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#19401

Post by Ebbywebby »

This year's ceremonies may get their smallest TV audience of all time. I've only seen a few of the above films, and the ones I've seen didn't grab me much. I'm thoroughly appalled by how much love the "Borat" sequel drew, though at least the buzz seemed to die out pretty fast.
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#19402

Post by kongs_speech »

Ebbywebby wrote: January 12th, 2021, 6:23 am This year's ceremonies may get their smallest TV audience of all time. I've only seen a few of the above films, and the ones I've seen didn't grab me much. I'm thoroughly appalled by how much love the "Borat" sequel drew, though at least the buzz seemed to die out pretty fast.
Not entirely. Maria Bakalova appears to be the frontrunner for Best Supporting Actress, a fact about which I am thrilled.
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#19403

Post by Ebbywebby »

I'm sure she'll have a long, spectacular career.
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#19404

Post by prodigalgodson »

^haha cold
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#19405

Post by brokenface »

Agree with plenty of those. Obviously a lot I haven't seen yet, but seems like Nomadland favourite. Probably strong favourite, given the ones I have seen that are touted as main rivals (Mank, Trial of Chicago 7, Ma Rainey) don't look like BP winners to me.

actually given those three and Da 5 Bloods are all Netflix, I think 1 or 2 of them will miss out on BP nomination just because of that. Don't see Oscars going quite so Netflix heavy. Suspect Da 5 Bloods will miss out (maybe put Spike in director and/or writing as compensation), and my sense is Mank could be one of those ones that does well in the production values categories and a few acting nods but not so much in the overall race. It kind of lacks narrative hook. Probably enough prestige behind it to make shortlist but not win.

Think Soul will get in Best Picture as Disney will have big push on it and that's the closest to a popular blockbuster of the competitors (seems like Tenet not likely, still not seen it), so I'd probably guess an 8 nom list of:

Nomadland
Ma Rainey's Black Bottom
Trial of the Chicago 7
Soul
The Father
One Night in Miami
Mank
Never Rarely Sometimes Always (probably between this and Minari as the little Indie)

Chadwick Boseman gotta be likely posthumous winner, and they may go for him + Viola Davis as Actor/Actress double for Ma Rainey. Sophia Loren nomination apparently quite likely too, first nomination since 1965, that's the kind of narrative Oscars love.
Good_Will_Harding wrote: January 11th, 2021, 11:34 pm Extremely early, rough Oscar predictions:
Spoiler
Best Picture

Da 5 Bloods
The Father
Ma Rainey's Black Bottom
Mank
Minari
News of the World
Nomadland
One Night in Miami
Sound of Metal
Trial of the Chicago 7

Best Director

David Fincher, Mank
Spike Lee, Da 5 Bloods
Regina King, One Night in Miami
Aaron Sorkin, Trial of the Chicago 7
Chloe Zhao, Nomadland

Best Actor

Riz Ahmed, Sound of Metal
Chadwick Boseman, Ma Rainey's Black Bottom
Anthony Hopkins, The Father
Delroy Lindo, Da 5 Bloods
Gary Oldman, Mank

Best Actress

Viola Davis, Ma Rainey's Black Bottom
Sidney Flanigan, Never Rarely Sometimes Always
Vanessa Kirby, Pieces of a Woman
Frances McDormand, Nomadland
Carey Mulligan, Promising Young Woman

Best Supporting Actor

Sacha Baron Cohen, The Trial of the Chicago 7
Chadwick Boseman, Da 5 Bloods
Leslie Odom Jr, One Night in Miami
Paul Raci, Sound of Metal
Mark Rylance, The Trial of the Chicago 7

Best Supporting Actress

Maria Bakalova, Borat Subsequent Moviefilm
Ellen Burstyn, Pieces of a Woman
Olivia Coleman, The Father
Yuh-Jung You, Minari
Amanda Seyfried, Mank

Best Adapted Screenplay

The Father
I'm Thinking of Ending Things
Ma Rainey's Black Bottom
Nomadland
One Night in Miami

Alt's - Borat Subsequent Moviefilm, News of the World

Best Original Screenplay (the hardest category to narrow down to five)

Da 5 Bloods
Mank
Minari
Never Rarely Sometimes Always
The Trial of the Chicago 7

Alt's - On the Rocks, Palm Springs, Soul, Sound of Metal

Best Animated Feature

Onward
Over the Moon
Soul
The Croods: A New Age
Wolfwalkers

Best International Film

A Sun
Another Round
Collective
La Llorna
True Mothers

Best Documentary Feature

76 Days
Boys State
Crip Camp
Dick Johnson is Dead
Time
Of course these could change very easily, but for now this is where I think the state of this very bizarre awards season is.
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#19406

Post by Onderhond »

sebby wrote: January 12th, 2021, 3:25 am Soul ... obvious winners. Nothing else stands out as leader-of-the-pack right now.
If one film stands out in the animation category it's Wolfwalkers, but no way the Academy voters are going to put much effort into that one. They'll just vote Pixar and call it a day. Soul's a decent Pixar, but would be a poor winner.
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#19407

Post by sebby »

Onderhond wrote: January 12th, 2021, 1:23 pm
sebby wrote: January 12th, 2021, 3:25 am Soul ... obvious winners. Nothing else stands out as leader-of-the-pack right now.
If one film stands out in the animation category it's Wolfwalkers, but no way the Academy voters are going to put much effort into that one. They'll just vote Pixar and call it a day. Soul's a decent Pixar, but would be a poor winner.
I just watched Wolfwalkers today. Not as good as Song of the Sea but still a tier ahead of the average Pixar. Haven't seen Soul yet but any Pixar that isn't a disaster is going to win. Animation category is among the worst this way. Even best picture will do something interesting now and then and let a film like moonlight win.
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#19408

Post by Onderhond »

sebby wrote: January 12th, 2021, 2:07 pm Animation category is among the worst this way. Even best picture will do something interesting now and then and let a film like moonlight win.
Ah, didn't really get you were speaking realistically (rather than based on quality). Because then I'm completely on board with your statement (for the animation category). You'd almost wish they'd just get rid of it, though there's one film every 10 years or so that does manage to beat a Pixar and at least it'll get some well-deserved attention that way.
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#19409

Post by kongs_speech »

Wolfwalkers is breathtaking. I did not enjoy Soul. However, I have no doubt that the Pixar film will kick Tomm Moore's ass even with Apple behind him. There's no accounting for quality, especially not in that category.
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#19410

Post by Knaldskalle »

I'm surprised that Tenet and Noland are absent from the talk so far. Is Tenet that bad? I haven't seen it and seem to have read very mixed reviews, but still... His name has some cachet in the industry.

[EDIT: Missed Brokenface mentioning Tenet, sorry.]
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#19411

Post by kongs_speech »

Tenet is pretty fantastic, but it somewhat polarized critics and faces a considerable backlash within the industry because Nolan forced it out into cinemas and ended up causing a ton of damage to the box office. I can't see it being recognized outside of tech categories.
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#19412

Post by OldAle1 »

Knaldskalle wrote: January 12th, 2021, 6:06 pm I'm surprised that Tenet and Noland are absent from the talk so far. Is Tenet that bad? I haven't seen it and seem to have read very mixed reviews, but still... His name has some cachet in the industry.

[EDIT: Missed Brokenface mentioning Tenet, sorry.]
I saw it a couple of weeks ago and liked it more than I expected to but... fairly mixed overall. HATED the look of it though - Nolan has gone full-on with the teal-orange color scheme and for me it's unremittingly ugly. Pretty solid acting overall and I found it entertaining enough to keep interested for most of the 2 1/2 hours, but it did start to get tiresome towards the end, which felt too obvious and safe to me. IMO not deserving of any awards recognition in any category except MAYBE music, which is in a Nolan-typical droning mode that I usually don't like much but worked well here. Of course given how few movies I've seen from the year who knows? Maybe all the other films that seem like they'll be better will all totally suck and it will end up one of my top 5 for the year 6 months from now - but I really doubt it.
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#19413

Post by outdoorcats »

IIRC, the only Nolan films to get a BP nom are Inception and Dunkirk. Tenet is similar to Inception, but isn't riding the same wave Inception was a decade ago. It should still do well in tech stuff, and score.

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#19414

Post by prodigalgodson »

OldAle1 wrote: January 12th, 2021, 6:15 pm I saw it a couple of weeks ago and liked it more than I expected to but... fairly mixed overall. HATED the look of it though - Nolan has gone full-on with the teal-orange color scheme and for me it's unremittingly ugly.
Hmm I thought it was his best-looking film by far, and don't remember an excess of that color combo...
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#19415

Post by OldAle1 »

prodigalgodson wrote: January 12th, 2021, 7:04 pm
OldAle1 wrote: January 12th, 2021, 6:15 pm I saw it a couple of weeks ago and liked it more than I expected to but... fairly mixed overall. HATED the look of it though - Nolan has gone full-on with the teal-orange color scheme and for me it's unremittingly ugly.
Hmm I thought it was his best-looking film by far, and don't remember an excess of that color combo...
Most people your age, I'd say you're just inured to it from the past 20 years or so of blockbusters and such - and video - but that's not really true for you. I dunno, maybe it's something I'm just especially prone to notice and be irritated by - for the record I think his last two films were quite ugly as well. But this one reminds me of Bay's Transformers films and all the early (pre-Wonder Woman) DCU films - just so heavily color-graded that it's impossible for me to not notice and pay attention to it at every moment. This shot is a good example - all blue, gray, and gold, and those colors predominate throughout the film, and it all looks very artificia, mutedl and dull to me.

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#19416

Post by Onderhond »

Maybe the level of color grading is similar to Bay's film, but the actual look is the polar opposite. I love it, but not Tenet, that one looked pretty plain/dull alright.
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#19417

Post by OldAle1 »

I think Bay's films are typically brighter and the colors often have something of a metallic look to them, and lots of effects like lens flares that are less common in Nolan, which I actually agree tends to look better, though I dislike the films for other reasons.
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#19418

Post by kongs_speech »

OldAle1 wrote: January 12th, 2021, 7:19 pm this one reminds me of Bay's Transformers films
Perhaps that's why I liked it so much. :D
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#19419

Post by Good_Will_Harding »

outdoorcats wrote: January 12th, 2021, 6:19 pm IIRC, the only Nolan films to get a BP nom are Inception and Dunkirk. Tenet is similar to Inception, but isn't riding the same wave Inception was a decade ago. It should still do well in tech stuff, and score.
Yeah, I think Tenet is a lock for a number of technical categories, least of all because it's one of the few blockbusters released last year that's received any sort of acclaim - and even by Nolan's standards the reception was more mixed-positive than universal. I expect it to fare as well as Interstellar did with Oscar nods; score, sound, visual effects, and cinematography or art direction for good measure. Could even win one or two, possibly.
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#19420

Post by prodigalgodson »

OldAle1 wrote: January 12th, 2021, 7:19 pm Most people your age, I'd say you're just inured to it from the past 20 years or so of blockbusters and such - and video - but that's not really true for you. I dunno, maybe it's something I'm just especially prone to notice and be irritated by - for the record I think his last two films were quite ugly as well. But this one reminds me of Bay's Transformers films and all the early (pre-Wonder Woman) DCU films - just so heavily color-graded that it's impossible for me to not notice and pay attention to it at every moment. This shot is a good example - all blue, gray, and gold, and those colors predominate throughout the film, and it all looks very artificial, muted and dull to me.
I know what you mean about that blue/orange color tone that's dominated the scene for the last decade plus, and I'm not crazy about it either, but I didn't think this was an egregious example of that. I also don't know why even things shot on film have come to have that artificial, muted digital look; I guess cuz they're all edited, color corrected, projected, etc. digitally. But yeah, technologies change, even quicker than tastes imo, and we're never gonna get the particular richness of color from the studio system color processes (probably!; Portrait of a Lady on Fire taught me to never say never with digital), any more than we're gonna hear the particular dustiness of early Wu Tang beats made with contemporary samplers and mixers. And you know me, I'm the first to cry a river about that.

Buuut I thought Tenet looked unusually lush in its processed, fashion-ad way, and showcased his most developed eye for composition so far.
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#19421

Post by weirdboy »

I wonder why the DC folks have done such a poor job compared to Marvel, given the huge head start they had with the successful Nolan Batman films. They keep making these expensive movies that nobody at all likes.
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#19422

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

weirdboy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 7:24 am I wonder why the DC folks have done such a poor job compared to Marvel, given the huge head start they had with the successful Nolan Batman films. They keep making these expensive movies that nobody at all likes.
Not true, there's a fanbase for DC films even if it's not as wide as Marvel.

There two fundamental reasons.
One is that Marvel is much more cookie cutter. They have a core formula from on high, and while directors can sometimes play around the edges like Waititi on the last Thor or Gunn on Guardians, there's strong core formulaic direction. DC took the route of hiring directors and letting them do their thing. There's still studio control, these are quarter billion productions after all, but for both good and bad it's more within film control than overarching control.

The second is that DC tried too hard to play catch up. DC's greatest missteps are Justice League and Suicide Squad, two attempts at mashing a bunch of threads together Avengers style before they're ready. Marvel came first and had the time to set things up with better build up. Also, the control in the first point makes Marvel films less interesting, but more cohesive.

Personally I'm glad for DCs approach, their films may be flawed, but they're interesting and unique on their own terms in ways no Marvel films except maybe the two Guardians films are. It's a shame the end result hasn't been better, but it has mostly been more than good enough.

Also, Snyder's films are heavily colour graded, but in entirely different ways, and for completely different reasons than Teal and orange Bay.
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#19423

Post by weirdboy »

Marvel came first and had the time to set things up
But this is not true at all. The Dark Knight and Iron Man were contemporaneous, and Dark Knight was by far more successful. I mean we are talking about a movie that made a billion dollars back when that was unheard of with the singular exception of Titanic.
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#19424

Post by Onderhond »

I don't follow them too closely, but from the outside it has always looked as if Marvel meticulously planned out everything in advance, whereas DC just did what looked like a good idea at the moment. Marvel also stuck to their plans whereas DC often changed direction after a movie got bad critiques or bombed.

Artistically both approaches proved to be failures imo, but financially Marvel's been the one everyone yearns for. But it's not just DC that's failing of course, other attempts at setting up cinematic universes haven't been all that successful either. I also don't think there's enough room for multiple Marvels to exist (*fingers crossed*).
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#19425

Post by funkybusiness »

Onderhond wrote: January 13th, 2021, 11:36 amother attempts at setting up cinematic universes
Film companies will stop at nothing to universify everything. I mean, there's a cinematic universe of Queen Elizabeth by Peter Morgan that by that random Hollywood word-association thing absorbed a film about the band Queen. "It's got somethin' to do with the Queen, make it all connected!" They've already retconned The Iron Lady. The next step is to... uuh... remake The Adventures of Priscilla? or, to bring this more on-topic to what you were talking about, do a prequel to The Crown about Winston Churchill, and somehow hook onto Herzog's Queen of the Desert but put Hugo Weaving into it as Drag Red Skull, and Pattinson as T.E. Batman of Arabia therefore connecting to both the Marvel and DC universes. And then Nicole Kidman would obviously be both Gertrude Bell and Grace Kelly, leading to slowly spinning off more royal franchises. The Romanovs are, without a doubt, inevitable fodder for Hollywood but I'll probably hold off on watching until they get to The Hohenzollerns.
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#19426

Post by kongs_speech »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 7:39 am Personally I'm glad for DCs approach, their films may be flawed, but they're interesting and unique on their own terms in ways no Marvel films except maybe the two Guardians films are. It's a shame the end result hasn't been better, but it has mostly been more than good enough.
I would agree with this. The only thing I have to add is that Wonder Woman 1984 is a much worse film than anything in the MCU, but at least it was given room to be its own thing. It turned out horribly, but I guess it's what Patty Jenkins wanted it to be. But then I think Snyder's director's cut of Batman v. Superman is one of the greatest films in the genre so far, which I'm aware is an unpopular opinion.
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#19427

Post by GruesomeTwosome »

kongs_speech wrote: January 13th, 2021, 12:41 pm
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 7:39 am Personally I'm glad for DCs approach, their films may be flawed, but they're interesting and unique on their own terms in ways no Marvel films except maybe the two Guardians films are. It's a shame the end result hasn't been better, but it has mostly been more than good enough.
I would agree with this. The only thing I have to add is that Wonder Woman 1984 is a much worse film than anything in the MCU, but at least it was given room to be its own thing. It turned out horribly, but I guess it's what Patty Jenkins wanted it to be. But then I think Snyder's director's cut of Batman v. Superman is one of the greatest films in the genre so far, which I'm aware is an unpopular opinion.
While it probably is unpopular overall, I've definitely heard a very vocal minority who sing the praises of that director's cut of Batman v Superman. Are you looking forward to the "Snyder Cut" of Justice League as well? Heh.
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#19428

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

weirdboy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 11:20 am
Marvel came first and had the time to set things up
But this is not true at all. The Dark Knight and Iron Man were contemporaneous, and Dark Knight was by far more successful. I mean we are talking about a movie that made a billion dollars back when that was unheard of with the singular exception of Titanic.
The three Batman films are their own thing, they aren't part of the "cinematic universe" stuff. DC, publicly, didn't consider doing a cinematic universe until after DKR, it starts with Superman. Iron Man was its own thing too, but it was folded into Marvel's MCU conception quite quickly, it was a stand alone trial balloon.
Onderhond wrote: January 13th, 2021, 11:36 am I don't follow them too closely, but from the outside it has always looked as if Marvel meticulously planned out everything in advance, whereas DC just did what looked like a good idea at the moment. Marvel also stuck to their plans whereas DC often changed direction after a movie got bad critiques or bombed.
Pretty much, although Marvel was not as meticulously planned at the beginning, but they coalesced on an overarching structure relatively quickly.
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#19429

Post by Onderhond »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 4:09 pm Pretty much, although Marvel was not as meticulously planned at the beginning, but they coalesced on an overarching structure relatively quickly.
Yeah, it would've been really visionary if they'd had all this in mind even before the first MCU film was released, but they seemed to be coming with broader release schedules pretty and stuck to it even when one of their newest releases wasn't lauded by critics/the audience. I never even saw that from DC, at least not one they actually kept to.
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#19430

Post by kongs_speech »

GruesomeTwosome wrote: January 13th, 2021, 3:00 pm
kongs_speech wrote: January 13th, 2021, 12:41 pm
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 7:39 am Personally I'm glad for DCs approach, their films may be flawed, but they're interesting and unique on their own terms in ways no Marvel films except maybe the two Guardians films are. It's a shame the end result hasn't been better, but it has mostly been more than good enough.
I would agree with this. The only thing I have to add is that Wonder Woman 1984 is a much worse film than anything in the MCU, but at least it was given room to be its own thing. It turned out horribly, but I guess it's what Patty Jenkins wanted it to be. But then I think Snyder's director's cut of Batman v. Superman is one of the greatest films in the genre so far, which I'm aware is an unpopular opinion.
While it probably is unpopular overall, I've definitely heard a very vocal minority who sing the praises of that director's cut of Batman v Superman. Are you looking forward to the "Snyder Cut" of Justice League as well? Heh.
Oh yeah, I'll be watching that the day it drops. The idea of a filmmaker as singular (love him or hate him) as Snyder having free reign with a massive budget and a four-hour runtime is exactly what I want.
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#19431

Post by weirdboy »

PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 4:09 pm
weirdboy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 11:20 am
Marvel came first and had the time to set things up
But this is not true at all. The Dark Knight and Iron Man were contemporaneous, and Dark Knight was by far more successful. I mean we are talking about a movie that made a billion dollars back when that was unheard of with the singular exception of Titanic.
The three Batman films are their own thing, they aren't part of the "cinematic universe" stuff. DC, publicly, didn't consider doing a cinematic universe until after DKR, it starts with Superman. Iron Man was its own thing too, but it was folded into Marvel's MCU conception quite quickly, it was a stand alone trial balloon.
That is what I mean, though. Maybe we are saying the same thing, but my point is the DC folks had exactly the same opportunity with Batman as Marvel folks did starting with Iron Man. The Marvel folks leveraged Iron Man into a cohesive universe encompassing all the characters and with a few notable exceptions just about every release since Iron Man has been a blockbuster for them, including stuff like Deadpool and Into the Spiderverse which were way outside the previously established bounds of successful theatrical releases based on superheroes. There is no reason at all that the DC folks could not have accomplished the same thing by leveraging the success of Batman, even while hiring directors with their own unique visions. But for whatever reason they just really suck at delivering something audiences enjoy.
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#19432

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

weirdboy wrote: January 14th, 2021, 12:50 am
PeacefulAnarchy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 4:09 pm
weirdboy wrote: January 13th, 2021, 11:20 am

But this is not true at all. The Dark Knight and Iron Man were contemporaneous, and Dark Knight was by far more successful. I mean we are talking about a movie that made a billion dollars back when that was unheard of with the singular exception of Titanic.
The three Batman films are their own thing, they aren't part of the "cinematic universe" stuff. DC, publicly, didn't consider doing a cinematic universe until after DKR, it starts with Superman. Iron Man was its own thing too, but it was folded into Marvel's MCU conception quite quickly, it was a stand alone trial balloon.
That is what I mean, though. Maybe we are saying the same thing, but my point is the DC folks had exactly the same opportunity with Batman as Marvel folks did starting with Iron Man. The Marvel folks leveraged Iron Man into a cohesive universe encompassing all the characters and with a few notable exceptions just about every release since Iron Man has been a blockbuster for them, including stuff like Deadpool and Into the Spiderverse which were way outside the previously established bounds of successful theatrical releases based on superheroes. There is no reason at all that the DC folks could not have accomplished the same thing by leveraging the success of Batman, even while hiring directors with their own unique visions. But for whatever reason they just really suck at delivering something audiences enjoy.
Yes, in the sense that they could have done something earlier, that's true. But they didn't. They didn't even try to do anything until around 2012 when marvel released the first Avengers film. So when I said Marvel came first, I mean they acted first and have been setting up the blueprint and DC's expanded universe was a direct response to Marvel's success.

Also neither Deadpool nor Spiderverse were Marvel productions. Deadpool was Fox (now in the Disney/Marvel fold) and Spiderverse is Sony (trying to keep their own separate rights to the characters as the live action Spiderman films have intersected with Marvel).
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#19433

Post by kongs_speech »

Shipping to the US is nearly as much as the item itself, but this limited edition of Irreversible from the UK's Indicator label is one of the easiest "shut up and take my money" purchases of all-time. Region B discs.

https://www.powerhousefilms.co.uk/colle ... ersible-le
Quartoxuma wrote: A deeply human, life-affirming disgusting check whore.
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Dolwphin
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#19434

Post by Dolwphin »

The negative consequences from the Democrats baseless impeachments keep growing. Now, it is time to "fix" the cultural historical record.

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Onderhond
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#19435

Post by Onderhond »

Dolwphin wrote: January 14th, 2021, 6:11 pm The negative consequences from the Democrats baseless impeachments keep growing. Now, it is time to "fix" the cultural historical record.
Based on a Macaulay Culkin tweet :D
Solid source, just the opinion of one guy.
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Pretentious Hipster
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#19436

Post by Pretentious Hipster »

https://www.oncinemastore.com/

Some of the most famous film-related people, especially the movie expert himself Gregg Turkington, are now offering their services of making personalized video messages.

I wanna get Axiom, the new Mister Movies, to make a message about the work of Bela Tarr.
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PeacefulAnarchy
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#19437

Post by PeacefulAnarchy »

Dolwphin wrote: January 14th, 2021, 6:11 pm The negative consequences from the Democrats baseless impeachments keep growing. Now, it is time to "fix" the cultural historical record.

If you want to talk about politics, take it to the politics thread, this post would be fine there. If you want to talk about people retroactively editing movies, like the previous edits to ET or Star Wars then this is fine here.
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Dolwphin
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#19438

Post by Dolwphin »

Trending on Twitter.

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Coryn
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#19439

Post by Coryn »

Can I watch Life of Pi (2012) before I have seen Pi (1998) or will I miss too much of the story ?
I saved Latin, what did you ever do ?
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brokenface
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#19440

Post by brokenface »

Coryn wrote: January 18th, 2021, 9:41 am Can I watch Life of Pi (2012) before I have seen Pi (1998) or will I miss too much of the story ?
You need to watch both Pi (1998) and American Pi (1999)
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