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RolandKirkSunglasses
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#2321

Post by RolandKirkSunglasses »

Coryn wrote: January 20th, 2021, 7:30 am Céline et Julie vont en bateau: Phantom Ladies Over Paris (1974)

I don't get it, I simply don't get it. French New Wave started out for me with some movies I simply didn't understand, I tried reading up about the genre and movement itself and quickly learned about what the directors were trying to do. I tried out two new ways of watching the movies, firstly reading up on what the movie is going to throw at me stylistically and the meanings behind certain scenes before I watch the movie and secondally doing all that after I watch it. None of both worked out.

I only scratched the surface of French New Wave but it might just be the movement I enjoy the least, or maybe even worse, don't enjoy at all.
Which other New Wave films have you seen?
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#2322

Post by kongs_speech »

French New Wave is my favorite movement in cinema and Celine and Julie is in my top 20, but I've heard plenty of people say they can't get into it.
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#2323

Post by Coryn »

The most famous ones, A bout de souffle, band a parte, l'argent (?), Alphaville, 400 blows, ...

The last one I actually liked but not for any new wave elements, more because of the coming of age aspect.

Alphaville I saw only recently. I'm all for experimenting but if you insert a voice every minute that makes me physically cringe i'm not going to enjoy the movie. It's interesting what the movies represent and I get the movement itself but it's simply something I don't enjoy and can't get into.
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#2324

Post by kongs_speech »

Coryn wrote: January 20th, 2021, 5:37 pm The most famous ones, A bout de souffle, band a parte, l'argent (?), Alphaville, 400 blows, ...

The last one I actually liked but not for any new wave elements, more because of the coming of age aspect.

Alphaville I saw only recently. I'm all for experimenting but if you insert a voice every minute that makes me physically cringe i'm not going to enjoy the movie. It's interesting what the movies represent and I get the movement itself but it's simply something I don't enjoy and can't get into.
I like it, but Alphaville is the "worst" Godard I've seen. That voice is the only time so far in his work that I've felt like he was trolling too much for his own good. The story is very compelling, but fuck that burp voice.
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#2325

Post by RolandKirkSunglasses »

You might like Agnes Varda. "La Pointe Courte" is a halfway-house between neorealism and new wave, her second film "Cleo from 5 to 7" is about a hypochondriac singer meeting up with her friends as she's waiting for test results from the doctor. Light and playful existentialism.

Chabrol and Rohmer aren't as experimental as Godard, Truffaut or Rivette. From Chabrol I'd recommend "Les Bonnes Femmes" from the early 60s, "This Man Must Die" and "Just Before Nightfall" from the late 60s/early 70s.

Rohmer is an acquired taste, he mainly films the disconnect between a character's words and their actions. if you can't stand the talkiness of "Claire's Knee" the colour cinematography might ease the viewing experience. "My Night at Maud's" has a bit of philosophy talk, his 80s and 90s films are more focused on younger people e.g. "Tale of Winter" , "Pauline at the Beach".
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#2326

Post by Coryn »

Varda isn't my cup of tea either but I'm definitelly going to give Chabrol and Rohmer a fair try. Thanks for the recommendations.
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#2327

Post by OldAle1 »

The French New Wave seems to me to be about as cohesive and coherent a movement as most other similarly-named New Waves (Japanese, Czech, American, German, etc, etc), which is to say, not really at all cohesive and coherent. Sure the five main dudes that everybody considers the key or core directors were all critics and friends together first, and their earliest films (as well as some of the early films of Left Bank directors like Varda, Resnais or Demy) share some similarities, but they all quickly moved off in different directions. So liking the work of one and not liking others is pretty normal I'd say, and if you don't like Rivette or Godard - the two most continuingly experimental, challenging and weird - in particular I would say don't let that stop you from going for the others. I like Chabrol and Truffaut a bit less than Rohmer, and Rohmer maybe a little less than Godard or Rivette, because I'm more interested in narrative invention than I am in Truffaut's autobiographical comedy-dramas or Chabrol's re-workings of HItchcockian themes, but I like all of them. Took me a while though - my first encounters were with Truffaut and Godard and they were quite mixed, and for me it wasn't until seeing my first couple of Rivette films 3-4 years later that I really started to click with this period of French filmmaking in general. In my case connecting strongly with that one filmmaker (who is still my favorite of the group) really helped me appreciate what all of them in their various ways were trying to do in that early late 50s-early 60s period, and see how each influenced the others and French film in general, which has all been a very enjoyable process. It also helped that I had a friend who was sort of "ahead" of me in his appreciation for some of this stuff, particularly Godard, and that I got to see many of them in the cinema, with like-minded people.
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#2328

Post by Coryn »

Very interesting take OldAle1, I'm definitely not going to stop watching the genre altogether anyway. I will still watch anything that is on a list and always with an open mind.
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#2329

Post by St. Gloede »

I think I have the reverse preferences from you, Coryn, and partially Kong too as "Alphaville" used to be my definitive Godard favourite and I still love it dearly. :D

Two quick points (which I really hope comes across as helpful rather than pedantic):

1. Celine and Julie is technically not a French New Wave film (at least by the mainstream understanding)

The movement is generally considered to have ended in 1964, 1967, 1971 or 1973, depending who is counting and what they want the movement/wave to represents. The ones who see it as a cool and hip shake-up of cinema that "conquered the streets", popularized jumpcuts and essentially revitalized cinema - often linking it to New Hollywood - set an early date - usually 64. Those who see it, as Rohmer put it, something in between avante grade and popular cinema tends to set '67 while those who see it as a Brecthian-infused attack on cinematic conventions, exploring what cinema can be, etc. set a later date.

*Though note, those who put it to '71 usually do it to incorporate Out 1, and those who set it to '73 usually want to incorporate The Mother and the Whore (and Eustache as a new wave filmmaker).


2. The French New Wave is not that much of a singular "movement"

The French New Wave were comprised by two "banks" - not the ones with cash stuffed in safes in a town in Texas or Oklahoma, but different banks the waves can wash over. These are the firm and obviously grouping of Cahier du Cinema directors, all critics, Godard, Truffaut, Rohmer, Rivette and Chabrol being the more famous, with less remembered names like Moullet, Kast, Rozier, etc. also taking part- and the "Left Bank" - which is not a firm grouping of filmmakers mainly included for the type of films they made. This group tends to include Varda, Resnais, Marker, Rouch, Demy and a mix of other arguable names.

The early days of the wave, especially from the Cahier du Cinema group were not particularly experimental or surreal. They were riffing a little of the cinematic strings, had jump cuts and felt fresh - but they were not experimental/avant garde, or even particularly close. They were audience friendly and many well. If we look at The 400 Blows, and the sequels, we actually have what, at least today, would seem like strong personal dramas with great directoral touches - rather than anything "out there". And this is also how many see the movement - though of course, Godard would start getting "out there" fairly quick.

By the mid-60s/early 70s however, a lot had happened.

Godard had abandoned any views of auteurs and joined a Maoist collective called the Dziga Vertov Group - starting in '68 - though he had become consistently alienating, experimental and political before this.

Truffaut went the other way entirely, entering the French mainstream at full steam ahead - meanwhile Chabrol (who made the first New Wave Film - at least from the main Cahiers timeline) had jumped off the train in favour of genre efforts already back in the early 60s.

Rohmer, older than all of them, and their mentor and editor, barely made films during the main period of the French New Wave - and served as editor until '67, releasing only 1 proper full-length film up to this point (Suzanne is 54 minutes long) - and then started sinking his teeth more thoroughly into his cycles - which are honestly more linked to literary tendencies - and was quite removed.

Leaving Rivette - who like Godard moved towards what you see in Celine and Julie - i.e. something closer to Avant-Garde than the mainstream, and toying with minimalism and surrealism.

Meanwhile on the left bank you had Demy who did popular musicals (from the beginning), Rouch who did weird/fun mockumentaries, often from Africa - including some weird dubbing - and then Varda, Resnai and Marker - who may be closer to your perception of the French New Wave - the former moving from something more restrained to personal essays - the middle moving from (IMO) incredible structural masterpieces, to something a bit more accessible - and the latter essentially continuing the same style of essays throughout his career.

*Bresson was not part of the new wave - he was a minimalist, and a director many in the new wave looked up to, but he started directing features during WW2 and os quite distinct from them.

-

So far you have only seen Godards, as well as 400 Blows (what did you think?). You may really like Truffaut's later work, and Chabrol is also fairly accessible. I think you can really pick and choose what sounds/looks good to you. Rohmer may win you over too - but acquired taste. I'd say Godard, Rivette, Rozier, etc. probably aren't for you - same with Resnais, Varda and Marker - but the others may work.
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#2330

Post by Coryn »

Really interesting Gloede, a lot of your top 100 movies are also favorites of mine so it's rather 'strange' that you're so into French New Wave (or that I am not).

400 Blows has been some time but I definitely liked the movie itself, as I said though mostly due to the coming of age aspect and I wouldnt label it French new wave if I didnt know Truffaut was considered part of the movement.

This got me thinking, I absolutely love Bunuel and he has a lot in common with what is considered French New Wave, say if he was French instead of Spanish-Mexican , would he be considered part of the movement ?
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#2331

Post by Onderhond »

Aren't most "New Waves" more connected to they elements they break with rather than the things they have in common? From what I've seen (Japanese, Taiwanese, French), it's more a sudden, youthful "breath of fresh air" that breaks with the old rather than a set of films that share common traits.

I'm definitely not too knowledgeable about the French Wave, but the films that identify as such are some of the better classics I've seen. Less plot, more atmosphere.
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#2332

Post by St. Gloede »

That's true actually, it is a little odd though I can easily see loving Bunuel while not connecting with Rivette, Godard, Varda, etc. While Godard and Bunuel are my two favourite filmmakers (and Varda is in my top 10) - and all 3 used some of the same actors - they are not coming from the same place. Bunuel was a surrealist, while Godard, Varda and essentially all the new wavers started from a perspective of cinematic form. That is to say, Bunuel cares about the surrealist words and visions he creates with cinematic tools - the new wavers cared about what cinematic tools do to film (if only something as basic as actually filming outside).

This is where Brechtianism comes into play - generally speaking the new wavers - especially the Cahiers directors - wanted you to know you were watching a film - and interact with it, think of it as a film. This is something I generally love, as the meta elements make cinema come alive in a different way for me - and I love directors who play with form. Bunuel, on the other hand, does not want you to think "I am watching a film - wow, that cut - that just breaks the cinematic conventions - amazing" he wants you to experience the visions/world's he creates for you. The former may be simplifying the Brechtian influences a bit much, and if you follow Varda into her personal essays they are far more warm with great storytelling - you really should try The Gleaners & I - it is very accessible.

It is also important to mention that even if they were coming from the same place, Bunuel would not have been allowed into the "club", as the French New Wave is not just a descriptor of new conventions but also a set of new filmmakers. Varda made her first film in '56 (La Pointe-Courte), Rouch in '57 (I, a Negro) - i.e. before '58 - starting with Serge is mainly a pro-Cahiers bias (possibly coupled with sexism - and the more fleeting, unofficial nature of the Left Bank). However, all of them made their first film in the late 50s/early 60s (Rohmer's The Sign of Leo was technically meant to be out in the 50s).

It is a bit easy to forget as besides his debut short and a few other films his 60s and 70s work is what is best remembered, but Bunuel had already been active for 27 years and made 20 features by the time La beau serge (the first new wave film) was released. Like Bresson, he is from a very different generation of filmmaker - and while their films could all be classified within the broader arthouse label - there are few overlaps. That said, Rivette certainly moved into surrealism (but of a far more minimalistic nature).
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#2333

Post by St. Gloede »

Onderhond wrote: January 20th, 2021, 9:11 pm Aren't most "New Waves" more connected to they elements they break with rather than the things they have in common? From what I've seen (Japanese, Taiwanese, French), it's more a sudden, youthful "breath of fresh air" that breaks with the old rather than a set of films that share common traits.

I'm definitely not too knowledgeable about the French Wave, but the fields that identify as such are some of the better classics I've seen. Less plot, more atmosphere.
That's a very good summary/explanation.
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#2334

Post by RolandKirkSunglasses »

The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp (1943): Since my last viewing I've seen so many criticisms of the film I wasn't sure it would hold up after all these years. Covering 40 years and 3 wars in Technicolor would've been ambitious in peace-time let alone war, especially with Churchill dead against the film. Considering the circumstances I think it's a very good film, propagandistic against the Nazis while satirising the stuffy English Gentleman along with the British Army. Roger Livesey puts in the performance of his life from Lieutenant Candy in the Boer War to Major General Clive Wynne-Candy in World War 2, he's a caricature of an idealistic, pompous Englishman but sympathise with his realisation near the end. Anton Walbrook is excellent as Theo Kretschmar-Schuldorff, he gets the best monologues in the film. Deborah Kerr doesn't have much to work with in any of her 3 roles, the romantic angle of the story doesn't convince; her meatiest role as Edith Hunter shares more screentime with Clive than with Theo, why she'd marry the latter isn't all that convincing. As Barbara and Johnny her characters become less significant, Clive and Barbara spend so little time together his promise to "never change" isn't as moving as Powell and Pressburger think it should be.

Despite being uneven in places with a jarring soundtrack it gets stronger to wards the end. Very good with moments of brilliance. I like it more than "Matter of Life & Death" and "The Red Shoes", not as great as "Black Narcissus".
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#2335

Post by maxwelldeux »

Dancer in the Dark

How did I not know about this film? The US scenes/setting are 30m from me (like the directions to the city where it's set/filmed (US exterior shots) are "drive north from my house, when you hit the highway turn right, stop in ~25m when you hit the town". And the prison where she was sent and where the exterior prison shots were filmed? My grandma worked there until she retired.

Anyway, that was a fun connection, even though I know most of it was filmed in Sweden. I enjoyed the film - last half was better than the first half, but I didn't connect with it too much, and I largely blame Bjork for that. But an interesting experience and glad I watched.
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#2336

Post by Ivan0716 »

This week, an unexpected thing happened: I have a new favourite film.

After 11 years of film-tracking and list-making, I've all but accepted Once Upon a Time in the West to forever be my undisputed favourite film of all time. It was the film that opened my eyes to the possibilities of cinema, so I had always imagined that—be it gratitude or nostalgia—it will hold that distinction in my heart, and on my lists, until the end of time. That is, until this weekend, when I watched The Double Life of Veronique for the fourth time.

It's a film that I've always connected with deeply, ever since I first saw it as a teenager. Despite having no idea what I had just seen, I loved it so much that I immediately declared it one of my top 10 films of all time. I've watched it twice more in the decade since, loving it more each time, even though it didn't get any less enigmatic. It had always bothered me that I could never describe my love for the film beyond: "It's such a beautiful film.". It IS a beautiful film, in every sense of the word, but there's got to be more to it, what is it? The emotions it stirs? But I can't even pinpoint what those emotions are. Sadness? Melancholy? Maybe, but I know those, and this feels somewhat different.

I don't really know why I decided to rewatch it this weekend, I guess I just needed to look at something beautiful for a change. Well, I'm glad I did, because this time it hit me harder than it ever did before. In fact, it hit me harder than I thought any film ever could.

There are films I have watched at certain points of my life and it just felt uncanny in the way that it is able to perfectly capture what I'm going through at that exact moment. The most recent example was Kogonada's Columbus,
in which I was able to resonate with both main characters in a capacity that I, as a rule, find it impossible to do with fictional characters, but I did, and because of that every exchange in the film felt ethereal, as though I'm having the same dialogues inside my head, with myself.

There are also films like Tarkovsky's Mirror, with the ability to invoke memories and experiences so personal, so internal that it feels almost criminal for someone to have this much power over their audience.

The Double Life of Veronique isn't quite like those, I don't see myself in Veronique, and I don't see Veronique in me. It's different, there's a connection, but it doesn't make me analyse myself, doesn't make me reflect. It doesn't provoke, it's neutral, it just understood, it's just there.

I don't think it will ever be truly possible, but I believe this is the closest I've gotten to understanding why this film has always had such an inexplicable, profound effect on me: Veronique is the personification of my emotions. No, not in the sense that her character is a symbol for any particular emotion. No, they're MY emotions—emotions that are unique to me, emotions that no one else could ever be aware of, emotions that are so abstract even to myself—projected on the screen.

I suppose that would explain why I've had so much trouble describing the emotions I feel watching this film: there are no words for them, because they are mine and no one elses, because it cannot be communicated, and no one will ever truly understand them, not Krzysztof Kieślowski, not even myself. Yet somehow they are there, on the screen, speaking to me.

Yes, I know that's a lot of words just to say that I STILL don't have a fucking clue what this film is about, but I have a new favourite film, which I didn't think was possible, and right now I've never been more grateful that a film exists.
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#2337

Post by OldAle1 »

Great personal reflection Ivan! I love this kind of writing, and there isn't enough of it here (or elsewhere) - what, after all, makes a favorite film but our passion and how it strikes us on some deep inner level, which can and maybe should be very difficult to describe. What makes my favorite films my favorites is pretty closely related to what makes me me, and even the people who know me best can't entirely understand that, or understand why, in my case, a silly recent musical romance hits me so hard. But it's always fun to try and dissect these things and read others' dissections, even if we can't ever pierce the depths of each other.

As to Veronique I last saw it when it was new in the cinema, so it's been a while - and in fact, I last saw all of Kieslowski's films when they were new in cinema (except the pre-Dekalog ones, which I saw around the same time, early 90s or so). He's one of those guys I've been meaning to revisit but you know how it goes. Reading comments like yours can help to put films and filmmakers back on the radar though so... maybe sooner than later?

Excellent stuff.
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#2338

Post by St. Gloede »

Lovely writeup, Ivan!

I was wondering, not while reading, but shortly after (while contemplating whether the reasoning behind my personal pick is either less personal, or more revealing) - do you think something changed for you in changing your favourite?

That is, as the pabtheon shifted, are you seeing films through a slightly different lense?

I am asking as your two favourites (I personally prefer Once Upon a Time in the West, but too long since I saw either, might flip for me too) seem so different. Did Once Upon a Time in the West appeal to you for similar personal reason, or was this a shift from living something for the craft and style (which is what Leone is so known for) to loving something for speaking to a deep part of yourself? If that is the case, do you think something has changed in terms of your preferences and what you look for in film?
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#2339

Post by Ebbywebby »

Hard to see that scene with Irene Jacob singing in the rain and not fall in love. ;)
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#2340

Post by pitchorneirda »

I've just watched Jaws for the first time. The first in ten Spielbergs I like more than vaguely ("Catch me if you can" wasn't bad).

Moreover, if you replace the shark by the Covid-19, it makes a timely and pertinent study of human behaviour in the face of danger and the unknown.
"Art is like a fire, it is born from the very thing it burns" - Jean-Luc Godard
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#2341

Post by blocho »

A new Jon Bois video dropped. It's become a rare thing. Other than me and beasterne, I'm guessing nobody cares. But I love this stuff:

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#2342

Post by RolandKirkSunglasses »

The Night of the Hunter (1955): Had some reservations about it the first time I saw it 10 years or so ago, great looking but uneven were my feelings back then. Rewatching it on blu-ray amplifies the beauty of the cinematography while magnifying the flaws in the story and character motivations. The first half of the film is quite decent, Robert Mitchum makes a good villain using his Preacher as a cover for his criminality, winning over everyone with his charisma as he marries his way closer to the $10,000. The heavy-handed dialogue grates after a while and some of the plot contrivances grow larger, the moment The Preacher starts chasing them in the basement it descends into silliness, not even Lillian Gish's much-needed appearance in the second half improves it.

I don't have any complaints with the cinematography, it has some beautiful artistic shots reminiscent of German expressionism, if it wasn't for the intrusive soundtrack such as the blaring leitmotif everytime The Preacher turns up the film could've passed as a silent flick. Some of the acting isn't great either, I can excuse the child actors (John's first reaction to his father's arrest was unintentionally funny) but Shelley Winters is too bland for words. Robert Mitchum is good for the most part, it's only when The Preacher is chasing the kids he turns into a cartoon character: getting his fingers caught in the door, squealing when they slowly float away in the boat, after Rachel shoots at him he yowls and skedaddles away like it's a Tom & Jerry cartoon, too many goofy moments like that spoils his mystique as an intimidating villain.

Which leads me onto the screenplay. The initial plot of Harry Powell insinuating himself into the widow's family life looks convincing because everyone else in the town are written as super gullible to the point it stretches credulity. I can almost understand Willa wanting to remarry so quickly after her husband's execution but her reaction to Harry interrogating Pearl was risible. Uncle Birdie not telling anyone about the body at the bottom of the shallow lake because he's a drunk is too convenient. Everyone's so taken with The Preacher that his story of Willa disappearing without taking her kids is readily accepted. Even after he's chased them all the way to Rachel's house and turns up at the porch Pearl can still absent-mindedly run up to him and drop her doll, it allowed Rachel to pull her shotgun on Harry I guess. The most incredulous moment of the film is
Spoiler
John breaking down when The Preacher gets arrested. Not only do we have to witness his lousy line-reading "No", he feels sympathy for the guy who murdered his mother, threatened him and his little sister, chased them the entire movie, just because he needs a father figure and because it ties in to some naive notion of kids being better than adults? :facepalm: Sorry, ain't buying it.
I don't see it as a grand study of good versus evil or some kind of morality play, I see it as a decent noir with lots of experimentation which doesn't always "come off" in my opinion, lots of nice ideas but some poor execution makes it a disappointing watch for me.
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#2343

Post by cinewest »

Ivan0716 wrote: February 8th, 2021, 6:50 pm This week, an unexpected thing happened: I have a new favourite film.

After 11 years of film-tracking and list-making, I've all but accepted Once Upon a Time in the West to forever be my undisputed favourite film of all time. It was the film that opened my eyes to the possibilities of cinema, so I had always imagined that—be it gratitude or nostalgia—it will hold that distinction in my heart, and on my lists, until the end of time. That is, until this weekend, when I watched The Double Life of Veronique for the fourth time.

It's a film that I've always connected with deeply, ever since I first saw it as a teenager. Despite having no idea what I had just seen, I loved it so much that I immediately declared it one of my top 10 films of all time. I've watched it twice more in the decade since, loving it more each time, even though it didn't get any less enigmatic. It had always bothered me that I could never describe my love for the film beyond: "It's such a beautiful film.". It IS a beautiful film, in every sense of the word, but there's got to be more to it, what is it? The emotions it stirs? But I can't even pinpoint what those emotions are. Sadness? Melancholy? Maybe, but I know those, and this feels somewhat different.

I don't really know why I decided to rewatch it this weekend, I guess I just needed to look at something beautiful for a change. Well, I'm glad I did, because this time it hit me harder than it ever did before. In fact, it hit me harder than I thought any film ever could.

There are films I have watched at certain points of my life and it just felt uncanny in the way that it is able to perfectly capture what I'm going through at that exact moment. The most recent example was Kogonada's Columbus,
in which I was able to resonate with both main characters in a capacity that I, as a rule, find it impossible to do with fictional characters, but I did, and because of that every exchange in the film felt ethereal, as though I'm having the same dialogues inside my head, with myself.

There are also films like Tarkovsky's Mirror, with the ability to invoke memories and experiences so personal, so internal that it feels almost criminal for someone to have this much power over their audience.

The Double Life of Veronique isn't quite like those, I don't see myself in Veronique, and I don't see Veronique in me. It's different, there's a connection, but it doesn't make me analyse myself, doesn't make me reflect. It doesn't provoke, it's neutral, it just understood, it's just there.

I don't think it will ever be truly possible, but I believe this is the closest I've gotten to understanding why this film has always had such an inexplicable, profound effect on me: Veronique is the personification of my emotions. No, not in the sense that her character is a symbol for any particular emotion. No, they're MY emotions—emotions that are unique to me, emotions that no one else could ever be aware of, emotions that are so abstract even to myself—projected on the screen.

I suppose that would explain why I've had so much trouble describing the emotions I feel watching this film: there are no words for them, because they are mine and no one elses, because it cannot be communicated, and no one will ever truly understand them, not Krzysztof Kieślowski, not even myself. Yet somehow they are there, on the screen, speaking to me.

Yes, I know that's a lot of words just to say that I STILL don't have a fucking clue what this film is about, but I have a new favourite film, which I didn't think was possible, and right now I've never been more grateful that a film exists.
Though I am not a big fan of Leone, or Once Upon A Time in the West (it continued to drop in my estimation the last time I saw it- about a month ago, and I prefer something like McCabe & Mrs. Miller, or even Dead Man), I absolutely love Double Life of Veronique, and agree that it is the emotional connection I make with a film (or it makes with me) that influences me more than anything.
It’s not just the story, or what the film is about, but the way it transmits: the way the entire cinematic soundscape works to deliver an experience, as well as creates the quality of that experience by employing certain techniques and tapping particular sensibilities.

If there is one thing Leone and Kieslowski share in common it is in their evocative use of music. That I personally find Leone too cheesy and cartoonish for my taste is another matter (I can appreciate him more as a Tarantino type post modernist / deconstructionist).

Kieslowski made another film (Blue) that I consider even a little better than Veronique (though I like DLV more), but both are among my top 10 of the 90’s and top 100 all time
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#2344

Post by kongs_speech »

I hate Bringing Up Baby. I'm sorry, I just can't. It has been a genuinely painful experience for me. I'm shocked that it's "the greatest comedy ever" and not a completely forgotten thing that hasn't been seen since VHS.
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kongs_speech wrote: February 27th, 2021, 11:10 pm I hate Bringing Up Baby. I'm sorry, I just can't. It has been a genuinely painful experience for me. I'm shocked that it's "the greatest comedy ever" and not a completely forgotten thing that hasn't been seen since VHS.
It has been a film that people have argued over as long as I remember knowing anything about film, so you are not alone - nor are those who love it, like me. In truth it's been a long time since I've seen it now, and I always wonder with films like this whether I'll shift to the "other side" but I tend to doubt it; I've never liked a Howard Hawks film less on a revisit, and the four comedies in a row he made starting with that one are all pretty strong favorites.
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Post by kongs_speech »

OldAle1 wrote: February 27th, 2021, 11:21 pm
kongs_speech wrote: February 27th, 2021, 11:10 pm I hate Bringing Up Baby. I'm sorry, I just can't. It has been a genuinely painful experience for me. I'm shocked that it's "the greatest comedy ever" and not a completely forgotten thing that hasn't been seen since VHS.
It has been a film that people have argued over as long as I remember knowing anything about film, so you are not alone - nor are those who love it, like me. In truth it's been a long time since I've seen it now, and I always wonder with films like this whether I'll shift to the "other side" but I tend to doubt it; I've never liked a Howard Hawks film less on a revisit, and the four comedies in a row he made starting with that one are all pretty strong favorites.
I saw Ball of Fire earlier this week and I found it to be nearly perfect, so I feel strange that this one struck me as so unpleasant.
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Post by prodigalgodson »

One of the best and funniest movies ever made imo
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#2348

Post by maxwelldeux »

kongs_speech wrote: February 27th, 2021, 11:31 pm
OldAle1 wrote: February 27th, 2021, 11:21 pm
kongs_speech wrote: February 27th, 2021, 11:10 pm I hate Bringing Up Baby. I'm sorry, I just can't. It has been a genuinely painful experience for me. I'm shocked that it's "the greatest comedy ever" and not a completely forgotten thing that hasn't been seen since VHS.
It has been a film that people have argued over as long as I remember knowing anything about film, so you are not alone - nor are those who love it, like me. In truth it's been a long time since I've seen it now, and I always wonder with films like this whether I'll shift to the "other side" but I tend to doubt it; I've never liked a Howard Hawks film less on a revisit, and the four comedies in a row he made starting with that one are all pretty strong favorites.
I saw Ball of Fire earlier this week and I found it to be nearly perfect, so I feel strange that this one struck me as so unpleasant.
I'm with Kong. Saw it, didn't like it, Wife started watching it a few months ago and I just... couldn't.
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Post by galimx »

Continuing with my Sion Sono streak...

My list ranking with Sion Sono.
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#2350

Post by peeptoad »

Pride 2014
I thoroughly enjoyed this and it left me in a fantastic mood, plus I got to hear some of my favorite tunes from middle school that I hadn't heard in ages... haven't even thought about King or Dead or Alive in about 3 decades.
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#2351

Post by kongs_speech »

Calling Enormous a pile of shit would be an insult to anything that was ever pushed out of an anus. Brainless misogynistic filth -- written and directed by a woman, no less. That depresses me, as does the fact that Cahiers put it in their top 10 of last year.
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Post by Onderhond »

Just watched Brooklyn.

Ronan gives a great performance and the film tries to sell itself as a sweet little drama/romance. Just looking at the bare facts though, Ronan's character's a bit of a cunt. It didn't really bother me, but it felt odd that the film doesn't even care to acknowledge that.
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kongs_speech wrote: March 26th, 2021, 8:50 pm Calling Enormous a pile of shit would be an insult to anything that was ever pushed out of an anus. Brainless misogynistic filth -- written and directed by a woman, no less. That depresses me, as does the fact that Cahiers put it in their top 10 of last year.
I guess you're talking about THIS film? I came across it somewhere recently and just ignored it - regardless of the particular politics and gender issues of the film, mainstream French comedies of the last, oh, 20-30 years have so rarely worked for me that I just don't give them a second look unless there's a good reason (star, director, great review from someone I trust, etc). This really does look bad though.
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Post by kongs_speech »

OldAle1 wrote: March 26th, 2021, 9:25 pm
kongs_speech wrote: March 26th, 2021, 8:50 pm Calling Enormous a pile of shit would be an insult to anything that was ever pushed out of an anus. Brainless misogynistic filth -- written and directed by a woman, no less. That depresses me, as does the fact that Cahiers put it in their top 10 of last year.
I guess you're talking about THIS film? I came across it somewhere recently and just ignored it - regardless of the particular politics and gender issues of the film, mainstream French comedies of the last, oh, 20-30 years have so rarely worked for me that I just don't give them a second look unless there's a good reason (star, director, great review from someone I trust, etc). This really does look bad though.
Yeah, that's the one. It's appalling. Even if someone isn't put off from a feminist perspective, I think they'd likely still find it to be a poor film. Excruciatingly unfunny.
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Post by joachimt »

kongs_speech wrote: March 26th, 2021, 9:48 pm
OldAle1 wrote: March 26th, 2021, 9:25 pm
kongs_speech wrote: March 26th, 2021, 8:50 pm Calling Enormous a pile of shit would be an insult to anything that was ever pushed out of an anus. Brainless misogynistic filth -- written and directed by a woman, no less. That depresses me, as does the fact that Cahiers put it in their top 10 of last year.
I guess you're talking about THIS film? I came across it somewhere recently and just ignored it - regardless of the particular politics and gender issues of the film, mainstream French comedies of the last, oh, 20-30 years have so rarely worked for me that I just don't give them a second look unless there's a good reason (star, director, great review from someone I trust, etc). This really does look bad though.
Yeah, that's the one. It's appalling. Even if someone isn't put off from a feminist perspective, I think they'd likely still find it to be a poor film. Excruciatingly unfunny.
It could have been worse....... if it was made in Hollywood with Adam Sandler and Jennifer Aniston.
But apart from that I totally agree with you. Horrendous movie! :yucky:
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Jaane Bhi Do Yaaro
I think this is the worst film I've ever seen from iCM's Most Favorited list. It's #22 on the Indian list on IMDb. That should have been a warning. From the first minute all the characters annoy me. The jokes are ...... not really jokes in my eyes. It's just some silly faces, stupid stuff, blablabla. Story is a mess. And then over two hours long of course, because it's from India. :yucky:
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Post by kongs_speech »

joachimt wrote: April 1st, 2021, 6:35 pm Jaane Bhi Do Yaaro
I think this is the worst film I've ever seen from iCM's Most Favorited list. It's #22 on the Indian list on IMDb. That should have been a warning. From the first minute all the characters annoy me. The jokes are ...... not really jokes in my eyes. It's just some silly faces, stupid stuff, blablabla. Story is a mess. And then over two hours long of course, because it's from India. :yucky:
I'm on a Satyajit Ray kick at the moment -- actual classic Indian cinema -- but this Bollywood crap is extremely low on official check priorities for all the reasons you mentioned.
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kongs_speech wrote: April 1st, 2021, 6:41 pm
joachimt wrote: April 1st, 2021, 6:35 pm Jaane Bhi Do Yaaro
I think this is the worst film I've ever seen from iCM's Most Favorited list. It's #22 on the Indian list on IMDb. That should have been a warning. From the first minute all the characters annoy me. The jokes are ...... not really jokes in my eyes. It's just some silly faces, stupid stuff, blablabla. Story is a mess. And then over two hours long of course, because it's from India. :yucky:
I'm on a Satyajit Ray kick at the moment -- actual classic Indian cinema -- but this Bollywood crap is extremely low on official check priorities for all the reasons you mentioned.
I've generally done well with Bollywood - but more often than not it's not the films that are high on the IMDb lists, most voted, etc. It's a tricky area of exploration for sure, even for somebody who doesn't mind musicals or 3 hour films.
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Post by joachimt »

This one wasn't even a musical.
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#2360

Post by Red7 »

I saw August in the Water again, which still doesn't quite hit what I think it's aiming for, but does have some really beautiful moments - the "I'm not scared about the boundaries anymore" monologue is really nice.
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