING IMAGES]

#1

Post by St. Gloede » August 27th, 2020, 3:45 pm

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Hi all,

Are you a film purist?

And if so, are you an extremist?


In this episode Sol jumps into the host's chair to see just how many of film purist Tom's buttons he can push before he breaks. Co-hosts Adam and Lauren join in for this gut-wrenching human drama of perfect cinema conditions and absolute respect for the artists vs. workouts, cleaning, internet browsing, eating and watching films on 1.5x speed - on your smartphone.

The way that we consume movies has a changed a lot over the past 125 years. It is now possible to pause a film while watching it, watch a film the kitchen while doing the dishes and even eat an entire meal while watching a movie. While this would have seen but a dream back in the silent era, watching a film without being totally focused on it is a growing reality in the world of today. But is that the best and most enjoyable way to watch a film?

Some of the pivotal blasphemies may include:
  • Eating
  • Drinking
  • Pausing
  • Exercising
  • Doing chores
  • Browsing
  • Watching a film in parts over several days
  • Watching films while on public transport
  • Watching films on your phone
  • Watching films with a different frame rate, like 1.5x speed
  • Anything that does not replicate exact cinema conditions
Let us know!

-

You can listen here:

Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/show/3GhRXnb6OzOnfae2Uvkvus
Sounder - https://talking-images.sounder.fm/episode/film-purism

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#2

Post by pitchorneirda » August 27th, 2020, 3:55 pm

I have trouble listening to a whole episode because I can't understand English perfectly without subtitles, but I must say the topics ALWAYS sound interesting and I'll give this episode a try.

I'm not a purist at all, but I can't consider watching a film on your phone as a valid check, I mean you may feel whether you're gonna like it or not but please if you do, rewatch it in better conditions!

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#3

Post by OldAle1 » August 27th, 2020, 4:19 pm

Will expound more perhaps when I've listened to it but...I'm fairly purist. Eating and drinking are totally OK - I grew up going to the movies and eating popcorn or candy and drinking a big Coke just like most people of my generation, and I don't find that they usually interfere that much with the experience - though I do appreciate seeing films in places where their consumption is disallowed. I'd rather go a couple of hours with no drink or snack than hear other people loudly throughout, if those are my choices.

Everything else on the list is pretty much a no-no for me. When I'm watching a movie, I'm watching a movie, period. I'm not posting on this or any other site, I'm not on my phone, I'm not doing chores, I'm not writing, I'm not making dinner, etc. I have VERY occasionally watched films sped-up if a) they are really terrible and aren't visually or sonically interesting and/or b) they are in extremely poor quality but I feel the need to see them anyway. Case in point was the 1925 She which I watched a couple of years ago which was only available in a horrendous YT copy - big fan of the other films based on the same source, and just felt the need to see this one, and see little chance that it will be available in a decent copy anytime soon. I think I watched that at 1.5x - it also actually looked better and was easier to see when sped up as it turned out; anything else I've sped up has been 1.1x typically, and I'd say that applies to significantly less than 1% of viewings. Even during the low ratings challenge I only did that with maybe 3-5 films, and never for the full run-time. And I feel like a bad person for it.

I do very occasionally pause films if they're things I've seen before or, again, if they're really terrible, and in the last 2-3 years I've been guilty of watching films over 2 days a few times, something I really hate to do, but I can't seem to stay up as easily as I used to and I don't necessarily manage my time that well (shit that's an understatement). Pretty much always when I fall asleep during something it wasn't really worth that much anyway though - a film like Edvard Munch for example kept me riveted even though it was very long and went on past my usual bedtime. Obviously really long films that don't have specific intermissions (i.e. Lav Diaz films) are an exception to the no breaks rule, and miniseries or films cut into specific parts (Out 1) I'm totally OK with seeing over multiple days, though I do find that nearly always the experience is improved pretty dramatically by watching anything, no matter how long, all in one go if possible.

And finally the concept of watching a film on a phone is just anathema to me, that's really the only word I can come up with. Lately I'm more and more fed up with having to deal with just a 40" screen, and the only stuff I watch on my 17" laptop is usually short video things. Rare exception in hotel rooms but the last time I "had" to watch a feature on my computer was in February.

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#4

Post by St. Gloede » August 27th, 2020, 4:49 pm

I would say I'm only a purist for great films, in which case I will lower the lights and focus on nothing else - except looking at the clock occasionally, as it is placed fairly close to the TV, making it rather unavoidable. Of course, I can't know what I am to find great going these. These conditions are either applied to films I'm excited by, or rewatches.

I may snack and drink to any film, that is part of the cinema experience as well (to many, an important one). I have never exercised (if I recall correctly) but I have played with the idea - and walking on a treadmill while watching a film, especially a more mainstream/easy film, sounds like a fairly good idea. (Won't install a TV in the workout room any time soon though).

In terms of light browsing, yes, especially for more commercial English language films, which are usually very easy to follow and not that visually interesting. I do the same with TV. I will usually give a film a grace period to see how good it is, but it is clear nothing special is going on, I may check in on various things going on. I have no issue multitasking in general (but get really annoyed and will go back if something interrupts a great film).

As for cutting up films in chunks: All the time! Especially with covid. Now that I work from home I will usually watch half a film during my lunch break, and the other half later. I don't think this hurts the film experience - though I do prefer single sittings. I also need to do it with longer films, even if great, as I am married and usually can't check out completely for 3+ hours.

I think the most interesting question here is the 1.5x question. That's the major deal breaker for me. I have never done it myself, but I have had it done to me: I.e. silent films readjusted for 24-25 frames per second - and it is AWFUL. The only one I recall right now is Richard Oswald's beautiful film Die Rothausgasse (1928). Which was supposed to be around 90 minutes, but ended up being around 60 minutes. While watching it I kept being annoyed by how fast it seemed to be moving and I considered actually doing the reverse of 1.5x, i.e. slowing it down, but at the time I had no idea how wrong it was or if it was even wrong. Wouls love to see a more accurate restoration at some point, and I really wished people stopped making this mistake.

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#5

Post by St. Gloede » August 27th, 2020, 5:52 pm

Oh, and re: Smartphones - No, never, and that sounds like a horrible experience.

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#6

Post by brokenface » August 27th, 2020, 6:21 pm

If i blink i have to start over

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#7

Post by Lonewolf2003 » August 27th, 2020, 7:21 pm

I'm also pretty old-school purist. Like OldAle, when I'm watching a movie, that is what I'm doing and focused on. That's why when I start a movie I turn off the lights and put my phone/laptop/iPad away, sit back and be immersed. So basically I try to mimic a cinema-like setting with as few distractions possible, so I can focus completely on the movie. So for me everything that doesn't break that focus (f.e. eating and drinking) I do and anything that does I try to avoid. It also helps I don’t have FOMO or inclinations that I have to react immediately, people that message me can easily wait a few hours.

Just like St.Gloede I never exercised while watching a movie, but I can understand how some exercises could be done while keeping watching the screen. Chores I never do myself while watching a movie, cause I can't focus on the movie while doing those.

To me a movie is meant as an experience you immerse yourself in by being kind of hypnotized by the moving images, sound and light effects. That’s why I watch them (as much as possible) in one setting. Of course I’m human, so I do take bathroom breaks, get a drink or a snack or some bastard tries to disturb me by calling me. Even long movies I try to sit in one setting, because, like OldAle, I feel it almost always improves the experiences. (an exception is the longer version of Scenes of Marriage, which I did watch in one-setting, but afterward wish I had broken up in parts). I really feel movies should be consumed that way and have a hard time understanding others don’t. Like I also don’t understand people watching a movie on a phone or blasphemously on increased speed.

I have become more purist about browsing over the years. I just find it harder to multitask nowadays. In the old days (so previous decade), like the still young St. Gloede, with formulaic English (or Dutch) movies I would browse meanwhile, but nowadays the few times I actually do it anyhow (cause a movie really can't keep my attention) I notice I’m doing neither really; missing most of the movie, while doing the browsing also halfheartedly. More importantly I try just to not waste my time any more with movies that aren’t great… well movies I at least hope to enjoy and are worth giving my full attention to during their runtime.

Btw, as a mod on iCM I will be following this thread closely to see whose checks I have to revoke. :guns: :D

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#8

Post by burneyfan » August 27th, 2020, 7:29 pm

If I had to be an ultra-purist with the amount of other "life stuff" I have to do, I'd only get to watch maybe 1-2 films a week. I eat, drink, and pause -- I'm frequently interrupted by family or work, so watching a film without a single pause is a rare luxury. I virtually never let a film sit half-watched for more than 24 hours (usually it's more like 2-3 hours, tops). I do sometimes separate episodes of miniseries (and often TV series) by several days, though.

I often walk in place for exercise in front of the TV while focusing on the screen -- if anything, I find that the exercise sharpens my focus on the film rather than distracting from it, maybe because I am trying so hard to escape the tedium of the exercise! In select cases where the strength of a film is almost entirely in its dialogue and the visuals are very unremarkable (and only in English), I will knit while I watch, occasionally looking down at my fingers in a quick blink, but I never do this for non-English language films, silent films, or anything where the visuals are even remotely striking. Sometimes, I will stand up and fold laundry while watching a film on TV, but that's the extent of the housework I do with films -- no kitchen activities, house cleaning, etc.

I've never knowingly watched a film at a sped-up frame rate -- that's one line I can't imagine crossing. When I travel by plane or train, I often watch films on my iPad with noise-canceling headphones, but it's stuff like '50s B-movies and minor studio productions, not acclaimed masterpieces. Never watched a film on an a phone -- just dumb videos on YouTube or news.

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#9

Post by zuma » August 27th, 2020, 7:47 pm

For features drink is fine (almost mandatory), and occasionally food. None of the rest. For shorts it depends on the type.

I know some people, like Burney mentioned, have family duties, but if I have to pause a film for a long period or overnight I feel it is ruined. In some cases I just give up and uncheck it.

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#10

Post by Onderhond » August 27th, 2020, 8:29 pm

Lonewolf2003 wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 7:21 pm
So for me everything that doesn't break that focus (f.e. eating and drinking) I do and anything that does I try to avoid. It also helps I don’t have FOMO or inclinations that I have to react immediately, people that message me can easily wait a few hours.
This very much.

As for exercising, I've done that with documentaries (the simple, talking heads kind) and it works quite well. There are rarely about atmosphere or mood of course.
Minor breaks (like bathroom etc) are okay for me, apart from that I'll watch everything in one go.
Browsing or phone stuff while watching is insane. So are chores.
Speeding up wtf :D

Contrary to others though, I could imagine people watching films on their phone. I've never done it, but screen size is only relative to the distance of your screen, so if someone builds a nice bath setup for his phone ... why not.

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#11

Post by maxwelldeux » August 27th, 2020, 8:32 pm

burneyfan wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 7:29 pm
If I had to be an ultra-purist with the amount of other "life stuff" I have to do, I'd only get to watch maybe 1-2 films a week. I eat, drink, and pause -- I'm frequently interrupted by family or work, so watching a film without a single pause is a rare luxury. I virtually never let a film sit half-watched for more than 24 hours (usually it's more like 2-3 hours, tops). I do sometimes separate episodes of miniseries (and often TV series) by several days, though.
This. I mean, it took me over 2 hours to get through an 88-minute film last night. The dogs need out. The dogs need in. The dogs need fed. My beer is empty. I have to pee. Wife has a question about something. It's not always like that, but it's common. Life happens.

I'm also pro- watching films on phones. Not all films, certainly, but a lot of them. Most documentaries. Stand-up comedy. Most less-good films. Films without stunning visuals. This is a great way to pass the time on planes - back when I was traveling for work, it was a 6-hour flight each way, so I'd download 4-5 films on my phone that I knew I could watch and enjoy while sitting uncomfortably trapped in a seat.

I'm also guilty of browsing on my phone, though usually this is to enhance my film experience. I like to read the IMDB trivia of what I'm watching, as that often helps me appreciate the film more. And after a while, if the film doesn't pull me in or require 100% of my attention, I'm on my phone. Sorry, but between fight scenes, that Jean-Claude Van Damme doesn't need me at full attention to get what's going on.

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#12

Post by Onderhond » August 27th, 2020, 9:21 pm

I am surprised (re: podcast) how bad (or uninterested) everyone is at planning. I always know how long a film will take, I'll actively plan to fill gaps where I can watch uninterrupted. I never still "have to go to the shop" halfway through.

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#13

Post by Lonewolf2003 » August 27th, 2020, 9:24 pm

maxwelldeux wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 8:32 pm
burneyfan wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 7:29 pm
If I had to be an ultra-purist with the amount of other "life stuff" I have to do, I'd only get to watch maybe 1-2 films a week. I eat, drink, and pause -- I'm frequently interrupted by family or work, so watching a film without a single pause is a rare luxury. I virtually never let a film sit half-watched for more than 24 hours (usually it's more like 2-3 hours, tops). I do sometimes separate episodes of miniseries (and often TV series) by several days, though.
This. I mean, it took me over 2 hours to get through an 88-minute film last night. The dogs need out. The dogs need in. The dogs need fed. My beer is empty. I have to pee. Wife has a question about something. It's not always like that, but it's common. Life happens.

I'm also pro- watching films on phones. Not all films, certainly, but a lot of them. Most documentaries. Stand-up comedy. Most less-good films. Films without stunning visuals. This is a great way to pass the time on planes - back when I was traveling for work, it was a 6-hour flight each way, so I'd download 4-5 films on my phone that I knew I could watch and enjoy while sitting uncomfortably trapped in a seat.

I'm also guilty of browsing on my phone, though usually this is to enhance my film experience. I like to read the IMDB trivia of what I'm watching, as that often helps me appreciate the film more. And after a while, if the film doesn't pull me in or require 100% of my attention, I'm on my phone. Sorry, but between fight scenes, that Jean-Claude Van Damme doesn't need me at full attention to get what's going on.
It’s not about getting what’s going on, for that lots of movies don’t need my full attention either, it’s about experiencing what’s going on. So about the emotional connection, including negative ones like boredom, than the rational understanding.
Last edited by Lonewolf2003 on August 27th, 2020, 9:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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#14

Post by Lonewolf2003 » August 27th, 2020, 9:32 pm

Onderhond wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 9:21 pm
I am surprised (re: podcast) how bad (or uninterested) everyone is at planning. I always know how long a film will take, I'll actively plan to fill gaps where I can watch uninterrupted. I never still "have to go to the shop" halfway through.
:blink: I haven’t listened yet. But that surprises me too. I always check how long a movie is also. If only to get in the right mind set for how long it will be. And always plan that it will fit in my schedule or is done before bedtime.
Maybe it’s also just easier for me to do so living alone. I can easily go to the shop after a movie is over.

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#15

Post by Onderhond » August 27th, 2020, 9:48 pm

Lonewolf2003 wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 9:32 pm
:blink: I haven’t listened yet. But that surprises me too. I always check how long a movie is also. If only to get in the right mind set for how long it will be. And always plan that it will fit in my schedule or is done before bedtime.
Maybe it’s also just easier for me to do so living alone. I can easily go to the shop after a movie is over.
Dunno, I've been in a relationship for 14 years and manage fine (and yes, I do most of the shopping, so it's not like someone else is doing it for me).
I'm quite methodical in general though, so I guess it just comes natural to me.

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#16

Post by maxwelldeux » August 27th, 2020, 9:56 pm

Lonewolf2003 wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 9:24 pm
maxwelldeux wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 8:32 pm
burneyfan wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 7:29 pm
If I had to be an ultra-purist with the amount of other "life stuff" I have to do, I'd only get to watch maybe 1-2 films a week. I eat, drink, and pause -- I'm frequently interrupted by family or work, so watching a film without a single pause is a rare luxury. I virtually never let a film sit half-watched for more than 24 hours (usually it's more like 2-3 hours, tops). I do sometimes separate episodes of miniseries (and often TV series) by several days, though.
This. I mean, it took me over 2 hours to get through an 88-minute film last night. The dogs need out. The dogs need in. The dogs need fed. My beer is empty. I have to pee. Wife has a question about something. It's not always like that, but it's common. Life happens.

I'm also pro- watching films on phones. Not all films, certainly, but a lot of them. Most documentaries. Stand-up comedy. Most less-good films. Films without stunning visuals. This is a great way to pass the time on planes - back when I was traveling for work, it was a 6-hour flight each way, so I'd download 4-5 films on my phone that I knew I could watch and enjoy while sitting uncomfortably trapped in a seat.

I'm also guilty of browsing on my phone, though usually this is to enhance my film experience. I like to read the IMDB trivia of what I'm watching, as that often helps me appreciate the film more. And after a while, if the film doesn't pull me in or require 100% of my attention, I'm on my phone. Sorry, but between fight scenes, that Jean-Claude Van Damme doesn't need me at full attention to get what's going on.
It’s not about getting what’s going on, for that lots of movies don’t need my full attention either, it’s about experiencing what’s going on. So about the emotional connection, including negative ones like boredom, than the rational understanding.
Well yeah. But when the emotional experience/connection doesn't happen, or doesn't happen in the intended way, or is actively off-putting, I'm kinda out. I'd rather futz around on my phone and pay half attention, as I still might get something out of the film. The other alternative is turning the film off.

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#17

Post by mightysparks » August 28th, 2020, 12:23 am

Lonewolf2003 wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 9:32 pm
Onderhond wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 9:21 pm
I am surprised (re: podcast) how bad (or uninterested) everyone is at planning. I always know how long a film will take, I'll actively plan to fill gaps where I can watch uninterrupted. I never still "have to go to the shop" halfway through.
:blink: I haven’t listened yet. But that surprises me too. I always check how long a movie is also. If only to get in the right mind set for how long it will be. And always plan that it will fit in my schedule or is done before bedtime.
Maybe it’s also just easier for me to do so living alone. I can easily go to the shop after a movie is over.
I always check how long a film is, but I don’t know what’s going to happen while watching a film. I get interrupted by my boyfriend or I get hungry or I have to go to the toilet (I generally don’t need to pee, then I suddenly need to) or I just get too tired. Sometimes I have work in the evening and i plan for a film to finish 10-15 mins before I have to leave and interruptions mean I don’t quite make it. I never have to suddenly go to the shops or anything.

Obviously I’ve already spoken on the podcast but for me
- I will not watch a film on a phone (I have a tiny phone for my tiny hands, it would be utterly pointless)
- I’m happy to eat and drink as I don’t find those things distracting
- I will sometimes walk in place in front of the TV to get my steps
- I will glance at my phone if I get an alert but then right back to the film
- I will pause for toilet/snack/boyfriend/mental breaks—if my immersion has already been lost because of a bodily or external interruption then pausing it won’t break it more and actually will refresh me so I can get straight back into it
- if I don’t have time or find myself losing interest or am tired Or the film is too long I don’t mind breaking it up into multiple viewings. I prefer not to, but not a problem
- I sped up one film—the last 10-15 mins of one of the Jacques Tati films because it was too painful.
- my tv only allows me to rewind in 3-5 minute increments so I never rewind.
- I have watched dubbed animated films when I was younger but I don’t anymore, I have watched films with google translated films but never again
- I have watched films with Adam and Skype Crew in the past while typing about the film

Generally I like to give a film my full attention as much as possible. But my Definition of purism isn’t quite so extreme, as long as you’re focusing on the film the rest of the stuff doesn’t really matter (except for speeding it up, unless it’s a Tati film :P ).
"I do not always know what I want, but I do know what I don't want." - Stanley Kubrick

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#18

Post by Onderhond » August 28th, 2020, 5:24 am

A fun podcast, I think the only (obvious) question lacking is whether everyone always finishes a film, and if not, how much % is needed to make it a check/give it a rating. That's something that often comes up in discussions (not necessarily on ICM, but in general).

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#19

Post by mightysparks » August 28th, 2020, 5:52 am

I always finish a film and have to watch the whole thing before checking/rating it. I treat TV series a little differently--I like to watch at least a season--though I'll often wait until completing it before checking it.
"I do not always know what I want, but I do know what I don't want." - Stanley Kubrick

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#20

Post by AdamH » August 28th, 2020, 9:11 am

Onderhond wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 5:24 am
A fun podcast, I think the only (obvious) question lacking is whether everyone always finishes a film, and if not, how much % is needed to make it a check/give it a rating. That's something that often comes up in discussions (not necessarily on ICM, but in general).
I always finish a film. Well, there must be some exceptions over the years if I've absolutely hated something but, even then, I generally still finish. I would only check/rate a film if I watched it all.

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#21

Post by Onderhond » August 28th, 2020, 9:20 am

On that topic, I always finish a film too (and in one go - if I'd pause in between I'd have too much difficulty getting back to it - which is also why I watch few series).

That said, it's something I attribute to my own character (a light form OCD no doubt) and I respect people who don't, not in the least because none of the potential candidates for cutting it short never got better for me. It's like the Satantango/cow example given in the podcast ... at what point will you decide that something simply doesn't add any value to your life (and assign a rating/check to that). I've seen my fair share of films I didn't like at all, personally I find worth in finishing them anyway, but it's definitely not something I expect everyone to do.

This is usually a discussion that pops up when fans of a certain film try to invalidate the opinion of someone who didn't like it of course.

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#22

Post by St. Gloede » August 28th, 2020, 9:54 am

I would never check or rate a film if I had not seen the complete version, and that includes coming late to the theatre. You haven't seen it unless you have seen all of it IMO - I guess being on ICM so long just made this so "obvious" to all the hosts that they never even considered it. :D

There are also extremely few cases I do not finish a film. The only exception is if I get something specifically for my wife, and she ends up not liking it and we turn it off. There are some films here I just didn't care to go back to, like Salmon Fishing in Yemen ... Though I may just watch the remaining 70+ mins at some point, who knows.

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#23

Post by Onderhond » August 28th, 2020, 10:04 am

I think an interesting nuance in all of these questions is "how far do you take it yourself" vs "what do you find acceptable for others". I mean, it's one thing to be a film purist yourself, it's quite something else to expect others to stick to the same rules (and I don't mean casual film watchers, but peers).

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#24

Post by Lonewolf2003 » August 28th, 2020, 10:20 am

mightysparks wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 12:23 am
Lonewolf2003 wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 9:32 pm
Onderhond wrote:
August 27th, 2020, 9:21 pm
I am surprised (re: podcast) how bad (or uninterested) everyone is at planning. I always know how long a film will take, I'll actively plan to fill gaps where I can watch uninterrupted. I never still "have to go to the shop" halfway through.
:blink: I haven’t listened yet. But that surprises me too. I always check how long a movie is also. If only to get in the right mind set for how long it will be. And always plan that it will fit in my schedule or is done before bedtime.
Maybe it’s also just easier for me to do so living alone. I can easily go to the shop after a movie is over.
I always check how long a film is, but I don’t know what’s going to happen while watching a film. I get interrupted by my boyfriend or I get hungry or I have to go to the toilet (I generally don’t need to pee, then I suddenly need to) or I just get too tired. Sometimes I have work in the evening and i plan for a film to finish 10-15 mins before I have to leave and interruptions mean I don’t quite make it. I never have to suddenly go to the shops or anything.
I wasn't talking about the kind of unplannable breaks that can happen, like being interrupted by spouses, phone calls, having to use the bathroom etc.. I meant the kind of daily task and chores one can easily plan a movie around, like shopping, cooking, walking the dog etc.. Also there is a differnce in having a really busy life, planning all those tasks and knowing you only have a set amount of time between tasks to watch only a part of a movie and not planning at all, starting a movie and discovering suddenly you still have to shop, cook etc..
It of course also happens to me some times that I'm not able to finish a movie before I have to leave, cause it took me longer than planned cause of interruptions.
Obviously I’ve already spoken on the podcast but for me
- I will not watch a film on a phone (I have a tiny phone for my tiny hands, it would be utterly pointless)
- I’m happy to eat and drink as I don’t find those things distracting
- I will sometimes walk in place in front of the TV to get my steps
- I will glance at my phone if I get an alert but then right back to the film
- I will pause for toilet/snack/boyfriend/mental breaks—if my immersion has already been lost because of a bodily or external interruption then pausing it won’t break it more and actually will refresh me so I can get straight back into it
- if I don’t have time or find myself losing interest or am tired Or the film is too long I don’t mind breaking it up into multiple viewings. I prefer not to, but not a problem
- I sped up one film—the last 10-15 mins of one of the Jacques Tati films because it was too painful.
- my tv only allows me to rewind in 3-5 minute increments so I never rewind.
- I have watched dubbed animated films when I was younger but I don’t anymore, I have watched films with google translated films but never again
- I have watched films with Adam and Skype Crew in the past while typing about the film

Generally I like to give a film my full attention as much as possible. But my Definition of purism isn’t quite so extreme, as long as you’re focusing on the film the rest of the stuff doesn’t really matter (except for speeding it up, unless it’s a Tati film :P ).
I think we generally the same definition and attitude towards film.

On not-finishing movies: I always try to finish a movie, even if don't like it. It happened also too many times that I don't like a movie at the start, but it gets better along the way. So I learned to not judge a movie too quickly. have only not finished a handful of movies in my life, most of them were walkouts in festivals like Film socialisme. I did check them :unsure: :$ , cause I feel I did see enough and was able to judge the movie really wasn't for me.

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#25

Post by flavo5000 » August 28th, 2020, 1:21 pm

So I'm definitely not what one would call a "purist", probably falling closer to max on the spectrum. It depends wildly on the movie though.
-Watching on phones? Like max said, for things like stand-up specials, talking head docs, etc. with little to no visual aesthetic, I have no issue watching it on a phone. I mean, I don't just watch things on a phone for giggles though. It's usually while traveling, that kind of thing.
-Eat and drinking? Sure why not.
-I've been known to exercise while watching TV sometimes (the 30 minute episodes make for a good start-and-stop point) but I've never really tried to watch a movie while doing so.
-I've been know to browse the internet or check e-mail if it's a junk movie or if the movie is incredibly slow-paced (like anything by James Benning for instance). For something with subtitles though that requires more focus or for silent films, that's a no.
-I pause movies quite a bit, but again it depends on the movie. There are movies I identify that I want to give my full attention for whatever reason and others that it doesn't matter a whole lot. I work at home for my job and will occasionally need to pause a movie I'm watching to take a conference call and start it back up when it's over. Usually the movies I choose to watch during this time are things like A*P*E that doesn't matter while I reserve movies like Bresson's The Devil Probably for the evening when I can focus more on it.
-I think I sped up a couple of Warhol films like Empire and Eat (and honestly you'd be insane not to) but that's something I really can't see doing for most movies, even junk ones. There are a couple of podcasts I do speed up to like 1.1 or 1.2x that are more informational in nature.
-I prefer subs over dubs but will watch a dub if that's all that's available or if it is something I want to watch with my wife who has bad vision and can't read subs well. I attempted to watch a movie on youtube with the Auto-translate subtitles on and it was so horrible and unintelligible I had to stop it after like five minutes.
-I pretty much always finish movies I start unless there's an technical issue of some kind. If something like that does happen, it'll drive me crazy until I do fix it and finish it.
but like I said, all of this depends wildly on the movie and my interest level in it.

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#26

Post by Onderhond » August 28th, 2020, 1:31 pm

flavo5000 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:21 pm
-I prefer subs over dubs but will watch a dub if that's all that's available or if it is something I want to watch with my wife who has bad vision and can't read subs well. I attempted to watch a movie on youtube with the Auto-translate subtitles on and it was so horrible and unintelligible I had to stop it after like five minutes.
That's another interesting one. Non-native dubs are a no-go for me, even when there's nothing else available (which is why I'm still one film down on the martial arts list).

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#27

Post by flavo5000 » August 28th, 2020, 1:37 pm

Onderhond wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:31 pm
flavo5000 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:21 pm
-I prefer subs over dubs but will watch a dub if that's all that's available or if it is something I want to watch with my wife who has bad vision and can't read subs well. I attempted to watch a movie on youtube with the Auto-translate subtitles on and it was so horrible and unintelligible I had to stop it after like five minutes.
That's another interesting one. Non-native dubs are a no-go for me, even when there's nothing else available (which is why I'm still one film down on the martial arts list).
Sometimes that can be tricky though, particularly with stuff like many Italian films where there is no such thing as a native soundtrack since so many of them are completely overdubbed and include actors from multiple countries speaking different languages to each other on-set.

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#28

Post by shugs » August 28th, 2020, 1:44 pm

I'm not an extreme purist, but:
  • I enjoy my movies in complete silence. I can't stand people that talk during movies, it's the main reason I've stopped going to the cinema.
  • I don't really like eating during a movie, but we're usually watching a comedy TV show while having lunch.
  • I try to schedule my views so that I can watch them in one go. I don't have a problem pausing a movie late at night, if I'm too tired, and resuming in the next day, but if I've seen only like 30 minutes or something, I'll just view it from the beginning at a later date.
  • I try to watch a movie fully, with some rare exceptions. I'll only check something if I've seen all of it.
  • I don't speed up videos, nor do I check my phone or do anything else while watching.
  • I usually watch movies on my TV, but sometimes, if the TV is in use by someone else, or if the movie does not have subtitles (or older Romanian movies with their shitty sound mixing :lol: ) and I need to use headphones, I'll watch on my laptop.

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#29

Post by Onderhond » August 28th, 2020, 1:47 pm

flavo5000 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:37 pm
Sometimes that can be tricky though, particularly with stuff like many Italian films where there is no such thing as a native soundtrack since so many of them are completely overdubbed and include actors from multiple countries speaking different languages to each other on-set.
Yeah, there's always going to be a grey area with these things. If I remember correctly Novecento was such a film? I mean, if a director made it impossible then it doesn't matter too much, but that's miles away from watching martial arts/anime films with a US dub. Or, something I've been running it quite recently, Russian genre films with US dubs.

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#30

Post by OldAle1 » August 28th, 2020, 1:49 pm

flavo5000 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:37 pm
Onderhond wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:31 pm
flavo5000 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:21 pm
-I prefer subs over dubs but will watch a dub if that's all that's available or if it is something I want to watch with my wife who has bad vision and can't read subs well. I attempted to watch a movie on youtube with the Auto-translate subtitles on and it was so horrible and unintelligible I had to stop it after like five minutes.
That's another interesting one. Non-native dubs are a no-go for me, even when there's nothing else available (which is why I'm still one film down on the martial arts list).
Sometimes that can be tricky though, particularly with stuff like many Italian films where there is no such thing as a native soundtrack since so many of them are completely overdubbed and include actors from multiple countries speaking different languages to each other on-set.
Yep and not just Italy - a very large percentage of genre films from France, Spain, and Germany as well in the 60s-70s in particular. Probably some other countries - I think maybe some Greek films fall into this category, others may know better. And when you've got international casts who don't all speak the same languages - there just isn't going to be any "perfect" dialogue track on most of these films, ever. I've given up caring too much - when I'm looking at watching a spaghetti western or whatever, I usually just go with whatever seems the most complete version and/or is the best quality, regardless of language - as long as it's not Russian or Hindi or something :lol: Pretty sure almost all of the Italian westerns I watched for the challenge this year were English dubs for example, and in at least one case there were two dubs on the file and the English one just had vastly better sound overall so that was an easy choice.

But I think the HK/China situation which is what Onderhond is obviously more interested in is a bit different - my understanding is that most older HK films in particular were shot silent and had both Mandarin and Cantonese tracks made at the time, but unlike in Italy they usually had the original actors do the dubbing (if possible). And I think they often made Japanese and English dubs at the same time also but those are of course not "authentic" in precisely the same way.

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#31

Post by flavo5000 » August 28th, 2020, 2:46 pm

OldAle1 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:49 pm
flavo5000 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:37 pm
Onderhond wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:31 pm

That's another interesting one. Non-native dubs are a no-go for me, even when there's nothing else available (which is why I'm still one film down on the martial arts list).
Sometimes that can be tricky though, particularly with stuff like many Italian films where there is no such thing as a native soundtrack since so many of them are completely overdubbed and include actors from multiple countries speaking different languages to each other on-set.
Yep and not just Italy - a very large percentage of genre films from France, Spain, and Germany as well in the 60s-70s in particular. Probably some other countries - I think maybe some Greek films fall into this category, others may know better. And when you've got international casts who don't all speak the same languages - there just isn't going to be any "perfect" dialogue track on most of these films, ever. I've given up caring too much - when I'm looking at watching a spaghetti western or whatever, I usually just go with whatever seems the most complete version and/or is the best quality, regardless of language - as long as it's not Russian or Hindi or something :lol: Pretty sure almost all of the Italian westerns I watched for the challenge this year were English dubs for example, and in at least one case there were two dubs on the file and the English one just had vastly better sound overall so that was an easy choice.

But I think the HK/China situation which is what Onderhond is obviously more interested in is a bit different - my understanding is that most older HK films in particular were shot silent and had both Mandarin and Cantonese tracks made at the time, but unlike in Italy they usually had the original actors do the dubbing (if possible). And I think they often made Japanese and English dubs at the same time also but those are of course not "authentic" in precisely the same way.
There are even a handful of very rare instances where I actually preferred the English dub to the original like with the anime Baccano! which takes place in America in Chicago and New york in the 1930s. The english version actually uses era and location-appropriate accents for the various characters while seeing all these very obviously American characters speaking Japanese felt very off. The anime BECK is another one primarily just because I liked the American singer better than the Japanese one in the band. But like I said, these instances are very rare.

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#32

Post by maxwelldeux » August 28th, 2020, 5:18 pm

flavo5000 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:21 pm
So I'm definitely not what one would call a "purist", probably falling closer to max on the spectrum. It depends wildly on the movie though.
-Watching on phones? Like max said, for things like stand-up specials, talking head docs, etc. with little to no visual aesthetic, I have no issue watching it on a phone. I mean, I don't just watch things on a phone for giggles though. It's usually while traveling, that kind of thing.
So, I watched two films last night on my phone because I wanted to sit outside and my wife was using the laptop. Both docs. Phone was at arms length away from my face. It was totally fine.

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#33

Post by OldAle1 » August 28th, 2020, 5:20 pm

You guys are like aliens.

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#34

Post by maxwelldeux » August 28th, 2020, 5:32 pm

OldAle1 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 5:20 pm
You guys are like aliens.
Sriracha doesn't get tastier on a 60-inch screen. :P

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#35

Post by sebby » August 28th, 2020, 10:06 pm

flavo5000 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 2:46 pm
OldAle1 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:49 pm
flavo5000 wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 1:37 pm


Sometimes that can be tricky though, particularly with stuff like many Italian films where there is no such thing as a native soundtrack since so many of them are completely overdubbed and include actors from multiple countries speaking different languages to each other on-set.
Yep and not just Italy - a very large percentage of genre films from France, Spain, and Germany as well in the 60s-70s in particular. Probably some other countries - I think maybe some Greek films fall into this category, others may know better. And when you've got international casts who don't all speak the same languages - there just isn't going to be any "perfect" dialogue track on most of these films, ever. I've given up caring too much - when I'm looking at watching a spaghetti western or whatever, I usually just go with whatever seems the most complete version and/or is the best quality, regardless of language - as long as it's not Russian or Hindi or something :lol: Pretty sure almost all of the Italian westerns I watched for the challenge this year were English dubs for example, and in at least one case there were two dubs on the file and the English one just had vastly better sound overall so that was an easy choice.

But I think the HK/China situation which is what Onderhond is obviously more interested in is a bit different - my understanding is that most older HK films in particular were shot silent and had both Mandarin and Cantonese tracks made at the time, but unlike in Italy they usually had the original actors do the dubbing (if possible). And I think they often made Japanese and English dubs at the same time also but those are of course not "authentic" in precisely the same way.
There are even a handful of very rare instances where I actually preferred the English dub to the original like with the anime Baccano! which takes place in America in Chicago and New york in the 1930s. The english version actually uses era and location-appropriate accents for the various characters while seeing all these very obviously American characters speaking Japanese felt very off. The anime BECK is another one primarily just because I liked the American singer better than the Japanese one in the band. But like I said, these instances are very rare.
Well shit I was planning on watching Baccano! for the animation challenge and now you've presented me with a conundrum.

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#36

Post by sebby » August 29th, 2020, 5:35 am

Also, surprised to see so many people will watch a film through to the end even if they aren't enjoying it. If I'm half way into a 2.5 hour movie and it is letting me down like a Texas father's football-hating male offspring, I give up. I usually go to the halfway mark and if it's still pain at the point, I end it. I try to consider the opportunity cost. If I spend the next hour+ finishing a shit film, it's one less movie I get to watch in my life as a result. The math isn't exactly perfect, but you get the point. I toss the crap and put on something new to fill the remaining time I've allotted myself to watch a movie. I do the same thing with books.

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#37

Post by flavo5000 » August 29th, 2020, 1:31 pm

sebby wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 5:35 am
Also, surprised to see so many people will watch a film through to the end even if they aren't enjoying it. If I'm half way into a 2.5 hour movie and it is letting me down like a Texas father's football-hating male offspring, I give up. I usually go to the halfway mark and if it's still pain at the point, I end it. I try to consider the opportunity cost. If I spend the next hour+ finishing a shit film, it's one less movie I get to watch in my life as a result. The math isn't exactly perfect, but you get the point. I toss the crap and put on something new to fill the remaining time I've allotted myself to watch a movie. I do the same thing with books.
Oh, books I'm way more likely to drop than movies since they will take MUCH longer to finish. I'm also fairly easy to please, so most films I watch I can usually find something of interest in.

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#38

Post by Lonewolf2003 » August 29th, 2020, 1:40 pm

flavo5000 wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 1:31 pm
sebby wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 5:35 am
Also, surprised to see so many people will watch a film through to the end even if they aren't enjoying it. If I'm half way into a 2.5 hour movie and it is letting me down like a Texas father's football-hating male offspring, I give up. I usually go to the halfway mark and if it's still pain at the point, I end it. I try to consider the opportunity cost. If I spend the next hour+ finishing a shit film, it's one less movie I get to watch in my life as a result. The math isn't exactly perfect, but you get the point. I toss the crap and put on something new to fill the remaining time I've allotted myself to watch a movie. I do the same thing with books.
Oh, books I'm way more likely to drop than movies since they will take MUCH longer to finish. I'm also fairly easy to please, so most films I watch I can usually find something of interest in.
This goes for me exactly also. Books I don't like I put away, cause they take up much more time over a longer period. And the amount of movies I dislike so much I even consider not finishing are very little. I too most always find some pros to a movie to keep watching.

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#39

Post by 3eyes » August 29th, 2020, 3:38 pm

Being one of the few on this board who was born before the advent of home video, I had always watched movies in theaters and never left before the end unless my parents made me. In those days nobody was purist about beginning at the beginning, though. If you arrived halfway through you stayed until it came round again (after other stuff including maybe another feature) and left when it got to where you came in, or not. You could stay and watch the whole thing twice if you wanted. And, of course, with popcorn.

These days I mostly watch on a largish flatscreen TV (don't have cable) and feel free to turn it off if a) I don't like it or am not engaged, b) need time to process what I've seen so far, c) feel like leaving the rest for another day, d) subtitles missing or inadequate, e) sundry interruptions as cited by others. Back when I was still doing official checks I would watch something to the end in however many pieces, not check it if I didn't. But I did/do feel free to turn off the sound in noisy movies like actioners & martial arts (I don't find the dialogue in such things particularly edifying in any case), or if for some other reason (e.g. intrusive schlocky music) I prefer to just to read the subtitles.

Only watch stuff on laptop if it's short and/or otherwise not available to watch on my TV (such as things I on my external hard drive culled from the Weighty Place).
:run: STILL the Gaffer!

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#40

Post by burneyfan » August 29th, 2020, 4:28 pm

3eyes wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 3:38 pm
In those days nobody was purist about beginning at the beginning, though. If you arrived halfway through you stayed until it came round again (after other stuff including maybe another feature) and left when it got to where you came in, or not. You could stay and watch the whole thing twice if you wanted. And, of course, with popcorn.
This is how I watched a LOT of theater movies in my childhood (I have very distinct memories of many films this way -- the most famous is probably Raiders of the Lost Ark). If my father (born in the mid-'30s) was in charge of going to the movies, we'd get there about 45 minutes into the actual film, watch to the end, sit in the mostly-empty theater while the ushers cleaned up the aisles, and then watch the film's beginning up to the point when we'd initially arrived. It drove my mother (who is quite a bit younger than my dad) crazy, but my father was always astonished she was bothered. "What? You're seeing the whole movie, aren't you!?" :rolleyes:

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