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The Decline of Film Forums: What Caused It?

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Re: The Decline of Film Forums: What Caused It?

#41

Post by St. Gloede » August 6th, 2020, 8:35 am

List Promoter wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 8:10 am
ignorant norwegian users who think they know more than critics.
As a Norwegian I can vouch for this, and it is very odd we live with such delusions considering that we are the worst film country in the world.

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#42

Post by AdamH » August 6th, 2020, 8:42 am

List Promoter wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 8:10 am
ignorant norwegian users who think they know more than critics.
Every member on here posts all their views under one account so we will no longer tolerate you having your original account for 'normal' posts and your List Promoter account for 'trolling' posts.

You have two options:
1) Do not post under List Promoter again and only post under your original account from now on. If you do this then we will leave your existing List Promoter posts intact under the List Promoter username.
2) Post again under the List Promoter username and we will merge the account with your original one and all your posts from both accounts will show up under your original username (and, yes, we know what your original username is).

I think this is very reasonable as we have tolerated you having two accounts for too long now. Any issues with this then please feel free to PM me.

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#43

Post by xianjiro » August 6th, 2020, 9:49 am

cinewest wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 6:56 am
xianjiro wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 5:33 am
An aside: one day I was talking about opera with someone who really, really loves it as an art form. Can't say I do, but I try to appreciate it. Anyway, he played the same aria sung by two different, though both pretty well-known, performers and asked for my reaction. Of course I felt like I had nothing meaningful to say, I mean, how could I? I knew virtually nothing about opera at that point other than the aphorism about the fat lady singing.

But the one thing I did notice is one performer seemed to vary her voice, she held something back, while the other just belted out the whole aria as if her life depending on being heard miles away. Turned out that was a good answer though I'm sure actual students of opera would have had a lot more important commentary.
This is an apt analogy if you are discussing the technical aspects of a film, but in general, film discussion tends to be more about film content (story, themes, execution, etc.) and viewer experience (was it interesting, and if so how, why, in what way?, etc), which anyone can speak about after seeing a film, provided they have the ability to reflect upon and articulate their experience.

That said, it is true that some films require more preparation- familiarity with the medium, a filmmaker, an approach to working with the medium- than others do, particularly those labeled as "art house, experimental, avante garde, etc., but that will come with time and further understanding as a viewer provided one's interest in film takes one in that direction.
Yeah, what do you think? how did it make you feel? These should be much more straight forward to answer. Heck, I remember those conversations about whatever was showing at the cinema with friends and none of us would have been part of this (iCM) club back in those days. We'd watch a movie together in the cinema and then go grab something to eat and talk about the film until we were talked out and moved on to another topic.

But even with those 'easy' questions, the bigger problem is the space/time thing. While there is a bit of 'discussion' on iCM surrounding the blockbusters when they play at the local cineplex, not sure how easy it is for someone just starting to explore cinema to comment on Sibiriada. Hell, I found writing something meaningful about FotW to be work and I'll cross 16000 checks this month.

I'll throw it out once again since we have new audience members - reading about films that people are talking about and you don't get can be useful, but I still found the extra features and some of the discussion tracks on the earlier (like first few hundred) Criterion Collection releases, especially when they included film historians or critics, much more insightful and educational. Such things for most blockbuster type films are totally useless unless you find someone funny - I mean, it can be funny to listen Parker/Stone on World Police, but you don't learn much about film making.

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#44

Post by sol » August 6th, 2020, 10:13 am

OldAle1 wrote:
August 5th, 2020, 3:12 pm
I miss the question & answer forum (was that what it was called?)
"I Need to Know"

By the way, I just finished listening to the episode on the way home from work today. Great conversation and discussion everyone.
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#45

Post by cinewest » August 6th, 2020, 11:04 am

xianjiro wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 9:49 am
cinewest wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 6:56 am
xianjiro wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 5:33 am
An aside: one day I was talking about opera with someone who really, really loves it as an art form. Can't say I do, but I try to appreciate it. Anyway, he played the same aria sung by two different, though both pretty well-known, performers and asked for my reaction. Of course I felt like I had nothing meaningful to say, I mean, how could I? I knew virtually nothing about opera at that point other than the aphorism about the fat lady singing.

But the one thing I did notice is one performer seemed to vary her voice, she held something back, while the other just belted out the whole aria as if her life depending on being heard miles away. Turned out that was a good answer though I'm sure actual students of opera would have had a lot more important commentary.
This is an apt analogy if you are discussing the technical aspects of a film, but in general, film discussion tends to be more about film content (story, themes, execution, etc.) and viewer experience (was it interesting, and if so how, why, in what way?, etc), which anyone can speak about after seeing a film, provided they have the ability to reflect upon and articulate their experience.

That said, it is true that some films require more preparation- familiarity with the medium, a filmmaker, an approach to working with the medium- than others do, particularly those labeled as "art house, experimental, avante garde, etc., but that will come with time and further understanding as a viewer provided one's interest in film takes one in that direction.
Yeah, what do you think? how did it make you feel? These should be much more straight forward to answer. Heck, I remember those conversations about whatever was showing at the cinema with friends and none of us would have been part of this (iCM) club back in those days. We'd watch a movie together in the cinema and then go grab something to eat and talk about the film until we were talked out and moved on to another topic.

But even with those 'easy' questions, the bigger problem is the space/time thing. While there is a bit of 'discussion' on iCM surrounding the blockbusters when they play at the local cineplex, not sure how easy it is for someone just starting to explore cinema to comment on Sibiriada. Hell, I found writing something meaningful about FotW to be work and I'll cross 16000 checks this month.

I'll throw it out once again since we have new audience members - reading about films that people are talking about and you don't get can be useful, but I still found the extra features and some of the discussion tracks on the earlier (like first few hundred) Criterion Collection releases, especially when they included film historians or critics, much more insightful and educational. Such things for most blockbuster type films are totally useless unless you find someone funny - I mean, it can be funny to listen Parker/Stone on World Police, but you don't learn much about film making.
I'm sure there is a generational thing going on that I just don't get (I just turned 60), but my main point has to do with a seeming lack of interest in much film discussion, here, and all of the suppositions put forth about why, some of which don't really make sense to me.

I grew up in a family that liked to discuss things (all the matters of the world and then some), usually over the dinner table. And there were a lot of strong opinions that I had to learn to contend with. Peer discussions and classroom discussions abounded as well, pretty much from high school on, and that was in large part how I not only tested my own ideas but modified and developed them.
Of course, one can get a lot out of reading certain critics, about film history, or from the variety of materials collected for Criterion releases, but I was responding to some of the things written in earlier posts as to some of the reasons why there isn't more discussion, and i was mostly trying to encourage folks to jump in and express themselves more. For me, that is more interesting and more community building than just making a statement with a list of favorites or scores.

Maybe it's just to scary (and potentially divisive) to meet up with and engage contrary opinions. Certainly, there is not much discussion to be had if people don't listen to or consider what others say. Personally, I think these are the biggest hurdles to negotiate on a film board, but if people establish a respectful relationship with others, differences of opinion and taste are no different than they are among family members or friends.

There are quite a few features in place that attempt to collect people around watching or considering the same films during a particular time (Film of the week, World Cup, the icm film festival, even some of the polls), and these events could easily become a topic of discussion. In fact, I have done my best to initiate such discussions, with very mixed results.
Last edited by cinewest on August 6th, 2020, 12:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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#46

Post by Onderhond » August 6th, 2020, 11:36 am

Just speaking for myself, but I feel full-on discussion was something I liked more in the past. While I like reading about people's experience and love expressing my own, after 20 years of frequenting film forums, I something feel I've gained pretty much all there is from discussions. I can entertain a back and forth about a particular film, but in the end it usually amounts to the same thing. Person X liked/hated that element which I hated/loved and there's nothing either of us can say that will change the other person's mind. Which is completely normal by the way.

In the very beginning it was a lot more exciting to explore these differences between people, but you gradually pick up on different taste profiles and after a while you don't really need a discussion anymore to figure out where exactly your taste differs from someone else.

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#47

Post by cinewest » August 6th, 2020, 11:51 am

Onderhond wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 11:36 am
Just speaking for myself, but I feel full-on discussion was something I liked more in the past. While I like reading about people's experience and love expressing my own, after 20 years of frequenting film forums, I something feel I've gained pretty much all there is from discussions. I can entertain a back and forth about a particular film, but in the end it usually amounts to the same thing. Person X liked/hated that element which I hated/loved and there's nothing either of us can say that will change the other person's mind. Which is completely normal by the way.

In the very beginning it was a lot more exciting to explore these differences between people, but you gradually pick up on different taste profiles and after a while you don't really need a discussion anymore to figure out where exactly your taste differs from someone else.
I hear what you’re saying, and have definitely experienced that,plenty, but I have also enjoyed hearing takes on things that prompt me to revisit my own, or at lest revisit the film in question. I think that film discussion is Probably most interesting when it circulates around a particular event, like those I mentioned, where people are considering a film at the same time, even some times watching it the first time within a few days of one another.

Don’t know about you, but my own taste has continued to change over the years, to the point that I may no longer really care for a film I once loved, or now love a film I once didn’t care for, and one of the things that can prompt reassessment is an interesting discussion

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#48

Post by Onderhond » August 6th, 2020, 12:14 pm

cinewest wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 11:51 am
Don’t know about you, but my own taste has continued to change over the years, to the point that I may no longer really care for a film I once loved, or now love a film I once didn’t care for, and one of the things that can prompt reassessment is an interesting discussion
My taste hasn't stayed the same in all these years, though I don't think the core of what draws me to films has changed all that much. And because I often look for different things in films, I don't think I've ever been able to trust other people's opinions enough to really revisit films based on discussions I've had. I'm also someone who prefers to look ahead rather than behind, so I keep my rewatched to a minimum (old favorites only).

I do still watch a broad variety of films though, so should I suddenly become enamoured with classic cinema, I'm sure I'll find out soon enough without having to revisit any classics I've already seen.

So no, discussions don't hold that power for me.

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#49

Post by St. Gloede » August 6th, 2020, 12:19 pm

Film discussion is one of the most interesting things with a film forum, and while I really want to see much, much more of it here, compared to many other places I have been we are doing quite well on that front. Diving deeper into films this way is also one of the reasons I started the podcast, and I'm really happy with some of the discussions we managed to do, especially on Comedies and Proverbs.

I would really recommend everyone with an opinion on any film, director, actor, movement, etc. to start a thread on it. You will get replies.

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#50

Post by peeptoad » August 6th, 2020, 12:22 pm

Onderhond wrote:
August 5th, 2020, 3:43 pm
Will listen to the podcast later tonight, but will react to this (because it's something that irked me for the past 8 years.
You do delve into that somewhat but it's a subject with a lot of complexity I think; the mention of the people who just give one-line reviews or comments in particular opens up a whole world of possible discussion for me.
In 2012, I wrote this article (back then I still blogged a lot about my work/the web.

Long story short, social platforms abuse the inherent laziness of people. Their UX is tailored to reduce communication to quantity, not quality. Why type out why you like something when you can just click a button? Why make wide comment areas when you can just make them small and have 1 normal sentence look like a paragraph?

All of this drives "interaction", which is an important metric for platforms and users alike. What this statistic hides is the quality and worth of the interaction. Social platforms are social in the sense that people connect to many others, but their interactions are extremely limited. Not like these oldskool forums, where you can type half a book and it still looks like you've only written half a paragraph. For too many, that's simply too daunting.

In UX terms, reducing effort and friction drives interaction, but lowers the quality of interaction. And people will fall for it, because they're lazy by nature.
This is spot on, Onderhond, and thank you for posting it. You articulate very nicely a point that I have had in my head for the last 10 years, but have not been able to get out of my head in an intelligible form. I have long said social media killed the internet forum, but have not been able to pinpoint precisely why (possibly because I do not and never have had a social media account on any of the platforms) . This is exactly it: we are communicating less and what is there is of poor overall quality. Unfortunately, this has been bleeding out into "reality" for the last decade or so and it's really causing a negative hit on humanity.

On a smaller scale the "topic driven" messageboard is a veritable dinosaur. There are still boards for more niche activities, but those do not (by nature of their more intense focus) do not have a broad audience or user base, which in and of itself makes for cumbersome or poorer quality conversation. And those type of boards are still dying a slow death...

I agree with OldAle and anyone else stating they miss the IMDB boards even despite the trolls. The "Need to Know" board was indeed the bomb. I once had an obscure question about a particular Bugs Bunny cartoon that got answered in about 3 minutes. I love this forum though. I have pretty much gotten over missing IMDB since the conversation (that I typically do not engage in fully, and that fully makes me part of the problem, I realize) and quality of this board are so high. And the monthly challenges and polls; those are really why i am here, tbh.

As for the podcast I will listed to it when I am able to. The topic I find quite interesting (ironically more so than I would be regarding a topic about a particular filmmaker, style, etc.). Time is just not on my side right now...

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#51

Post by Lammetje » August 6th, 2020, 4:50 pm

I joined the forum at a time when I watched a lot of films. When I say 'a lot', I mean a lot more than the average person. It turned out that some iCM die hards were watching significantly more than me though, and they had thousands of checks. Even so, it felt like I was catching up after a while - 500 to 1000 checks can be enough to have a decent basis, especially if you focus on the IMDb Top 250 and/or TSPDT lists.

After a couple of years my movie watching declined. I started to post less on here as a result. Although my monthly average has picked somewhat since then, it's not really the movie discussion that makes me feel drawn to the forum nowadays. The challenges aren't doing it for me either (with a few exceptions). Here's a list (unranked) of my favorite things about the forum:
  • The community. I've gotten to know a number of regulars, insofar that is possible through an internet forum. I'm a bit more careful about posting personal stuff than others (looking at you, Mighty tehe), but y'all know a thing or two about me too and this kind of creates a bond.
  • Big polls. The iCM 1001 Favorite Movies and iCM 500<400 countdowns are always interesting.
  • Memes and jokes. Some of these could actually be perceived as light trolling (such as mentioning a Hababam movie as a possible #1 in a poll), but I never seem to grow tired of them. :D
  • Lack of real trolls and spammers. The forum is pretty clean. I'm a mod on a different forum, which is much bigger (nothing movie-related, don't worry) but attracts way more spammers and abusive folks.
I suck at writing reviews by the way. In most cases I just don't have much to say about movies except "this actor/actress was good" or "I liked the story" or "it was kinda generic". So I have more or less given up on that and I'm fine with it.
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y'all
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#52

Post by AdamH » August 6th, 2020, 5:05 pm

Maybe you don't post much in terms of reviews (I haven't noticed), Lammetje, but you're definitely one of the best posters on here. :hug:

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#53

Post by joachimt » August 6th, 2020, 7:57 pm

I never get tired of your memes and jokes, Lammetje!
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#54

Post by Lammetje » August 6th, 2020, 8:13 pm

AdamH wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 5:05 pm
Maybe you don't post much in terms of reviews (I haven't noticed), Lammetje, but you're definitely one of the best posters on here. :hug:
Thanks man, that means a lot. (l)
joachimt wrote:
August 6th, 2020, 7:57 pm
I never get tired of your memes and jokes, Lammetje!
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OldAle1 wrote:stupid double post bullshit crap shit fuck
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PeacefulAnarchy wrote:Active topics is the devil. Please use the forums and subforums as intended and peruse all the topics nicely sorted by topic, not just the currently popular ones displayed in a jumbled mess.
maxwelldeux wrote:If you asked me to kill my wife and pets OR watch Minions, I'd check the runtime and inquire about sobriety requirements before providing an answer.
flaiky wrote::o :satstunned: :guns: :down: :facepalm: :yucky: :mw_confused: :pinch: :ph43r: :ermm: :sweat: :folded: tehe :cowbow: :think: :finger: :rip:
monty wrote:If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen. iCM ain't for sissies.
mightysparks wrote:ARGH. RARGH. RARGH. DIE.
Kowry wrote:Thanks, Art Garfunky.
Rich wrote:*runs*

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#55

Post by St. Gloede » August 6th, 2020, 8:50 pm

Just remember that the only way IMDb could stop Hababam Sinifi from being the greatest film of all time was to cheat!

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I rebeat: They cheated. They broke their own rules. They broke all the rules.

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And instead of making up with it by a standardised dance routine they removed the forums. :folded:

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#56

Post by AdamH » August 7th, 2020, 10:38 am

Ok, so it looks like we have a couple of potential ideas here.

1) A q & a thread where people ask questions about films, actors etc.
2) A thread for people new to cinema

Tied in to idea #2, I was thinking maybe a thread where people can practise posting reviews of films if they don't feel so confident about it. Or just a general review thread with the emphasis being that any review is fine, even a few sentences, just to get people into it rather than it only being long reviews by people who often post reviews. Not sure if it'll take off but it could work...

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#57

Post by St. Gloede » August 7th, 2020, 11:51 am

What is Last Movie Seen was turned into "Short reviews" and we create a subforum for reviews and discussion incentivizing people to share and start more topics?

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#58

Post by Onderhond » August 7th, 2020, 11:54 am

St. Gloede wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 11:51 am
What is Last Movie Seen was turned into "Short reviews" and we create a subforum for reviews and discussion incentivizing people to share and start more topics?
Sounds like a very good plan. Never really got that thread to be honest, it's way too generic for a film forum :)

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#59

Post by Lonewolf2003 » August 7th, 2020, 2:06 pm

pitchorneirda wrote:
August 5th, 2020, 7:36 pm
I've been reading this forum for over a year now and I don't interact much, partly because I'm shy, partly because I'm not confortable talking about movies (I'd like to, though), and partly because English still causes me troubles sometimes (I'm a French speaker).

I really enjoy reading you all and participating to the polls and especially the World Cup but I feel like I should share my impressions:

About forums in general, as said before, the mobile percentage of website traffic has risen from about 30% in 2015 to 50% today and the quality of interactions tends to diminish.

About ICMforum in particular, what might be difficult is that most of you seem to be like a family who have known each other for over a decade and it's intimidating. Also, almost everybody here has seen over 5,000 movies and even 10,000 (I hope to reach 2,000 by the end of the year) and you've just all reached a level where you're just a handful in the world to have seen a particular movie that you want to talk about. I just haven't reached the point (and don't know if I ever will) where I've seen the entire filmography of any significant director and be confident enough to talk about it like you do, or take any genre and have an assertive and valuable opinion on it.
I know I probably have confidence issues that don't apply to everybody who's new here and I should probably repeat that's it's a pleasure being here but you should be aware that there are not that many people that can keep up your pace "moviewise"
I want to back up like others have said, that yours and everyone’s reviews are more than welcome. It's always interesting to read what somebody thought about a movie.

I really want to recommend you to just start writing reviews. Because confidence comes with practice. Nobody woke up and became Rosenbaum overnight. I'm pretty sure that sol, St.Gloede, Onderhond, OldAle became the great review writers they are today by practice and perfecting their skills and didn't turn out such well written insighfull reviews from their very first try. I for sure look ashamed back to some I have written. You learn writing about movie by writing about movies. That's how you learn to think about why a movie was awesome to you, put those thoughts into words and find your own style in doing so. So i recommend to start writing reviews and you will see that in time you will get better and gain confidence. If you're not confident enough (yet) to publish them here, you can just write them for yourself as practice. But again I stretch that your opinion is more than welcome. (And I'm sure (almost) everyone thinks that way, we are a pretty nice friendly bunch of people.)

A second nature of the internet, which you will encounter when discussing about movies, is that there always is/are someone/people who will completely disagree with you. Don't let that put you off either. It's the nature of the game. Cause there always also are people who do agree with you.

I can understand that people having seen 5.000 or 10k movies can be daunting. But that's the nature of the internet. There is almost always someone who is even more specialized than you in a specific subject. That also still happens to me. F.e. I have seen a decent amount of samurai movies, but it can still be daunting than to encounter someone like monty who (seems to) have seen every samurai movie ever. So don't let the fact that there is always someone who have seen more of a specific director, genre, decade etc. diminish your confidence. Your opinion is still appreciated. Like mine is about samurai movies (at least I hope so).

Your English is very good. English isn't my native language either. While reading my post you might think I don't have troubles with English. But the truth is that I use Google Translate multiple times while writing this or reviews and use google to look up synonyms or meaning for words to get the right word for what I mean and use spell checker always. (One of the reasons I like to respond on this forum on my laptop instead of my phone or iPad is that it's easier to switch between windows to do those things.)

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#60

Post by Lonewolf2003 » August 7th, 2020, 2:32 pm

A more general response to this topic: (I haven't listened to the podcast yet). I totally agree that we could use more movie discussion here. Although I myself am also guilty of not participating in that enough for various reasons. Plus that what we need for his forum for that is a influx of quality users and not quantity. We need users to can contribute to those discussions or at least write reviews (in various topics.) The need for more users just so we have more users to I don't know... pump up the participants in polls, challenges, and such I don't see. Targeting specific groups like trough Letterboxd seems indeed the best way for this. (I'm pretty sure we at least don't need more users to keep this forum a float financially.)

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#61

Post by sol » August 7th, 2020, 2:45 pm

I have been thinking for quite a while of possibly terminating the "What Films Did You See Last Week" threads... and the discussion here makes me think that would be a wise move. The community here isn't really geared towards movie discussion, and the threads just mostly consist of peeptoad and myself replying to each other, and occasionally Onderhond or Lilarcor, since almost everybody likes to use that thread just to list what they have seen and not comment on everybody else's... which is why I myself as host had to introduce the new rule of not commenting on other people's viewings unless they comment on mine first. Just a total drain of energy to think about what to say to a simple list of titles with no elaboration from multiple users each week. And eh, I get the sense that a lot of folks here are not even aware of the weekly thread existing. I dunno. Rambling a bit now, but I have begun to wonder if the whole thing is pointless since I get into more active discussion on the individual challenge threads than on the weekly thread.
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#63

Post by mightysparks » August 7th, 2020, 3:20 pm

I like the weekly threads but I find its much harder to get discussion when everyone’s watching different things. It’s easier on the challenge threads since people are watching films that are somewhat related. I also found it very hard to participate as people are watching things I haven’t seen or thought about in 10-15 years and I just can’t contribute anything relevant.
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#64

Post by sol » August 7th, 2020, 3:35 pm

AdamH wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 3:15 pm
Don't stop them Sol :(
Well, I'm not going to stop them just yet... but they do quite often feel like more of a burden than something that I am excited about doing, and then (unless I missed something in skim reading) to read about people talking about no real opportunities to discuss what they have seen on the forum, no threads dedicated to that, it's just like shucks, what I am doing with my spare time? :ermm:
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#65

Post by Lonewolf2003 » August 7th, 2020, 3:45 pm

sol wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 3:35 pm
AdamH wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 3:15 pm
Don't stop them Sol :(
Well, I'm not going to stop them just yet... but they do quite often feel like more of a burden than something that I am excited about doing, and then (unless I missed something in skim reading) to read about people talking about no real opportunities to discuss what they have seen on the forum, no threads dedicated to that, it's just like shucks, what I am doing with my spare time? :ermm:
I get what you mean. But I think it's nice there is at least some place on this forum where discussions do still happen. Tho I don't contribute much myself honestly, cause various reasons among those which mighty mentioned. I do hope you will continue them. Or in some other form, so you don't have to spent time starting a thread every week.

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#66

Post by xianjiro » August 7th, 2020, 5:27 pm

Onderhond wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 11:54 am
St. Gloede wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 11:51 am
What is Last Movie Seen was turned into "Short reviews" and we create a subforum for reviews and discussion incentivizing people to share and start more topics?
Sounds like a very good plan. Never really got that thread to be honest, it's way too generic for a film forum :)
well, and if someone's watching 2, 3, or more films a day :whistling: I'll also add that it always felt rather redundant to me since there are the comments and recent activity on iCM, so I've never thought it very interesting

BTW, when I suggested a 'new to cinema' thread, I was thinking less about reviews and more a safe, supportive place where people can ask questions -- I'm trying to think of a good example, maybe "Why is everything else in black & white and only the balloon red in The Red Balloon? To those who've been around cinema and art, this may seem pretty obvious, but maybe not to someone who has only been exposed to blockbusters and such. Maybe another example would be "What's continuity?"

Granted, both can be easily researched online, but that lacks the interaction that we have here and I don't mean that such a question has to be limited to such a space, just that as a community we'll keep that space helpful and encouraging and quickly shut down trollish responses

There is some value in a place to ask questions without feeling stupid about not understanding. And while we might like to think the entire forum is like that, I'll put it this way: once upon a time (years ago) I asked a question about something related to a certain TV series no longer being made available on disc, got a pretty snarky response, and never went back into that thread.

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#67

Post by xianjiro » August 7th, 2020, 5:40 pm

mightysparks wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 3:20 pm
I like the weekly threads but I find its much harder to get discussion when everyone’s watching different things. It’s easier on the challenge threads since people are watching films that are somewhat related. I also found it very hard to participate as people are watching things I haven’t seen or thought about in 10-15 years and I just can’t contribute anything relevant.
well, and there's always the issue of those of us who don't want to read about it BEFORE seeing it: that's the main reason I haven't been active in discussing the iCMFF movies even though I've been pretty active in watching them (all last year)

So even for something like iCMFF, rather than threads for slates, giving each movie it's own topic might help. I seem to remember I'm not the only person who prefers not to read about a movie before watching it though it seems those of us who feel this way are in the minority.

But as for reviews/discussion on the forum, if we are going to create topics for each and every movie someone wants to talk about, it's going to need some sort of organisation and then there's always the problem of which name (original language, English title, etc) to organize by.

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#68

Post by Onderhond » August 7th, 2020, 5:41 pm

sol wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 3:35 pm
AdamH wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 3:15 pm
Don't stop them Sol :(
Well, I'm not going to stop them just yet... but they do quite often feel like more of a burden than something that I am excited about doing, and then (unless I missed something in skim reading) to read about people talking about no real opportunities to discuss what they have seen on the forum, no threads dedicated to that, it's just like shucks, what I am doing with my spare time? :ermm:
I'm pretty much with mighty on this, discussion there isn't easy because few people are watching the same films at the same time. It's not that I've seen nothing of other people's lists, but usually it's been so long ago that I remember very little specifics of the films. Which is why my responses are usually quite short.

A more personal problem is that I try not to be too negative about other people's watches, but because there's only a small overlap with most of the members here, that makes it harder to really delve into films that are brought up. Maybe I should be more selective and just cherrypick films I specifically want to talk about rather than give a broader but more limited recap of the shared films.

I do like the weekly thread though, It really gives a better insight in people's taste, more so than any other thread I've seen on the forum. Would be a shame to see it go, on the other hand it's sol's time that goes into the preparation, so if he feels the ROI isn't big enough then I understand completely.

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#69

Post by Onderhond » August 7th, 2020, 5:45 pm

xianjiro wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 5:40 pm
But as for reviews/discussion on the forum, if we are going to create topics for each and every movie someone wants to talk about, it's going to need some sort of organisation and then there's always the problem of which name (original language, English title, etc) to organize by.
I don't think that'll ever work, the forum search simply isn't good enough. It works well on film database sites (like IMDb, Letterboxd, MovieMeter) because the discussions there are directly tied to a film and people go there anyway because they want to log/rate/whatever. No way you're going to find a movie through the forum search and quite frankly I'm not sure the ICMf active userbase is big enough or focused enough to keep momentum in these threads.

We've had several separate movie threads before. They quickly die and fade away, never to be seen again.

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#70

Post by xianjiro » August 7th, 2020, 5:52 pm

Onderhond wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 5:41 pm
Maybe I should be more selective and just cherrypick films I specifically want to talk about rather than give a broader but more limited recap of the shared films.
I absolutely do this and starting doing it intentionally on IMDb many years ago. The few reviews I've written have been for things with little or no comments by other users. I generally apply the same principle here and on iCM though on iCM I do try to remember to read the comments and use the up/down vote feature to support the feelings I agree with.

Review writing is work. I also really dislike how many internet reviews are only about tearing things apart: they have the aura of one trying to make oneself look smart by showing how stupid someone else is. Not saying that's an issue here (and it's certainly different than film discussion), it's just what colors my approach to reviews.

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#71

Post by xianjiro » August 7th, 2020, 5:54 pm

Onderhond wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 5:45 pm
xianjiro wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 5:40 pm
But as for reviews/discussion on the forum, if we are going to create topics for each and every movie someone wants to talk about, it's going to need some sort of organisation and then there's always the problem of which name (original language, English title, etc) to organize by.
I don't think that'll ever work, the forum search simply isn't good enough. It works well on film database sites (like IMDb, Letterboxd, MovieMeter) because the discussions there are directly tied to a film and people go there anyway because they want to log/rate/whatever. No way you're going to find a movie through the forum search and quite frankly I'm not sure the ICMf active userbase is big enough or focused enough to keep momentum in these threads.

We've had several separate movie threads before. They quickly die and fade away, never to be seen again.
yeah, agreed

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#72

Post by mightysparks » August 7th, 2020, 6:01 pm

xianjiro wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 5:40 pm
mightysparks wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 3:20 pm
I like the weekly threads but I find its much harder to get discussion when everyone’s watching different things. It’s easier on the challenge threads since people are watching films that are somewhat related. I also found it very hard to participate as people are watching things I haven’t seen or thought about in 10-15 years and I just can’t contribute anything relevant.
well, and there's always the issue of those of us who don't want to read about it BEFORE seeing it: that's the main reason I haven't been active in discussing the iCMFF movies even though I've been pretty active in watching them (all last year)

So even for something like iCMFF, rather than threads for slates, giving each movie it's own topic might help. I seem to remember I'm not the only person who prefers not to read about a movie before watching it though it seems those of us who feel this way are in the minority.
Yeah I don’t like reading reviews before watching films. I tend to skim them for words that may appeal to me so I can find interesting films I haven’t heard of but I purposefully try to take in as little info as possible to reduce bias. I do go back sometimes to read them fully but then time has passed and there doesn’t seem to be a good reason to reignite discussions..
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#73

Post by Onderhond » August 7th, 2020, 6:25 pm

mightysparks wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 6:01 pm
I do go back sometimes to read them fully but then time has passed and there doesn’t seem to be a good reason to reignite discussions..
One thing I realized this forum is missing is clear quote notifications. I know there's an alert-counter at the top, but that's about replies to topics you've posted in (which isn't necessarily to your own posts). Without that, quoting an old review or post feels like a gamble because the person might not even notice he's been quoted.

Could this be an option I'm missing? And if it is, I think it's a pretty bad default :)

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#74

Post by Harco » August 7th, 2020, 6:33 pm

Onderhond wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 6:25 pm
mightysparks wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 6:01 pm
I do go back sometimes to read them fully but then time has passed and there doesn’t seem to be a good reason to reignite discussions..
One thing I realized this forum is missing is clear quote notifications. I know there's an alert-counter at the top, but that's about replies to topics you've posted in (which isn't necessarily to your own posts). Without that, quoting an old review or post feels like a gamble because the person might not even notice he's been quoted.

Could this be an option I'm missing? And if it is, I think it's a pretty bad default :)
Mine also notifies me when I’m quoted:

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#75

Post by Onderhond » August 7th, 2020, 6:41 pm

Harco wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 6:33 pm
Mine also notifies me when I’m quoted:
It does that indeed, but because the signal-to-noise ratio is too high I stopped checking there.

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#76

Post by xianjiro » August 7th, 2020, 6:46 pm

Onderhond wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 6:25 pm
mightysparks wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 6:01 pm
I do go back sometimes to read them fully but then time has passed and there doesn’t seem to be a good reason to reignite discussions..
One thing I realized this forum is missing is clear quote notifications. I know there's an alert-counter at the top, but that's about replies to topics you've posted in (which isn't necessarily to your own posts). Without that, quoting an old review or post feels like a gamble because the person might not even notice he's been quoted.

Could this be an option I'm missing? And if it is, I think it's a pretty bad default :)
Yeah, I'm not really clear what you're looking for if it's not what @Harco posted. Unless it's being notified when one's nick is used (like I did with @Harco in the prior sentence) - and no, this doesn't have functionality on this forum though I don't know if that's a setting or functionality lacking in the software.

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#77

Post by Onderhond » August 7th, 2020, 8:20 pm

xianjiro wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 6:46 pm
Yeah, I'm not really clear what you're looking for if it's not what @Harco posted. Unless it's being notified when one's nick is used (like I did with @Harco in the prior sentence) - and no, this doesn't have functionality on this forum though I don't know if that's a setting or functionality lacking in the software.
No, but I want only notifications for the quotes, not every time posts a new message in a topic I posted in before. It makes the counter completely useless to me.

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#78

Post by Harco » August 7th, 2020, 8:27 pm

You can change the settings by clicking on the “Alerts” button and then pressing “Settings” in the gray header.
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#79

Post by Onderhond » August 7th, 2020, 8:39 pm

Harco wrote:
August 7th, 2020, 8:27 pm
You can change the settings by clicking on the “Alerts” button and then pressing “Settings” in the gray header.
Thanks a billion! That's exactly what I was looking for :)

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#80

Post by xianjiro » August 7th, 2020, 9:23 pm

Glad Harco got you there - had no idea what you were talking about, but clearly I already got rid of the dross as well by going to settings a long time ago.

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